way too early to be final off season plan

[oaken1]

all right, I have an off season plan to rebuild our team with an eye on the future. right now we have about $20mil in cap space with about 38 guys under contract through 2018...so we aint "sittin pretty" by any stretch of the imagination.

the first thing we need to do is let Carson know that we plan to draft a QB and if he does not retire he will spend next season backing up the rookie....he will likely retire. Cut Mike Iupati...he costs more in electricity for the hot tub than he does in salary...time to show him the door... cut Josh Mauro too,...I liked the guy but he hasnt shown up since he got a decent contract,..and AD, sure we all love him,... but it aint worth $3mil to listen to him whine about playing time, let him go too.

Been thinking on Honey Badger,...we all know even with the few flashes he has shown lately he aint the honey badger of old and we way over paid...so here we go... trade him. Yeah, trade him. Kenny Vaccaro is about to bail on the Saints in free agency and they need someone to play that role in their defense. I was thinking back to when I lived in Louisiana and Badger was playing for LSU. One thing that stands out is that Louisiana folks love them some honey badger. The Saints will be picking in the mid twenties so I think we can pull a second rounder for the Badger,... before he got hurt he was on track to be the defensive player of the year and we sell them on that. Like everyone else, I am sure the Saints dont follow the redbirds enough to know he looks to have lost something. So yeah, for this exercise I am going with Honey Badger to New Orleans for a second round pick.

Now for the one that will make folks mad, call me an idiot, whatever. Patrick Peterson...first ask yourself this. How many times have you, we, others, considered how cool it was to watch Larry play his career here but thought it might be cool to trade him off to a contender so he has a chance at a ring before he retires? It has been mentioned many times...and for those of us who have been around here a while, the same thing was said of Aeneas Williams, and actually done. We havent had PP21 long enough to love him as much as Larry. So Instead of trading him to a contender we use his obvious value to help improve the team. Having a shut down corner is awesome, but it is a luxury this team cannot afford. Shut down corners do not win super bowls for you... quarterbacks do. Before the debate starts, yes you need a strong defense, but ya gotta score points too.

Cleveland will have the top pick and make no mistake they will trade it. Because they need a QB as bad as we do and their GM is going to look at their $50mil in cap space and throw half of it at Kirk Cousins, because if he picks #1 overall and misses his career is over... because they will also have #5 or 6 from houston that they can use on an OT to prep for replacing Joe Thomas and there just happens to be such an OT in this draft.

So you call the browns and offer them PP21 for their 2 first round draft picks. of course they wont want to do that even though PP21 is a legit franchise player, and franchise guys are worth 2 #1's... but you start out high. In the end, if we were going to SWAP picks it would cost us at least 2 #1's, but we dont want to swap picks... we want to buy the #1 overall out right and keep our #12 pick. we all know PP21 is a better value than anything they can get with that pick because he is a proven all pro type shut down corner who would pair up remarkably well with Jabril Peppers. In the end we are likely looking at PP21 and next years first for the #1 overall pick this year.

so if the trades go through and Palmer retires we are sitting on six picks in the first three rounds and $56mil in cap space. If Palmer agrees to stay on board a season and mentor the rookie then we have $42mil in cap space.

Round one:
Sam Darnold, QB...USC
Many of us have our favorites at QB and Darnold is mine. Simply because playing QB in the NFL is all about hitting windows and no other QB in this draft hits windows as well as Darnold does. Period.
But in all honesty he may return to college to have a shot at a national championship next year...so for this exercise just insert your favorite QB in this slot if you dont like mine.

Josua Jackson, CB...Iowa
Right now Jackson is rated as a second round CB but I am pretty sure that by draft day he will be considered a day one pick.

Round Two:
Kolton Miller, OT...UCLA
Miller has played well protecting Rosen this season but is more likely to be a RT in the pros.

Simmie Cobbs Jr, WR....Indiana
Big wide receiver with strong natural athleticism that is fully capable of winning the jump balls. very strong red zone presence. was a toss up between cobbs and the kid from florida state but I like Cobbs better.

Round Three:
Frank Ragnow, C/G...Arkansas
This dude is a beast and may be the finest technician in the draft on the oline...over 45 consecutive games without allowing a sack. we have Boehm who is a Shipley clone and Shipley who is a Sendlein clone...we keep getting pressured up the middle because we keep bringing in undersized centers. at 6'5 and 317 this guy moves d linemen... and would start at RG for a year while he learns the line calls.

(compensatory) Kevin Toliver II, CB...LSU
A big corner who may slide in the draft because LSU uses him in off man and he is better suited for press man...one thing both these big corners have in common is they are both ball hawks that faced strong competition in college.

we have no forth since we traded it in order to get Budda last year. But we do have five more picks in the draft...2 fifths and 3 sixths due to projected compensatory picks.

after we set aside money for draft picks we should have about $45mil for free agents. I would start out free agency with re signing Peters and then going after these guys...

Allen Robinson, WR,.. Jacksonville- This guy already has a 1400 yard receiving season under his belt but some untimely injuries have stifled his career early on... but dude is a legit number one and he will likely be looking for a one year deal so he can reset his market value... he is young and very talented...oh yeah,..and big.

Sheldon Richardson, DT...Seattle- This guy suxx when we have to face him...when he is facing our o line anyway, however he would be a great addition to our defensive front. He is just coming in to his prime and appears to have settled down off the field. He provides lots of pressure up the middle which will help Golden and Jones on the edge and will also help when Reddick blitzes up the middle... he provides the presence we were hoping bustdiche was gonna bring..and hell, maybe he can help get the kid competitive?

There are lots of free agents this off season. I counted 23 corners so we can get some if we need help there... but having a high pressure front should make the DB's jobs just a bit easier.

I would set an oline of..

Humphries
Veldheer
Shipley
Ragnow
Miller

I know, starting two rookies on the right is risky... but JV has more experience at LG than he does at RT and this way the blind side is solid and both rookies are very solid and nasty run blockers.

At this point we would be sitting on about $25mil of cap space yet, have a rookie QB and a revamped oline...
would it be crazy to call Le'veon Bell and offer him the $15mil he wants? give our QB two backs that can run, block, and catch?? to go along with his three WR's over 6'4?

 

[Ronin]

Getting Josh Jackson in the second round would be a steal.

 

[oaken1]

Getting Josh Jackson in the second round would be a steal.

I think so too...thats why I had us taking him at 12...didnt think he would be there in the second round

 

[Ronin]

I think so too...thats why I had us taking him at 12...didnt think he would be there in the second round

I wouldn't mind taking him with the number 12 pick. The kid is true definition of a ball hawk.

 

[GuernseyCard]

1. CP would never accept a backup role. Not in his nature.
2. No team would pick up the Badger contact at this point.
3. Shutdown corners are not a "luxury". They are a necessity. And Aeneas got out of AZ by threatening to retire.
4. I'd attempt to re-structure Iupati before cutting and attempt to get a new arrangement with Veldheer.
5. Moro's future would be decided at end of camp.

As to the draft: Yes to a QBOF who learns the craft watching and learning from CP in 2018.

 

[oaken1]

1. CP would never accept a backup role. Not in his nature.
2. No team would pick up the Badger contact at this point.
3. Shutdown corners are not a "luxury". They are a necessity. And Aeneas got out of AZ by threatening to retire.
4. I'd attempt to re-structure Iupati before cutting and attempt to get a new arrangement with Veldheer.
5. Moro's future would be decided at end of camp.

As to the draft: Yes to a QBOF who learns the craft watching and learning from CP in 2018.

yeah, I mentioned that faced with backing up a rookie Carson would likely retire. It is reflected in the salary cap space

Iupati has spent over half his contract on IR and is not getting any younger. He was a liability in pass protection even in his prime...awesome road grader but even that has regressed and is useless from the tub.

JV is due $10mil...a huge amount,... but he has consistently been our best olineman... this is his last year under contract...pretty sure SK lets him play it out.

when you look at the SB champs over the past 10 or 20 years how many had a legit shut down corner?? one or two??
what they did have were names like Brady, Rodgers, Wilson, Elway, Rothlisberger, and Manning...due to those names some of those teams have gone to and/or won several championships.

 

[GuernseyCard]

yeah, I mentioned that faced with backing up a rookie Carson would likely retire. It is reflected in the salary cap space

Iupati has spent over half his contract on IR and is not getting any younger. He was a liability in pass protection even in his prime...awesome road grader but even that has regressed and is useless from the tub.

JV is due $10mil...a huge amount,... but he has consistently been our best olineman... this is his last year under contract...pretty sure SK lets him play it out.

when you look at the SB champs over the past 10 or 20 years how many had a legit shut down corner?? one or two??
what they did have were names like Brady, Rodgers, Wilson, Elway, Rothlisberger, and Manning...due to those names some of those teams have gone to and/or won several championships.

OK... I'll take any one of those QBs for PP21.

How exactly do we do that?

In other words, PP21 in AZ is in no way tied to whether we acquire a QBOF (imo)

 

[Jetstream Green]

You bet we have had Peterson long enough, long enough for some to develop a deep hatred for him for one ludicrous reason or another... enough to send the poor guy to Cleveland while in his prime lol

 

[GuernseyCard]

You bet we have had Peterson long enough, long enough for some to develop a deep hatred for him for one ludicrous reason or another... enough to send the poor guy to Cleveland while in his prime lol

And they'll be complaining that he didn't thank the Cards sufficiently in his speech entering the HOF.

 

[oaken1]

You bet we have had Peterson long enough, long enough for some to develop a deep hatred for him for one ludicrous reason or another... enough to send the poor guy to Cleveland while in his prime lol

I dont hate PP21 at all. But I love the redbirds more than I like PP21. We need a QB and the standard Cardinal philosophy of sitting pat to see what falls in your lap just aint working. we need something drastic... but if we get that QB we also need to protect him and do what we can to make him successful dropping a young guy into this trainwreck of an nfl team is a sure fire recipe for catastrophic failure.
getting the QBOTF with PP on the team would be better... but that option probably involves trading away our first round picks for the 2018, 19, and 2020 drafts with a few lower rounds thrown in for flavor. It makes more sense to not swap picks, but to buy the #1 pick outright. The only commodities we have who might pull that off are PP21 and David Johnson.... generally corners are more valuable than RB's..... but when you plan to be starting a rookie QB a guy like David Johnson could be the entire difference between success and failure...so ya gotta keep him. which leaves Patrick as the only commodity that can get the deal done.

some people thought Jimmy Johnson was crazy when he traded arguably the best player on his team at the time to the minnesota vikings...
but that trade sparked a dynasty in dallas that we as Cards fans know too much about and want even less to hear about.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I stopped reading where New Orleans not only actually agrees to pay for Badger’s ridiculous contract but ALSO gives us a second round pick to boot!

 

[oaken1]

I stopped reading where New Orleans not only actually agrees to pay for Badger’s ridiculous contract but ALSO gives us a second round pick to boot!

yeah...that one is "Hopeful"... basing it upon the fanatical devotion I saw in regards to the badger while I lived in Louisiana.... but if one believes he can return to form, in which he was a legit DPOY candidate,..then he is easily worth the second. the saints have a history of giving injured players second chances...(Drew Brees)...they have a need as Kenny Vaccarro is a FA and rumored to be planning on playing the market...and the fans all over the state love the Badger...so much so I actually saw some coon asses wearing Cardinal jerseys...and all they knew about the birds was, Palmer, Fitz, Badger, Peterson, arizona


edit..
also, where the saints pick come into play. They are expected to pick around 26, if it were the 7th pick in the second I could see it being a definite negative but the 26th pick is almost a third...and honesty, even if we had to throw in one of our compensatory sixes...

 

[gmabel830]

Let us know how your Madden franchise does while the rest of us stay in the real world

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[Jetstream Green]

I dont hate PP21 at all. But I love the redbirds more than I like PP21. We need a QB and the standard Cardinal philosophy of sitting pat to see what falls in your lap just aint working. we need something drastic... but if we get that QB we also need to protect him and do what we can to make him successful dropping a young guy into this trainwreck of an nfl team is a sure fire recipe for catastrophic failure.
getting the QBOTF with PP on the team would be better... but that option probably involves trading away our first round picks for the 2018, 19, and 2020 drafts with a few lower rounds thrown in for flavor. It makes more sense to not swap picks, but to buy the #1 pick outright. The only commodities we have who might pull that off are PP21 and David Johnson.... generally corners are more valuable than RB's..... but when you plan to be starting a rookie QB a guy like David Johnson could be the entire difference between success and failure...so ya gotta keep him. which leaves Patrick as the only commodity that can get the deal done.

some people thought Jimmy Johnson was crazy when he traded arguably the best player on his team at the time to the minnesota vikings...
but that trade sparked a dynasty in dallas that we as Cards fans know too much about and want even less to hear about.

I have looked at this too Oak and actually did say David Johnson in a post prior on the draft if I had to but would rather not trade either two. One might not find a possible future Hall of Famer like him but a good back is far easier to find than a cornerback of Peterson's ability. Quarterback, pass rusher, left tackle and cornerback are the most prized possessions in my opinion and the most difficult to identify. Heck, it is hard for us just to find a number two corner opposite of Peterson and have been fortunate with the play of Tramon Williams but Kerwynn Williams has been sufficient, though I am not stating I would want him as my long term starter but still as our third option he can produce. Cornerback is a different story and Jimmy did trade a running back after all

 

[Cheesebeef]

So, I started reading again... and it got worse!?

The Browns GM who’s loaded with pick to do EXACTLY what Jimmy Johnson did (without having to give up anything) is going to give up those picks... for a great CB?!

Dude... I know it’s fun and I’ve been there before... but put down the ether and step away from gravity bong.

 

[Cards Czar]

You said: we have no forth since we traded it in order to get Budda last year. But we do have five more picks in the draft...2 fifths and 3 sixths due to projected compensatory picks.

As an update we do not have those comp picks.

As of today here is what we have.

We will receive a 3rd (pick # 35), a 4th (pick #135) and a 5th (pick # 178).

https://overthecap.com/draft

 

[Garthshort]

oaken1, sorry to have to disagree with your opinion that NO doesn't follow the Cardinals closely enough to know that the HB has lost something. It's called game films. When he traded for Carson Palmer, SK said that watched EVERY pass that CP attempted in the prior year. If the HB has any trade value, imo, it's because he's always around the ball, even if he's lost a step.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I like the draft picks but no way am I trading Peterson. Also, like the free agency but why not draft a QB and let him sit behind Palmer rather than vice versa?

 

[oaken1]

this cracks me up... I still like the framework of this plan... and since we are now coachless and QBless in cardinal land I am now seeing others realize PP is really the only true asset we have in order to secure our future....unless you wanna trade DJ,...who we really need to keep any QB we get on the right side of being a corpse.

Point is still moot... Steve Keim will stand pat in full certainty the guy he wants will fall to us at 15 because none of the GM's in front of us are as smart as he is.