MadCards Training Camp Observations Friday 7/26

[MadCardDisease]

Decided to go to Training camp today to see what all of the buzz was about. Will try and summarize everything here.

I was keying on the offense (Mostly QBs and WRs) so here are some individual observations of the Offensive players:

QB:
Kyler Murray -

• Impressed me right off the bat. Seems to have a real grasp of the offense and was directing people on where they needed to be.
• Super quick throwing motion
• Can really zing the ball and puts it in tight locations with very good accuracy.
• Had several great passes that had the crowd very excited.
• Didn't see him tuck and run so I can comment on that aspect of his game
• Overall I came away impressed! Add me to the Murray Bandwagon!

WR:
Larry Fitz -

• Running with the Ones. DUH!
• Still making catches like only Larry can!
• Saw him mentoring Hakeem Butler on a couple of occasions.
• Already seems to have a connection with Murray
• Looks like he is still having fun out there

Kirk -

• Running with the Ones. Duh!
• Looks healthy and fast out there.
• Had a nice over the head catch on a bomb from Murray

KeeSean Johnson -

• I felt he was a steal in this years draft
• Looks to be running with the Ones already in 4 wide formations
• Ran a great route on PP and caught a perfect pass from Murray for a 20 yard gain
• I think he will put up the most yards of the three rookies drafted at least this year
• He looks the most ready to play of all the rookie WRs

Damiere Byrd -

• Appears to be currently running with the Ones
• Looks solid but wasn't really keying on him
• Saw him on Kick Return
• I would currently put him in the top 7 WRs

Kevin White -

• Appears to be running with the Twos
• A lot bigger than I realized. Looks about the same size as Fitz but with speed.
• I saw him make a really nice catch today
• I would currently put him in the top 7 WRs

Andy Isabella -

• Appears to be running with the Twos
• Looks very short but compact
• His legs move so fast when he runs it almost looks cartoonish
• Saw him returning kicks
• I would currently put him in the top 7 WRs

Hakeem Butler -

• Appears to be running with the Twos
• This kid is lengthy! His wing span is enormous. Could be a major Red Zone threat.
• Still a little raw but he showed flashes.
• I would currently put him in the top 7 WRs

Chad Williams -

• His routes were unimpressive.
• He dropped a ball that went right through his hands.
• I would guess he is on the outside looking in

Cooper and Sherfield -

• Looked OK but would need to have a stellar camp to knock one of the rookies or possibly White off the roster.

Here are some of my other notes from this practice:

• Suggs looks like a Monster!
• Suggs and Chandler Jones were always together. Looks like they have a close bond already
• Chandler Jones is a great guy. he always interacts with the crowd at Training camp.
• Vincent Valentine went down with some sort of a knee injury and was helped off the field. Scott Bordow incorrectly said that it was Corey Peters.
• Guys who were returning kicks: Byrd, Cooper, Logan, Kirk, Isabella
• Peterson was on all of the WRs like Glue. Except for one play where KeeSean ran a great route and made a nice catch.
• I thought that Alford looked solid opposite of Peterson
• Murray really seems to be respected by both the Offensive and Defensive players.
• KK spent most of his time with the QBs when they broke into position groups
• Today they were always in a single RB set with either 4Wide or 3Wide and a TE.
• I'd say they ran the ball about a third of the plays today.
• David Johnson and Edmonds both looked fluid running the ball
• Recognized the "Mesh" play a few times. Looked like the WRs would high five each other as they "Meshed" if that makes sense.
• I thought the practice looked really smooth and a lot was accomplished in the 2 hours and 30 minutes I was there watching.

 

[MadCardDisease]

here is a simple diagram of a Mesh play for those of you who are wondering. It's basically when the two inside WRs cross or "Mesh":

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[blindseyed]

Thanx MadCard nice summary!

 

[MadCardDisease]

Also note that if anyone is planning on going to training camp this weekend make sure you post your observations!

Also note that I10 West is closed this weekend from 35th to 43rd Ave. So plan accordingly!

 

[blindseyed]

I'm not going for a few weeks to let it die down a bit

 

[Dback Jon]

Thanks for that

 

[CardNots]

Decided to go to Training camp today to see what all of the buzz was about. Will try and summarize everything here.

I was keying on the offense (Mostly QBs and WRs) so here are some individual observations of the Offensive players:

QB:
Kyler Murray -

• Impressed me right off the bat. Seems to have a real grasp of the offense and was directing people on where they needed to be.
• Super quick throwing motion
• Can really zing the ball and puts it in tight locations with very good accuracy.
• Had several great passes that had the crowd very excited.
• Didn't see him tuck and run so I can comment on that aspect of his game
• Overall I came away impressed! Add me to the Murray Bandwagon!

WR:
Larry Fitz -

• Running with the Ones. DUH!
• Still making catches like only Larry can!
• Saw him mentoring Hakeem Butler on a couple of occasions.
• Already seems to have a connection with Murray
• Looks like he is still having fun out there

Kirk -

• Running with the Ones. Duh!
• Looks healthy and fast out there.
• Had a nice over the head catch on a bomb from Murray

KeeSean Johnson -

• I felt he was a steal in this years draft
• Looks to be running with the Ones already in 4 wide formations
• Ran a great route on PP and caught a perfect pass from Murray for a 20 yard gain
• I think he will put up the most yards of the three rookies drafted at least this year
• He looks the most ready to play of all the rookie WRs

Damiere Byrd -

• Appears to be currently running with the Ones
• Looks solid but wasn't really keying on him
• Saw him on Kick Return
• I would currently put him in the top 7 WRs

Kevin White -

• Appears to be running with the Twos
• A lot bigger than I realized. Looks about the same size as Fitz but with speed.
• I saw him make a really nice catch today
• I would currently put him in the top 7 WRs

Andy Isabella -

• Appears to be running with the Twos
• Looks very short but compact
• His legs move so fast when he runs it almost looks cartoonish
• Saw him returning kicks
• I would currently put him in the top 7 WRs

Hakeem Butler -

• Appears to be running with the Twos
• This kid is lengthy! His wing span is enormous. Could be a major Red Zone threat.
• Still a little raw but he showed flashes.
• I would currently put him in the top 7 WRs

Chad Williams -

• His routes were unimpressive.
• He dropped a ball that went right through his hands.
• I would guess he is on the outside looking in

Cooper and Sherfield -

• Looked OK but would need to have a stellar camp to knock one of the rookies or possibly White off the roster.

Here are some of my other notes from this practice:

• Suggs looks like a Monster!
• Suggs and Chandler Jones were always together. Looks like they have a close bond already
• Chandler Jones is a great guy. he always interacts with the crowd at Training camp.
• Vincent Valentine went down with some sort of a knee injury and was helped off the field. Scott Bordow incorrectly said that it was Corey Peters.
• Guys who were returning kicks: Byrd, Cooper, Logan, Kirk, Isabella
• Peterson was on all of the WRs like Glue. Except for one play where KeeSean ran a great route and made a nice catch.
• I thought that Alford looked solid opposite of Peterson
• Murray really seems to be respected by both the Offensive and Defensive players.
• KK spent most of his time with the QBs when they broke into position groups
• Today they were always in a single RB set with either 4Wide or 3Wide and a TE.
• I'd say they ran the ball about a third of the plays today.
• David Johnson and Edmonds both looked fluid running the ball
• Recognized the "Mesh" play a few times. Looked like the WRs would high five each other as they "Meshed" if that makes sense.
• I thought the practice looked really smooth and a lot was accomplished in the 2 hours and 30 minutes I was there watching.

Solid effort, most appreciated!!!!!!!

 

[MadCardDisease]

I'm not going for a few weeks to let it die down a bit

Once all of the kids are back in school it dies down a lot

 

[slanidrac16]

Thanks MCD!

 

[Garthshort]

MadCard, much appreciated.

 

[Ronin]

Nice work @MadCardDisease

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Thanks

 

[Shane]

Thank ya

 

[JeffGollin]

Mucho obligato.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Just wondering if anyone is still preferring Rosen over Murray. Not being sarcastic. Just really wondering.

Seems like a lot of people are getting on the bandwagon. Of course, it helps when your rookie QB knows the offense better than anyone else on the team. It puts him in the leadership role immediately.

 

[Solar7]

Just wondering if anyone is still preferring Rosen over Murray. Not being sarcastic. Just really wondering.

Seems like a lot of people are getting on the bandwagon. Of course, it helps when your rookie QB knows the offense better than anyone else on the team. It puts him in the leadership role immediately.

For me, this was never about Rosen vs. Murray, but about the cost associated. I liked Josh and accept we're moving forward with Kyler, but it's going to take a lot to compensate for what we gave up.

 

[schutd]

For me, this was never about Rosen vs. Murray, but about the cost associated. I liked Josh and accept we're moving forward with Kyler, but it's going to take a lot to compensate for what we gave up.

How are you ever going to be able to accurately compare if what he gives us is comparable to what we gave up? Are you going to hypothesize the players we would have drafted with all those picks, watch them play, extrapolate their performances out and run them through a thing-a-ma-jig that correlates how they would play with our team under a different set of circumstances, coaches, and players, and then also go back to the known players and do the same thing?

Ridiculous.

 

[schutd]

Spreadsheets. Make a spreadsheet. It'll help you sleep at night.

 

[Solar7]

How are you ever going to be able to accurately compare if what he gives us is comparable to what we gave up? Are you going to hypothesize the players we would have drafted with all those picks, watch them play, extrapolate their performances out and run them through a thing-a-ma-jig that correlates how they would play with our team under a different set of circumstances, coaches, and players, and then also go back to the known players and do the same thing?

Ridiculous.

I'm not going to go extrapolate all of those things, it's not about specific players. We burned a top ten pick, a third, and a fifth, for essentially a slot receiver from UMass and passing on two potential blue chip defenders.

I'm not gonna spend every year breaking down exactly what we lost, but Kyler better win often and look great doing it.

Listen, I'm in wait and see now mode, instead of sheer negativity, but this franchise hasn't done a ton to inspire hope in its existence, so I'm a little flustered we essentially lost a year and are now on a path we really can't pivot from for at least two years.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I'm not going to go extrapolate all of those things, it's not about specific players. We burned a top ten pick, a third, and a fifth, for essentially a slot receiver from UMass and passing on two potential blue chip defenders.

I'm not gonna spend every year breaking down exactly what we lost, but Kyler better win often and look great doing it.

Listen, I'm in wait and see now mode, instead of sheer negativity, but this franchise hasn't done a ton to inspire hope in its existence, so I'm a little flustered we essentially lost a year and are now on a path we really can't pivot from for at least two years.

A star QB is worth many first round picks. They are so hard to find. It is easy to burn a first round (or second or third) pick without ever trading it. Just look at how many duds the Cardinals (and many other teams) have had in the first round. If you burn a pick to get the player you want in the end, you did not really burn it.

I am excited about the Cards ability to cherry-pick the waiver wire from here into the season. It is like having lots of extra picks. They will likely be able to shore up their depth significantly and in this injury-prone league, depth is so important.

 

[dscher]

I'm not going to go extrapolate all of those things, it's not about specific players. We burned a top ten pick, a third, and a fifth, for essentially a slot receiver from UMass and passing on two potential blue chip defenders.

I'm not gonna spend every year breaking down exactly what we lost, but Kyler better win often and look great doing it.

Listen, I'm in wait and see now mode, instead of sheer negativity, but this franchise hasn't done a ton to inspire hope in its existence, so I'm a little flustered we essentially lost a year and are now on a path we really can't pivot from for at least two years.

Overthinker.

 

[slanidrac16]

I'm not going to go extrapolate all of those things, it's not about specific players. We burned a top ten pick, a third, and a fifth, for essentially a slot receiver from UMass and passing on two potential blue chip defenders.

I'm not gonna spend every year breaking down exactly what we lost, but Kyler better win often and look great doing it.

Listen, I'm in wait and see now mode, instead of sheer negativity, but this franchise hasn't done a ton to inspire hope in its existence, so I'm a little flustered we essentially lost a year and are now on a path we really can't pivot from for at least two years.

Yes! Your arrow is pointing up!

 

[JeffGollin]

Thumbnail of concerns and hopes about Murray and Rosen:

Murray - Hope is that he spearheads an awesome passing offense. Fear is that he'll either get hurt early & often or be prone to make too many mistakes, batted balls etc

Rosen - Hope is that his good skill set translates to more wins than losses. Fear is: high floor/low ceiling translates to meh performance. Also - is he legitimately poised? Or does he just display shallow preppie cockiness.

Either QB could be a legitimate star. Or he could flop.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I'm not going to go extrapolate all of those things, it's not about specific players. We burned a top ten pick, a third, and a fifth, for essentially a slot receiver from UMass and passing on two potential blue chip defenders.

I'm not gonna spend every year breaking down exactly what we lost, but Kyler better win often and look great doing it.

Listen, I'm in wait and see now mode, instead of sheer negativity, but this franchise hasn't done a ton to inspire hope in its existence, so I'm a little flustered we essentially lost a year and are now on a path we really can't pivot from for at least two years.

Over the franchises existence, yes this team has NOT inspired hope.

But since 2008? This team has more winning seasons than the team than it did from like 1980-2007. The franchise has clearly done a lot better.

What always used to miff me was that the Cardinals seemingly had all of the back up positions filled with UDFAs. That's clearly no the case anymore, the talent acquisition is much better than it was under Bill Bidwill.

I think your wrong on the hand wringing on what was spent on QBs. If we were talking about any other position, I would agree, but QB is just so much more important than any other position.

The team hasn't played a meaningful down of football yet, but every ounce of information points to moving on from Rosen to Murray as being the right call. If you follow Dolphins Twitter, they are fawning over Fitzpatrick with nary a peep about Rosen.

And you hear AND see how Murray has captivated all of the veterans on the team and the skeptical media personalities. Yesterday it was related about when Michael Michael Bidwill agreed to take Murray...when he saw him practice live, he was blown away.

There is plenty of space on Team Murray if you want to jump on the bus.

 

[kerouac9]

Just wondering if anyone is still preferring Rosen over Murray. Not being sarcastic. Just really wondering.

Seems like a lot of people are getting on the bandwagon. Of course, it helps when your rookie QB knows the offense better than anyone else on the team. It puts him in the leadership role immediately.

I’d still rather have Rosen, cap space, and the high pick than Murray, right now. If they both become successful, it’s an academic question. If they both fail, you’d probably regret expending the draft capital on a second failed QB. Similarly if they’re similarly average.

I would’ve liked to see Rosen in this offense with more protection and playmakers. We could’ve gotten those if we didn’t have to absorb $20 million (or whatever) in dead cap for trading him.

I’m glad you’re excited to eat the garbage of the 31 other NFL teams. We’re unlikely to get anyone better than we claimed from the Browns. He didn’t make it to camp.

A star QB is worth many first round picks. They are so hard to find. It is easy to burn a first round (or second or third) pick without ever trading it. Just look at how many duds the Cardinals (and many other teams) have had in the first round. If you burn a pick to get the player you want in the end, you did not really burn it.

I am excited about the Cards ability to cherry-pick the waiver wire from here into the season. It is like having lots of extra picks. They will likely be able to shore up their depth significantly and in this injury-prone league, depth is so important.