Chopper0080
2021 - Prove It
Jones has not been proven to be better than an average RT in Beachum or below averages players at RG. None of his play at any position has resulted in a description of above average or "good".
Oline ranking for Cards
- Thread starter Cardiac
- Start date
Chopper0080
2021 - Prove It
Ultimately our offensive line falls into the following category.
Beachum - average
Hernandez - average
Humphries - above average
Jones - below average
PJohnson - unknown
Understanding that average o-line players are above replacement level, and above-average players are highly compensated.
Beachum - average
Hernandez - average
Humphries - above average
Jones - below average
PJohnson - unknown
Understanding that average o-line players are above replacement level, and above-average players are highly compensated.
Feel free to PM if you need to talk Stout. This message is concerning.lol The age of entitlement. The "I get to say whatever I want without consequence because free speech!" I deconstruct this elementary philosophy in my self-advocacy group every week. We all have assertive rights, and we all have responsibilities too. We absolutely have the right to say what we want (or post it). You absolutely have the right to post very sad insults, and you absolutely have the responsibility of dealing with the consequences, be they mockery (see above), bannings, flame wars, etc. But, no, you're "entitled" and shouldn't have consequences, right? If someone calls you on what you say, well, it's their fault for being "sensitive." Sure sounds like you could use my group to your betterment--or a glance in a mirror
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My wife things so.
BirdGangThing
Casual Fan
Center??
Chopper0080
2021 - Prove It
Froholdt and all of the rest are below average until they show they are something more. Even Big Mo, despite my irrational belief in him. I can make arguments that there is hope for some of the players, but until they show it, it doesn't change things.
It is why I get triggered by the Josh Jones non-sense. If he had shown himself to be a "good" LT by NFL standards, he would not still be on our roster. Another team would have scooped him up.
Stout
Hold onto the ball, Murray!
Just to reiterate the emoji reaction--hilarious.
He was terrible at RG and adequate at RT. (IMO)
Chopper0080
2021 - Prove It
The NFL is so desperate for offensive linemen another team would have offered a top 90 pick for him. And if the Cardinals were not willing to give him up for that, they would have extended him.
Andre Dillard has started 9 games in four seasons and got 9 mil per year from Tennessee. Jones has started 21 games in three seasons. That is just the state of need for average OTs. Jones isn't one.
For a guy off the bench he was serviceable at LT...barely... his play indicates his biggest issue is the side he is on... at LT he was a bit slow in his kicks and didnt react well to counter moves.
IMHO those issues can be negated by putting him at LG...DT's are easier to keep in front of you than edge players and being inside limits the need for kick sliding in most scenarios. Last year was his third season and we should have seen him put it all together.... but his PT was limited, we moved him, and the leadership was in disarray with the kugler fiasco...
If we put him at LG and just let him settle in to the position i think he will do well
So you say.
How about the CARDS thinking it's prudent to retain their #1 backup LT in 2023 given that DJ is coming off an injury and our #1 pick has yet to play a down?
Chopper0080
2021 - Prove It
I mean...that could be, but I would argue letting a player you value head into free agency without an extension while also passing up a top 90 pick for that player is a fairly dumb move.
Also, if you had a 25 year old LT who you thought was as viable as your 30 year old LT, I think you make a trade. Trading DJ would be the move there.
I have it at about a 5% chance that Josh Jones is a 26 year old Kelvin Beachum level OT who the Cardinals are turning down trade offers for and also not extending.
Chopper0080
2021 - Prove It
Let's just acknowledge this is almost as likely as my belief Marquise Hayes is going to turn into a "good: NFL LG. Hopium at it's finest.
They 'value' Jones as an adequate backup at this point, and leave it to him to prove different.
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gmabel830
It's football season!!
I share your optimism on Hayes. Definitely not likely, but how awesome would be it be if he has little fanfare coming off of a lost rookie year and straight up starts mauling people in preseason?! I feel like we are owed one of these at some point to make up for the Jonathan Coopers and Ryan Williams of the past!
Chopper0080
2021 - Prove It
So, a below average player or replacement level which is what I said.
kerouac9
Klowned by Keim
Mauling people in the preseason won't mean anything about his ability to play in real NFL games.
Shoot, beating the jamokes in front of him in training camp won't much much of an indicator.
It's awful how quickly we decided that guys we've seen a handful of snaps from (or none at all!) are projected to be starters at almost every position on the roster:
RT
RG
C
WR3 (at least!)
EDGE
CB2
CB3
Yowza.
CFLredzoned
Hall of Famer
I think he will. But for another team.
Ouchie-Z-Clown
I'm better than Mulli!
Who is playing center on that line?!?
gmabel830
It's football season!!
That's true, but it beats the alternative. It would be nice to see at least one of these preseason wonders actually hit though. The only one I can remember who had a ton of hype preseason and really justified it is Tony Jefferson. I'm sure there are others, just not thinking of them off the top of my head. But you are probably right - there will probably end up being a couple of Lance Long's and Cap Capi's and nothing more.
PACardsFan
ASFN Icon
Trying to evaluate how our OL will perform THIS year is an absolute waste of time. Knowing what a disaster the previous coaching staff was top to bottom, I’m eager to see how or even if our OL improves in 2023. Barring significant injuries, I would be very surprised if the OL isn’t significantly better.
kerouac9
Klowned by Keim
John Brown, maybe?
Antonio Hamilton would've been one of these guys probably if he'd managed to hold on to that frying pan.
Krangodnzr
Captain of Team Murray
I'd add the caveat that we've seen Jones struggle at guard and RT in the past, but he did look better at LT last year.
