2018-19 Season | Point Guard Discussion

[SirStefan32]

Wall is an excellent player, but that contract is ugly, considering his injury history. I wouldn't give anything for Rozier save for the Bucks' pick. No way am I giving up Suns' own pick for a pending free agent.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Wall is an excellent player, but that contract is ugly, considering his injury history. I wouldn't give anything for Rozier save for the Bucks' pick. No way am I giving up Suns' own pick for a pending free agent.

He is a restricted free agent though, is that correct?

 

[overseascardfan]

He is a restricted free agent though, is that correct?

He will be a RFA, correct.

 

[devilalum]

Does a core of Wall, Booker and Ayton make the Suns a top 4 team in the west in the next 3 years?


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[Finito]

Somebody anybody to play PG please

 

[GatorAZ]

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[itlnsunsfan]

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Geez, I cannot stand Stephen A's broadcasting style. Just watching that clip gave me a headache. "Why are you always yelling??..."

 

[WildBB]

I’m on the same page. I’d gamble on wall if it was only a single issue, but the aggregate of:

Relative age
Craptastic knees
Lack of leadership
Fading defense/lack of defensive effort (either way it’s a problem)
And redonkulous contract

Leave me as a solid no thanks.

Whoever trades for Wall at this point does Wash. a gigantic favor. We used to have to give up picks to rid ourselves of those kinds of contracts.

 

[BC867]

Geez, I cannot stand Stephen A's broadcasting style. Just watching that clip gave me a headache. "Why are you always yelling??..."

Quantity (of volume) rather than quality.

People who have no confidence in their own expertise or opinions generally try to "win" by shouting ... or interrupting.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Patience. A PG will be available.

I think this team needs one more lottery trip.

Imagine this:

Tyus Jones
DBook
Bridges
Williamson
Ayton

2 good role players, three stars in the starting lineup. Warren, Jackson, Okobo, and Holmes off the bench. This could be a REALLY good team.

 

[Mainstreet]

Patience. A PG will be available.

I think this team needs one more lottery trip.

Imagine this:

Tyus Jones
DBook
Bridges
Williamson
Ayton

2 good role players, three stars in the starting lineup. Warren, Jackson, Okobo, and Holmes off the bench. This could be a REALLY good team.

Agree. It's too late for the Suns to salvage this season although there should be legitimate options around the trade deadline for supposed playoff teams collapsing.

If the Suns can get a good lottery pick so be it but I don't think the Suns should depend upon it as their only strategy.

 

[elindholm]

The salary cap is $102 million this season, and it usually goes up at least 5% from one year to the next. So call it $107 million in 2019-20. Wall will be at $38 million, so that's 36%. Wall's salary goes up in the remaining years of his contract, but so will the cap. 40% is an exaggeration.

The status of Wall's trade kicker is unclear. There's a brief article by Zach Lowe, which has been quoted by everyone, in which he says that a trade kicker cannot bring the player above his maximum salary (which is true), that there are funny considerations that would come into play if Wall is traded this season, before the maximum extension takes effect (which is probably also true), and that "sources say" that the Wizards could somehow end up owing Wall a whole bunch of extra money if he's traded now (for which he provides zero evidence and which is probably nonsense).

So let's assume that Wall is already maxed out for 2019-23 and that the kicker would not inflate any of those numbers.

The salary should not be a deal breaker. The Suns have been at or below the cap line for so long that some of us may forget that being over the cap used to be routine. The Suns aren't likely to be players for star free agents anyway (you can forget about Durant), so the only ways to get top talent are through the draft and by trade. If it's by trade, that means a huge salary. The Suns would still have their exceptions to play with.

If Ayton and Bridges are part of the core, their extensions will start in 2022-23, the last year of Wall's deal. That year could be ugly. It's also very far in the future. A new CBA could create ways to lessen the hit of expiring mega-salaries -- it's not like the Suns would be the only team in that position.

Before 2022-23, the Suns' salary situation would be fine. Anderson gets dumped, so the big salaries on the roster for next season would be

Wall 38.2
Booker 27.3
Warren 10.8
Ayton 9.6
Jackson 7.1
Bridges 4.2

which comes out to a bit over $97 million, still under the cap and with plenty of room to fill out the roster and even add an MLE player (or whatever that exception is called now).

I don't know enough about Wall to have an opinion on his attitude, and his injury history is a concern. But the Suns have preached "financial flexibility" since the end of the Nash era, and they have not once used that flexibility to make the team better. Instead we get self-defeating trades for competing PGs or inane signings like Ariza. Flexibility is useless if you don't seize good opportunities that present themselves.

If Wall is available for cheap, I say get him. Bender, Daniels, Canaan, Melton, MIL pick, PHO 2020 pick lottery-protected.

 

[Mainstreet]

Perhaps Igor is asking too much of his current cast of point guards to effectively run his offense.

Certainly it may take more time than anticipated with the present talent.

“His expectations, what he expects out of his point guards,” Canaan said. “He gives his point guards a lot of responsibility. We have to understand that. We have to take that and take control of everything that’s going on.”

“He’s on us the most,” Canaan continued. “He’s on us about remembering everything no matter how tough it is. Making sure we know where everybody needs to be at no matter what the situation is. Really, just taking ownership and just being responsible.”

And the same with Melton.

“He really relies on his point guards, but you’ve got to be a player at the end of the day, too,” Melton said. “Sometimes positions don’t matter. You’ve just got to go out there and play. Anyone can bring up the ball. Anybody can take it out. Anybody can shoot the ball. At the end of the day we’re all players.”

https://www.azcentral.com/story/spo...t-guards-most-says-starter-canaan/2006217002/

 

[1Sun]

Perhaps Igor is asking too much of his current cast of point guards to effectively run his offense.

Certainly it may take more time than anticipated with the present talent.



And the same with Melton.



https://www.azcentral.com/story/spo...t-guards-most-says-starter-canaan/2006217002/

Hmmm...

As I recall, someone on this board kept pointing out that point guard was an especially critical position in Igor Kokoskov's system. I wonder who that was...

 

[Errntknght]

Hmmm...

As I recall, someone on this board kept pointing out that point guard was an especially critical position in Igor Kokoskov's system. I wonder who that was...

I don't recall anyone saying that, in fact the general notion was that it was motion type offense and that the point guard is typically not too important in such offenses. Phil Jackson's triangle, which is said to be a variety of motion, certainly didn't stress the point. But it sounds like Igor has a different view. When I watched his national team playing he had Dragic playing the point, and who thrived at it, but he's an very experienced PG.

 

[BC867]

I don't recall anyone saying that, in fact the general notion was that it was motion type offense and that the point guard is typically not too important in such offenses. Phil Jackson's triangle, which is said to be a variety of motion, certainly didn't stress the point. But it sounds like Igor has a different view. When I watched his national team playing he had Dragic playing the point, and who thrived at it, but he's an very experienced PG.

You don't recall anyone saying that? A few of us were ostracized for saying it and saying it and saying it.

But the Suns kept playing it and playing it and playing it.

 

[Mainstreet]

Hmmm...

As I recall, someone on this board kept pointing out that point guard was an especially critical position in Igor Kokoskov's system. I wonder who that was...

I know I have mentioned it before. This is not news. This has been written about in the media.

 

[Errntknght]

An example of someone, anyone, saying that PG position is of critical importance in Igor's system, please.

 

[BC867]

An example of someone, anyone, saying that PG position is of critical importance in Igor's system, please.

OK, not that it is critical for Igor's system. Rather the overview that we need an experienced role playing PG to make the rest of the team better.

Igor's system has proven that it is not the answer.

 

[1Sun]

An example of someone, anyone, saying that PG position is of critical importance in Igor's system, please.

I said it repeatedly and was lambasted for that statement.

 

[1Sun]

OK, not that it is critical for Igor's system. Rather the overview that we need an experienced role playing PG to make the rest of the team better.

Igor's system has proven that it is not the answer.

And now we have confirmation from the quotes posted earlier today on this thread that it is in fact critical for Igor and his system as well.

 

[AzStevenCal]

And now we have confirmation from the quotes posted earlier today on this thread that it is in fact critical for Igor and his system as well.

I think you guys are talking about 2 different things. Some have insisted that in Koko's scheme the point guard is not as important as in many offenses. That really doesn't necessarily agree or disagree with what Koko says about the point guard and his role. From what I've heard from the Coach, the point guard is responsible for leading and getting players into the right position.

 

[BC867]

And now we have confirmation from the quotes posted earlier today on this thread that it is in fact critical for Igor and his system as well.

But isn't it the case that if we had an effective Point Guard, he'd be neutralized by Igor's "system"? That everyone and anyone is a facilitator.

 

[AzStevenCal]

But isn't it the case that if we had an effective Point Guard, he'd be neutralized by Igor's "system"? That everyone and anyone is a facilitator.

I think neutralized is probably overstated, perhaps somewhat minimized?

 

[BC867]

I think neutralized is probably overstated, perhaps somewhat minimized?

OK, but I would rather see a Point Guard feeding a Shooting Guard and Center whose chances for success are maximized.