I don’t get the hate

RON_IN_OC

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The Hall of Fame is replete with players who in College ran up stats against the "Little Sisters of the Poor".

Forget the HOF, 2 of the Cardinals best QB's in history, Lomax and Warner, went to small schools.
Imo he's the replacement for Hicks at ILB & will share snaps with him plus insurance in case he gets hurt? Plus even though Collins is heavy, he moves a hell of a lot faster than Hicks. Once he learns the defense & can make all the audible calls, Hicks will be on the sideline more if he's as good as the analysts say?

Collins has the 1 thing that Hicks just doesn't have...swivel hips. Hicks just can't change direction at all...he's a great tackler, when he gets his hands on you, though.
 

cardsfanmd

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Base defense is now Nickel. It's why we took Byron Murphy at the start of round 2

So you have Zach Allen and Watt on the line.

You have Chandler, Simmons, and Golden.

So where does he play outside of sub packages unless it is at the expense of Golden?
You do know there are 11 men on the field at a time, right?
 

Garthshort

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This is a 100 percent false narrative people that support the pick keep throwing out there. Keim himself stated they didn't try, that Collins was simply too good to pass off. And that's part of why I think the pick stinks. He's great at limiting his own options.
Might be just a rumor, but I've heard that at this time of year GM's are known to lie or at least stretch the truth.
 

Chris_Sanders

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You do know there are 11 men on the field at a time, right?

I have explained this already. We took Byron Murphy to be our slot corner because we run a hybrid nickel defense as a base package. It's the same defense that Collins played in at Tulsa, the 3 - 3 - 5. We are rarely in a traditional 3 - 4 because the NFL runs 11 personnel 45% of the time now.

Which is why the MLB position, especially a 2nd one, is so devalued in modern defenses.

For this pick to be maximized in effectiveness we are either going to:

#1. Move Simmons around and let him play a hybrid safety role out of a traditional 3-4 alignment. This makes taking a slot corner silly (which it was anyway but it's what we did)

#2. Limit Markus Golden / Chandler Jones snaps in this formation despite Keim saying that Collins will only play MLB. This is where I believe Collins would be most effective. Is Keim overriding his defensive coordinator?

#3. Go to a 2 - 4 - 5 and forgo a DL

Having heard Keim this morning he clearly intends for Joseph to use Collins right away. It would be extremely detrimental to Keim's job security to have another 1st round LB not play immediately.

It will be one of these options above.
 
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overseascardfan

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I don't get the anti-Farley posters now flipping after the fact. TEN took the gamble many of you felt we shouldn't so we'll see if their gamble pays off. I'll be honest I was for Farley but if the reports are he'll need additional surgeries are correct meaning he is not 100% then I think Collins was best guy on board.

Collins will be ready Day 1, whether or not Hicks is on roster will determine if he'll be starting. I am not concerned about him being 270 right now, as long as he comes to camp in playing shape it's not a big deal.
 

MadCardDisease

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I have explained this already. We took Byron Murphy to be our slot corner because we run a hybrid nickel defense as a base package. It's the same defense that Collins played in at Tulsa, the 3 - 3 - 5. We are rarely in a traditional 3 - 4 because the NFL runs 11 personnel 45% of the time now.

Which is why the MLB position, especially a 2nd one, is so devalued in modern defenses.

For this pick to be maximized in effectiveness we are either going to:

#1. Move Simmons around and let him play a hybrid safety role out of a traditional 3-4 alignment.

#2. Limit Markus Golden / Chandler Jones snaps in this formation despite Keim saying that Collins will only play MLB

#3. Go to a 2 - 4 - 5 and forgo a DL

Having heard Keim this morning he clearly intends for Joseph to use Collins right away. It would be extremely detrimental to Keim's job security to have another 1st round LB not play immediately.

The Cardinals have built a defense around players who are very versatile. I think it is confusing you just like it is confusing defenses.

Is JJ Watt solely a DE or can he play DT?

Is Jordan Phillips a DT or can he play DE?

Is Chander Jones an OLB or can he line up like a DE?

Is Markus Golden an OLB or can he line up like a DE?

Simmons can play all over (ILB, OLB, S)

Baker can be anywhere (SS, FS, LB, CB)

Hicks is purely an ILB. This is where Collins is an upgrade as he can play ILB but also move to OLB.



Offenses are going to see a ton of different looks when they play the Cardinals and that is a good thing.
 

Chris_Sanders

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The Cardinals have built a defense around players who are very versatile. I think it is confusing you just like it is confusing defenses.

Is JJ Watt solely a DE or can he play DT?

Is Jordan Phillips a DT or can he play DE?

Is Chander Jones an OLB or can he line up like a DE?

Is Markus Golden an OLB or can he line up like a DE?

Simmons can play all over (ILB, OLB, S)

Baker can be anywhere (SS, FS, LB, CB)

Hicks is purely an ILB. This is where Collins is an upgrade as he can play ILB but also move to OLB.



Offenses are going to see a ton of different looks when they play the Cardinals and that is a good thing.

I can 100% get on board with this except VJ likes defined roles / positions.

Maybe it changes with a real off season and the buffed up personnel.
 

Cardsfaninlouky

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The team says that he'll play the same position as Jordan Hicks. Now, in run defense, I thought Hicks played pretty well. But in pass defense, he was always a step (or two) slow. So, as he learns the position, I hope Collins is a better pass defender than Hicks. We'll see, and I have my fingers crossed that we'll have an offseason.
PFF tweeted out that Collins graded out higher than any other LB & had the highest grade in coverage they've ever recorded. So yeah, I'm pretty sure he'll be better in coverage than Hicks lol.
 

TRW

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I don't hate the pick, I don't love the pick, but I think it's an OK pick given who went before the Cards' pick and what was left.

I am glad the broke back CB wasn't the pick.
 

cardsfanmd

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I have explained this already. We took Byron Murphy to be our slot corner because we run a hybrid nickel defense as a base package. It's the same defense that Collins played in at Tulsa, the 3 - 3 - 5. We are rarely in a traditional 3 - 4 because the NFL runs 11 personnel 45% of the time now.

Which is why the MLB position, especially a 2nd one, is so devalued in modern defenses.

For this pick to be maximized in effectiveness we are either going to:

#1. Move Simmons around and let him play a hybrid safety role out of a traditional 3-4 alignment. This makes taking a slot corner silly (which it was anyway but it's what we did)

#2. Limit Markus Golden / Chandler Jones snaps in this formation despite Keim saying that Collins will only play MLB. This is where I believe Collins would be most effective. Is Keim overriding his defensive coordinator?

#3. Go to a 2 - 4 - 5 and forgo a DL

Having heard Keim this morning he clearly intends for Joseph to use Collins right away. It would be extremely detrimental to Keim's job security to have another 1st round LB not play immediately.

It will be one of these options above.
You said nickel. A nickel D has 4 down linemen, 2 backers and 5 dbs or 3 linemen, 3 backers and 5 dbs.

Jones-Watt-Phillips-Golden
Simmons-Collins
Alford-Thompson-Murphy-Baker-Butler

or

Watt-Phillips-Golden/Allen
Jones-Collins-Simmons
Alford-Thompson-Murphy-Baker-Butler
 

don7031

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I understand the desire to have Collins play making ability in the middle, but expect him to take over for Chandler Jones next season.
 
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Finito

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But they were only key pieces bc they were special. If they aren’t special they are hicks and not big difference makers.

but you can say that about any position. Yeah if guys are special it’s very different than just being ordinary
 

Chris_Sanders

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You said nickel. A nickel D has 4 down linemen, 2 backers and 5 dbs or 3 linemen, 3 backers and 5 dbs.

Jones-Watt-Phillips-Golden
Simmons-Collins
Alford-Thompson-Murphy-Baker-Butler

or

Watt-Phillips-Golden/Allen
Jones-Collins-Simmons
Alford-Thompson-Murphy-Baker-Butler

Is this just deliberate obtuseness? I clarified in my post.

We don't run a true nickel. We run a hybrid defense. Get off Madden
 

Chris_Sanders

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3 linemen, 3 backers, 5 DBs against their 11 personnel.

This is our most common defense as of last year.
 

Chris_Sanders

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3 down linemen. 3 backers. 5 DBs

This is their hybrid base defense.
 

QuebecCard

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I have explained this already. We took Byron Murphy to be our slot corner because we run a hybrid nickel defense as a base package. It's the same defense that Collins played in at Tulsa, the 3 - 3 - 5. We are rarely in a traditional 3 - 4 because the NFL runs 11 personnel 45% of the time now.

Which is why the MLB position, especially a 2nd one, is so devalued in modern defenses.

For this pick to be maximized in effectiveness we are either going to:

#1. Move Simmons around and let him play a hybrid safety role out of a traditional 3-4 alignment. This makes taking a slot corner silly (which it was anyway but it's what we did)

#2. Limit Markus Golden / Chandler Jones snaps in this formation despite Keim saying that Collins will only play MLB. This is where I believe Collins would be most effective. Is Keim overriding his defensive coordinator?

#3. Go to a 2 - 4 - 5 and forgo a DL

Having heard Keim this morning he clearly intends for Joseph to use Collins right away. It would be extremely detrimental to Keim's job security to have another 1st round LB not play immediately.

It will be one of these options above.

Really?

If Michael Bidwill wasn't intimately involved in the draft process and, no doubt, how player X or Y will be integrated into the "0" or "D" this could be true, but he is... so it isn't. IMO.
 

football karma

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3 down linemen. 3 backers. 5 DBs

This is their hybrid base defense.


i see standard 3-4 here

Kennard and Campbell are standing up at the line as OLBs. Simmons and Hicks are stacked behind the line as ILBs. Missing is the free safety out of the picture.

yes?
 

Cardiac

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Well again Chandler would have played those snaps if he was available

I mean if your counter here is that a guy on IR didn't play then yay you win the smart award.

My actual point was that taking Collins removes a recently added starter from the mix and thus has minimal impact this year. It's taking Simmons after you sign Campbell and then being bewildered he doesn't play

Based on how bad the D was at the end of the year then I'm glad one of those starters won't be playing as much.
 
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