Is mobility for a QB overrated

[Cbus cardsfan]

There's an earlier post about Navarre being a statue but can see over the line,and a Kent Graham comparison .It got me thinking whether moblilty is a necessity for a QB or is it just a plus to find a QB with it. Bledsoe, Testaverde,Manning,Favre(these days),Collins all come to mind as qB's that are not the most mobile guys in the world but have had alot of success.Guys like Vick and Mcnabb have a ton more athletic ability but aren't near the passers of the other guys. I think i'd rather have the QB who can throw the ball better.The key with Navarre will be does he have the pocket presence to subtley avoid the rush.He probably won't the first game but if he shows that he does i think he could be a fine QB. Mcown has a ton more athletc ability than Navarre but i think Navarre will probably end up being a better QB.

 

[jstadvl]

How about

Brady, Warner, Brees? Those guys aren't any Bob Hayes! I think it's over rated also. If a guy can move enough to get crucial yardage when all breaks down, good enough. jmo.

 

[Toro]

I think field vision is most important.

 

[SweetD]

Mobility wouldn't be an issue if you had a running game. If the Cards can open up the running game you would see as many blitzs.

 

[Rats]

There's an earlier post about Navarre being a statue but can see over the line,and a Kent Graham comparison .It got me thinking whether moblilty is a necessity for a QB or is it just a plus to find a QB with it. Bledsoe, Testaverde,Manning,Favre(these days),Collins all come to mind as qB's that are not the most mobile guys in the world but have had alot of success.Guys like Vick and Mcnabb have a ton more athletic ability but aren't near the passers of the other guys. I think i'd rather have the QB who can throw the ball better.The key with Navarre will be does he have the pocket presence to subtley avoid the rush.He probably won't the first game but if he shows that he does i think he could be a fine QB. Mcown has a ton more athletc ability than Navarre but i think Navarre will probably end up being a better QB.

I think that if running is your primary weapon then it is a necessity. You gave several good examples of why it is not really a necessity in some very good QBs. It gives an added weapon to those that have it (Vick, Mcnabb)but I to would rather have a QB that can slide and find the soft spots in the zone and make the accurate pass under duress. Being big and having a good head on your shoulders are way more important than being able to run like the wind as a QB. Outside of Mike Vick not many QBs run, I guess that is why he has rules made up for him. I like you would rather have a QB that is accurate. Behind our line Navarre should get the chance to see if he is accurate under fire.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Mcown has a ton more athletc ability than Navarre but i think Navarre will probably end up being a better QB.

The guy has yet to throw one ball in a game that counts... and you can come to this conclusion. Are you psychic?

 

[cdex99]

I guess it depends on the player. If McCown didn't have the 4.6 speed, he probably wouldn't have been drafted. On the other hand Big Ben wasn't exactly considered a burner when he came out of college, but he could throw. It also depends on the system. I honestly would take a pure pocket passer over a mobile QB. Mobile QB's to me seem like they don't see the field as well, can make all the throws, and that's why he has to be able to move. The thing I noticed about Navarre in preseason, and granted it was preseason, was that he could stand back there, look off his defenders and get the ball there. He would pick them apart, and to me that is more valuable for a QB than the ability to run.

 

[Vomit Boy]

Immobile QB's to win a Super Bowl:


Bart Starr
Bart Starr
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Joe Montana
Steve Young
Kurt Warner
Tom Brady
Kent Dilfer
Brad Johnson
Ken Stabler
Troy Aikman
Jim McMahon
Joe Montana
Phil Simms
Joe Namath
Len Dawson
Brett Favre
John Elway
Bob Griese
Doug Williams
......................................

Running scramblers tha have won a Super Bowl
.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Immobile QB's to win a Super Bowl:


Bart Starr
Bart Starr
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Joe Montana
Steve Young
Kurt Warner
Tom Brady
Kent Dilfer
Brad Johnson
Ken Stabler
Troy Aikman
Jim McMahon
Joe Montana
Phil Simms
Joe Namath
Len Dawson
Brett Favre
John Elway
Bob Griese
Doug Williams
......................................

Running scramblers tha have won a Super Bowl
.

Terry Bradshaw could certainly tuck it in and run... and describing Steve Young as immobile... is laughable.

 

[Russ Smith]

Immobile QB's to win a Super Bowl:


Bart Starr
Bart Starr
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Joe Montana
Steve Young
Kurt Warner
Tom Brady
Kent Dilfer
Brad Johnson
Ken Stabler
Troy Aikman
Jim McMahon
Joe Montana
Phil Simms
Joe Namath
Len Dawson
Brett Favre
John Elway
Bob Griese
Doug Williams
......................................

Running scramblers tha have won a Super Bowl
.

Joe Montana immobile? Steve Young?

I'll give you a lot of those guys but Favre was pretty mobile in his win and Young and Montana were VERY mobile.

The bottom line is QB's have to be able to make plays in the pocket, I've yet to see a team win a Superbowl with a QB who can't. This year will be an interesting test with guys like Vick and Jake who are so good outside of the pocket and so inconsistent in it.

 

[kerouac9]

There's a difference between "mobility" and "scrambling ability". Mobility is probably a top five consideration in scouting NFL QBs. Brady and Manning, for example, have excellent mobility. They can buy time in the pocket, slide around, and wait for their guys to come open. When Favre, Young, and Elway had their greatest success (all three had pretty solid scrambling abilities when they entered the league), they could still buy that time in the pocket to let go of the ball. One of the great things about Ben Roethlisberger is that he has underrated athleticism and pocket presence sliding around to buy time.

Scrambling ability is more of a "bonus". In the league today (at least in the media that covers the league), it's probably overrated. Denny definitely over-sold it to Cardinal fans when he praised McCown for being such a great B-ball player (as if that meant something). The scrambling abilities of Culpepper, McNabb, and Vick would be pretty meaningless if they didn't all have cannon arms (with varying degrees of accuracy--Culpepper-Vick-McNabb, in order) and some ability to get the ball to their playmakers on the outside or in the middle.

 

[Pariah]

There's a difference between a QB that doesn't have much mobility and an immoble QB.

Bledsoe doesn't have much mobility, but he can move enough withing the pocket and has a good enough feel for the pocket that a step or two one way or the other is all he needs to get his pass off.

I hope I'm wrong--good gravy, I hope I'm wrong--but I think Navarre falls into the "immoble" category. He doesn't feel the rush well enough to avoid it even to the degree that the other "statue" QBs can.

 

[azdad1978]

Wow Young,Montana and Favre Immobile? As long as the QB can side step the rush, has vision and hang tough in the pocket he will fine. But without a running game and shaky Oline doesn't give me confidence IMO.

 

[Pariah]

Immobile QB's to win a Super Bowl:


Bart Starr
Bart Starr
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Joe Montana
Steve Young
Kurt Warner
Tom Brady
Kent Dilfer
Brad Johnson
Ken Stabler
Troy Aikman
Jim McMahon
Joe Montana
Phil Simms
Joe Namath
Len Dawson
Brett Favre
John Elway
Bob Griese
Doug Williams
......................................

Running scramblers tha have won a Super Bowl
.

Elway could run, too. Even for an old man.

 

[azdad1978]

Elway could run, too. Even for an old man.

Did a helicopter spin when he ran it in the endzone on SB.

 

[ajcardfan]

McMahon wasn't immobile when he won the Super Bowl, he was immobile when he played for the Cards. Ken Stabler was famous for his ability to avoid the rush. Hell, he was the original "Snake".

And, who is "Kent Dilfer"?

 

[Assface]

Another huge aspect that hasn't been mentioned yet is the quarterback's release. Marino could get rid of the ball so fast he didn't have to move.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Immobile QB's to win a Super Bowl:


Bart Starr
Bart Starr
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Terry Bradshaw
Joe Montana
Steve Young
Kurt Warner
Tom Brady
Kent Dilfer
Brad Johnson
Ken Stabler
Troy Aikman
Jim McMahon
Joe Montana
Phil Simms
Joe Namath
Len Dawson
Brett Favre
John Elway
Bob Griese
Doug Williams
......................................

Running scramblers tha have won a Super Bowl
.

you are losing credibility with successive posts here VB - To even put Elway in that list first of all is beyond laughable - but Young was a mobile QB, as was Bradshaw as was Stabler(there's a reason he was known as the original Snake) and hell even Montana could get around when need be.

Were they scarmblers in the mode of Vick - no - but no one is.

 

[Tangodnzr]

Immobility, lack of scrambling ability, etc, etc, etc, all are only successful if the QB has an offensive line good enough to give him protection enough to be able to stand back and throw it.

It doesn't take a Dan Marino to be able to throw fairly accurately if you have the time to set, sit, look, read, and fire.

..or unless you are going to run quick passes with 3 or less step drop, where all the QB has to do is take the snap, ****, and throw.
And you will never get more than 4-6 yds max. typically on those, unless the receiver breaks a tackle.

Strong arms are best utilized on deep throws.

So to me, an immobile/strong armed QB, is only as good as his OL.

 

[binkar]

I think field vision is most important.

Agreed. There could be a QB who has the best arm of all time and the most accurate arm ever, but if he has bad field vision he will be unsuccesful.

 

[Redsz]

I hope I'm wrong--good gravy, I hope I'm wrong--but I think Navarre falls into the "immoble" category. He doesn't feel the rush well enough to avoid it even to the degree that the other "statue" QBs can.

Hey Pariah, this is what Navarre's draft bio had to say about this:

Sets his feet and shows quickness with a long stride to get to his throwing spot …

Shows good poise and keeps his teammates in control ...

Has adequate accuracy and touch on his deep throws and good pocket awareness, knowing when to step up in the pocket …

Hope that will put you somewhat at ease. Atleast until the game.

 

[D-Dogg]

The guy has yet to throw one ball in a game that counts... and you can come to this conclusion. Are you psychic?

It doesn't take a whole lot to be better than McCown.

 

[TRW]

Escapeabillity and awareness is more important than being a "running" QB. Mobility to me is not the ability to pull the ball down and take off a la Mike Vick, McNabb, etc.

Pocket presence and the ability to side step, step up, or run when absolutely necessary are more important. The really, really good QB's have the ability to do a subtle side step or small movement to buy that extra millisecond to find the open receiver and get them the ball. The ability to elude the rush and deliver the ball is far, far more important than taking off like a scared rabbit or holding the ball until you get blasted because your primary and ONLY receiver you look at are covered (like Josh does most of the time).

I think Navarre has more of this "pocket presence" than Josh or Shaun. He has a very strong arm and a quick release which will serve him well. I think he has all of the tools (mental and physical) to be a fine QB in the NFL for a long time. But, only time will tell.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

The guy has yet to throw one ball in a game that counts... and you can come to this conclusion. Are you psychic?

I don't think it's much a stretch to say Mccown is a better athlete than Navarre.As for Navarre,i said he probably will be a better QB.It's not like Mccown has set a high bar.150 yards a game and a TD would be an improvement over what Josh has done.

 

[JeffGollin]

A few points.

1. There's immobility and then there's IMMOBILITY - if you catch my drift. Working Definition: If the QB is a sitting duck back there, he's...uh...immobile.

2. A QB who is decisive, makes good decisions and has a quick release doesn't have to be real mobile.

3. A QB whose blockers are rock solid can get away with not being very mobile.

We already know about Cardinal pass blocking (not as rock solid as they should be). What we won't know until they start firing "live" bullets is whether Navarre will be OK in the decisiveness, release and mobility departments.

That's why they play the games.