What is wrong with UCLA basketball?

[Lefty]

The Bruins lost to Long Beach State today. Will they even finish in the top half of the Pac-10? From watching a few games, they aren't a very good shooting team and they don't have a lot of athleticism.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Pretty simple - recruiting scrubs like Mike Roll (better than Chase per Howland's boy Greg Hicks), Adam Keefe (just passed Eric Boateng for worst McD's AA currently playing), and Nikola Dragovic (Euro-Budinger!). Then whiffing on evaluating guys like Bobo Morgan, Jerime Anderson, and to a lesser extent Malcolm Lee.

 

[HooverDam]

Theyve had a bunch of injuries I know, Im sure Russ can come in and post more about it. I just hope they dont get healthy/figure it out by the time ASU starts the Pac 10 season at Pauley. It would be nice to have an easy-ish game in that building for a change.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

One injury - Tyler Honeycutt. He'll help, but they'll still have no PG and will rely on scrubs to produce.

 

[Russ Smith]

In a nutshell this is the fallout from Jrue Holiday. UCLA thought Jrue was going to play 2 years because he told them he was going to. When UCLA was trying to get Gaddy, Gaddy was concerned Jrue was coming back and was given the impression he was, that helped steer Gaddy to UW. When UCLA signed Anderson he and Jrue were great friends, it was a mutual benefit situation where it helped UCLA get Jrue, and it gave them a backup PG for 2 years in Anderson behind Jrue(because they didn't know then Collison would stay as a senior).

Then Jrue bolted, and Anderson as Mao said has turned out to be a complete misevaluation(and Greg Hicks was repeatedly saying Anderson was better than Larry Drew who UCLA could have had if they hadn't taken Jerime). If they knew Jrue was going to leave they might have gotten Gaddy. Add in that Anderson has to play a year earlier, and is nowhere near as good and it's a killer. To be fair, Anderson missed 5 weeks with a groin injury, but I don't think that's the problem, he's just not good.


Lee is talented but not ready to be the star people were predicting. Morgan is a bust. the 08 class was highly overrated.

Drago IMHO shouldn't be playing now anyways with the legal stuff but he's having a bad senior year, Keefe is regressing badly. Roll is a good 6th man but right now he's the best player on the roster, scary but true, and he's seeing what happens when you're the best guy, defenses key on you and he's struggling.

I like the freshmen class, Nelson is the most ready and has played well(Greg said Nelson wasn't a UCLA level recruit), Lane has shown flashes, when he gets stronger he'll be good. Moser has talent he's not ready to play though. Honeycutt is the best of the freshman but first he had the back injury and now the leg problem, even if he comes back soon he'll have missed literally months, very unlikely he makes a big impact this season he's basically played 3 weeks in the last 6 months. I haven't seen enough of Stover to have an opinion. I wasn't that high on him during his recruitment.


Howland conceded after the game today they may have to play some zone this year. There isn't enough quickness(the PG for Long Beach just torched Anderson all 2nd half) and the freshmen just aren't ready to play Howland's defense. He hates zone but he has had to concede that THIS team can't play man the way he wants it played.

They had a lot of injuries early that delayed practices, they had 8 scholarship players healthy for about a week, when they played Fullerton they had put in the zone offense the day before the game just in case, Fullerton played zone more than half the game and won.

They now get a good time off to catch up with practice but the next game is Kansas which looks like a nightmare right now.

I think they should scale back the minutes for Keefe, if they're not going to suspend Drago again I'd personally start Gordon, Drago, Roll, Lee and Anderson now. if/when Honeycutt can contribute I'd start him and bench anderson. Nelson off the bench for Gordon, Lane for Drago, Moser for Roll and Lee, Anderson the backup PG.

They're not going to be good this year no matter what, it's clear they just don't have the guard play.

McCallum is now a huge need for them, if they don't get him I wouldn't be surprised to see them pursue a Juco PG, they can't go into next year with Anderson, Lee and Tyler Lamb as the only guards on the roster.

I have to admit I'm shocked at how bad they are.

 

[ajcardfan]

I have to admit I'm shocked at how bad they are.

And I'm shocked by how well ASU and Texas A&M have played so far. For once, the world of college basketball isn't something I want to avoid because my teams suck and teams I hate are always good.

 

[Russ Smith]

FYI Honeycutt says he thinks he can play 12-6 against Kansas, but Howland said he thinks it's unlikely and 12-12 against Miss. State is more likely for his debut.

 

[DWKB]

From bad to worse?

Losing your third leading scorer and top rebounder.


http://ucla.scout.com/2/925093.html

UCLA announced today that sophomore post player Drew Gordon is no longer a member of the UCLA basketball team and will transfer at the end of the quarter...

Drew Gordon, the sophomore post player, is no longer a member of the UCLA basketball team and will transfer, according to UCLA.

Coach Ben Howland discussed it today at his weekly press conference.

After several discussions with Drew, we both have decided that it is in the best interest of our program and Drew that he continues his career at another school," Howland said. "He is no longer a member of our team and will transfer at the end of the quarter.

"This is not a spur of the moment decision and, ultimately, it's what's best for both parties."

Edit: Speaking of issues at C with UCLA, what's wrong with J'mison Morgan?

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Kids have disliked playing for Howland for years now. The guy wins but he's a micro-managing a-hole which often clashes with West Coast players. At least Sendek and Tony Bennett are generally nice guys who run boring systems. Lots of West Coast programs licking their chops right now.

 

[Russ Smith]

The Gordon thing has been brewing for awhile although I don't know what was the final straw. Gordon complained last year that he wanted to play the 4 and playing the 5 would hurt his NBA chances. This year he's the starting 5, but was still complaining and there were rumors he was being advised(by Jrue) to leave.

During the Long Beach game there were reports he was cursing at Howland when he came out of the game, and when Ben subbed in Morgan in the first half it began to look suspicious. Apparently Drew's Facebook page said he was about to do something serious and then today he said "outie" several times.

Too bad, I followed the kid coming up in San Jose and his younger brother is a potential future elite recruit, but it looks like things just got out of hand.

There are lots of rumors but suffice it to say the 2008 class was highly overrated and some of the kids are very immature and it appears that just didn't mess with Howland's style. For now I assume Reeves Nelson is the starting 5.

 

[Russ Smith]

Kids have disliked playing for Howland for years now. The guy wins but he's a micro-managing a-hole which often clashes with West Coast players. At least Sendek and Tony Bennett are generally nice guys who run boring systems. Lots of West Coast programs licking their chops right now.

From rumors making the rounds there might be a couple of other kids who are unhappy although nobody seems to agree on which kids and why. I won't throw out any names since I have no idea what's true or not but I suspect Gordon is gone because Ben thinks his presence at this time was divisive to the team.

During the LBS game Gordon came out in the first half and walked right past the bench and into the locker room. At the time we thought he was hurt, but in hindsight he may have been mad at howland?

Definitely doesn't look good right now for UCLA, lost season.

 

[HooverDam]

Someone remind me on the rule, would he have to sit out just the 1 year if he went to a Pac 10 school or 2? Also is it a 'year' or a 'season'? Because if he transferred now maybe he could play by the 2nd semester next year....

 

[DWKB]

Someone remind me on the rule, would he have to sit out just the 1 year if he went to a Pac 10 school or 2? Also is it a 'year' or a 'season'? Because if he transferred now maybe he could play by the 2nd semester next year....

It's two consecutive semesters.

Jeff Withey can take the court as a Jayhawk on Jan 2nd

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Someone remind me on the rule, would he have to sit out just the 1 year if he went to a Pac 10 school or 2? Also is it a 'year' or a 'season'? Because if he transferred now maybe he could play by the 2nd semester next year....

One year, but Howland won't release him to another Pac-10 school which means Gordon would have to pay full tuition for said year if he transferred within the Pac.

Translation: it's highly unlikely he ends up in the Pac-10 especially at a school outside of California.

 

[overseascardfan]

One year, but Howland won't release him to another Pac-10 school which means Gordon would have to pay full tuition for said year if he transferred within the Pac.

Translation: it's highly unlikely he ends up in the Pac-10 especially at a school outside of California.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/spo...gordons-departure-prompted-by-suspension.html

This settles it, he is not going to play in the PAC-10 again, according to his mother. You know he wasn't going to CAL after re-neging on them a couple of years ago. I figure he goes to Duke if they'll have him.

 

[Russ Smith]

Someone remind me on the rule, would he have to sit out just the 1 year if he went to a Pac 10 school or 2? Also is it a 'year' or a 'season'? Because if he transferred now maybe he could play by the 2nd semester next year....

Per the SJ Merc if it's a non Pac 10 school one school year so he'd be eligible 2nd semester next year. If it's a Pac 10 school, 1 and 1/2 school years so rest of this year, all next year ineligible and he'd have to pay his own way for one full school year. So very unlikely he goes to another Pac 10 school.

SJ Merc has a story too, mother says he wanted to run, wasn't fitting the system and they decided to just get out now and pick a school for basketball reasons.

From the press conference it sounds like HOwland kicked him off the team but is calling it a mutual decision to transfer.

Also if you believe what you see online, Bobo Morgan might be on his way out too. He apparently posted on his Facebook page his days in LA are almost up and he's going out with a bang "Texas style."

Talk about implosion, I'm not very high on Morgan as a player but losing 2 kids midseason would be pretty tough for Howland to live down.

 

[Russ Smith]

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/spo...gordons-departure-prompted-by-suspension.html

This settles it, he is not going to play in the PAC-10 again, according to his mother. You know he wasn't going to CAL after re-neging on them a couple of years ago. I figure he goes to Duke if they'll have him.

Gordon never verballed to Cal. Duke is highly unlikely his mom says he wants to stay on the West Coast. Andy Katz thinks San Diego state or another school of that size. Gordon wants to play PF so he has to pick a school that will promise him he can play the 4, and run. Most bigger name schools won't play him at the 4, but a school like SDS can make that promise.

Bad situation all around. I like the kid but it sounds like Howland and he had butted heads from the beginning and his mom says neither was going to change.

 

[Russ Smith]

Amazing the age we live in. Less than 12 hours after his Facebook postings made UCLA fans think Bobo Morgan was next to transfer, he posts an apology on his FB page saying people misunderstood his earlier post and that he's not going anywhere.

I still expect him and maybe Lee to leave after the season but he does figure to get a lot more PT now so it'll be interesting.

Apparently they intend to play some zone against Kansas on Sunday, so maybe the 50 point loss will only be 47 points.

 

[HooverDam]

SJ Merc has a story too, mother says he wanted to run, wasn't fitting the system and they decided to just get out now and pick a school for basketball reasons.

Then why did he pick Howland/UCLA in the first place? Just because of the tradition? The thought process (or lack thereof) of recruits in all college athletics quite often leaves me confused.

 

[DWKB]

Amazing the age we live in. Less than 12 hours after his Facebook postings made UCLA fans think Bobo Morgan was next to transfer, he posts an apology on his FB page saying people misunderstood his earlier post and that he's not going anywhere.

I still expect him and maybe Lee to leave after the season but he does figure to get a lot more PT now so it'll be interesting.

Apparently they intend to play some zone against Kansas on Sunday, so maybe the 50 point loss will only be 47 points.

Playing zone? What's the over/under on Xavier Henry's point total? 24?

 

[overseascardfan]

Gordon never verballed to Cal. Duke is highly unlikely his mom says he wants to stay on the West Coast. Andy Katz thinks San Diego state or another school of that size. Gordon wants to play PF so he has to pick a school that will promise him he can play the 4, and run. Most bigger name schools won't play him at the 4, but a school like SDS can make that promise.

Bad situation all around. I like the kid but it sounds like Howland and he had butted heads from the beginning and his mom says neither was going to change.

I could have swore he picked Cal before switching, maybe I'm wrong. As for going to SDS, I thought he wanted to go to a winning program.

 

[Russ Smith]

Man it's like everything that can go wrong at UCLA is. Yesterday Tyler Honeycutt returns to practice, they're saying he might play against Kansas. And then during the practice Reeves Nelson hyperextends a knee and can't finish practice. nelson is slated to start against Kansas Sunday, if he can't go either James Keefe or Bobo Morgan would be the starting C.

 

[Russ Smith]

Kids have disliked playing for Howland for years now. The guy wins but he's a micro-managing a-hole which often clashes with West Coast players. At least Sendek and Tony Bennett are generally nice guys who run boring systems. Lots of West Coast programs licking their chops right now.

While certainly true that howland is not player friendly, so far the fallout from this is pretty supportive of Ben.

Kevin Love was asked about it and his reply was "On and off the court, UCLA was the best year of my life."

Collison showed up at UCLA with the Hornets in town to talk to Howland and offer his support after the tough losses, Westbrook called him after the Fullerton loss and again after Gordon left to give support to the coach.

Gordon has now admitted publicly both on his facebook page and on a video on Youtube that he wanted to stay at UCLA. Gordon said he was "pissed I don't get to stay for Kansas." And in the video he said he considers the guys on his team to be brothers, is looking for a school that will be "close to like being a Bruin" and said he loved it at UCLA. The funny thing is he keeps publicly contradicting his parents who said they chose to leave because the style of play didn't suit Gordon and they didn't see it getting any better. I have no problem with their comment, but they should have told their son not to go on in public admitting he wasn't leaving voluntarily.

I still like Gordon but the more you read about this the more people come out and say he had this reputation in HS(I never heard it) and they're not surprised he and Howland clashed. Keefe said he wasn't too surprised he knew they had their share of issues but he hadn't expected it to result in Gordon leaving. Reeves Nelson said he'd been friends with Gordon since he was a freshman in HS, and was really going to miss him. He said it's a big change from HS having a coach on you every day in practice, but "he's trying to make us better players and we all understand we have to listen to what he says and do what he wants and if we do, we'll get better." The irony is Gordon improved more than any kid on the team from last year to this.

He said in one interview he has no idea where he's going to go, he will sit down with his family over winter break to figure that out. I'm still thinking UNLV seems likely since they seem to love transfers there.

I would still think it's likely UCLA will lose another player or 2 after the season, there is clearly some problems still, but at least for now it doesn't appear that we're going to have a revolt against the coach ala San Jose State and Bill Berry.

 

[DWKB]

Well we saw no zone, but we did see a lot of UGLY basketball.

Reeves Nelson was a man out there and about the only Bruin to show up for this game it seemed.


Loved hearing the Rock Chalk chant in Pauley!

 

[Russ Smith]

Well we saw no zone, but we did see a lot of UGLY basketball.

Reeves Nelson was a man out there and about the only Bruin to show up for this game it seemed.


Loved hearing the Rock Chalk chant in Pauley!

Yeah that's a popular topic on BRO now who sold their tickets to Kansas fans.

I was surprised the game was that close but Kansas doesn't play zone and teams that have give UCLA the most problems this year, no shooting.

Nelson is a freaking stud, I just love that kid, don't care if he's too small and looks like a football player out there, he holds his own. He has a scratched cornea they think he'll play next Saturday against Miss State.

I never felt UCLA was in a position to win but they were at least competitive. Honestly if you take away the minutes Bobo Morgan played early in the first half the game was damn near even until Nelson got hurt. Bobo came in with the score 7-6 Kansas, he left a few minutes later with it 15-6 Kansas and all 8 points he was involved with, 4 by turnovers, 4 by standing in the lane with his hands up as a Kansas big dunked or made a layup, way too slow.

I felt like UCLA had a pretty good gameplan, they got a lot of good looks off backdoors, unfortunately Aldrich was able to make several guys miss including that great block on Nelson from behind. They were better on defense than expected although too many good looks for Henry. Kansas missed a lot of shots they probably normally make.

Pretty much everyone is in agreement among UCLA fans, if Honeycutt can get healthy and get the rust off(he was pretty rusty yesterday) it makes sense to move Lee to PG, Roll to SG, Honeycutt to the 3 going forward with Anderson as the backup PG off the bench.

I was a bit annoyed with Howland's use of Lane yesterday, he came in, got a foul battling for position, and came out in about 20 seconds. Considering the total lack of effort by Drago on D yesterday(how many times did he give up a layup on the high low?), I am annoyed at pulling the freshman that quickly. Lane is not physically strong enough yet but he's got a lot of skills and it makes no sense to play Drago those minutes when he's not playing hard instead of giving Lane time to develop against really good players.