Pre-Season Week 3 (MIN 30 AZ 28): Thoughts and Roster

Mitch

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About the game itself:

Impressive:

* Cardinals' first drive for a TD highlighted by a fantastic catch and sideline run by Jaron Brown, a clutch 3rd down conversion on an out pass to Sir Juke and a nifty bounce out TD run by Jonathan Dwyer, sprung by effective edge blocks by Jared Veldheer and Robert Hughes---all orchestrated very calmly and confidently by Carson Palmer.

* Cardinals' 2nd Team offense moving the ball and scoring a 2nd quarter TD versus the Vikings' 1st defense, culminating on a gutsy 4th and goal play action rollout pass from Drew Stanton to Darren Fells.

* The disruptive play of Calais Campbell and the tough tackling of Deone Bucannon and Rashad Johnson.

* The Cardinals' time-consuming TD drive to start the second half, featuring the hard-nosed runs by Stepfan Taylor and Robert Hughes (who hammered home the TD), and well orchestrated by Ryan Lindley.

* Some bright defensive flashes of speed by newly acquired ILB Desmond Bishop and the rugged, physical play of OLBs Alex Okafor and rookie Derrell Johnson.

* Bruce Arians for going for it on several 4th down situations---especially at the end of the game in trying to go for the win instead of the tie.

Unimpressive:

* The Cardinals' 1st team defense---once again, as I tried to highlight in a thread this week, do not manifest consistent ability in maintaining outside contain, defending play action passes, preventing QB scrambles and covering the opponents' TEs. Not only did the defense put little pressure on Matt Cassell, there were time when he had a three lane highway to scramble through or to see his open receivers with....the epitome of which was a 3rd and 15 conversion where the Cardinals rushed three---backed off Campbell into middle coverage, leaving no rusher whatsoever in the middle and allowing Cassell an eternity to loft a pass easily over the middle to WR Jerome Simpson who was loosely covered by Patrick Paterson.

* Speaking of loose coverage---it was consistently applied the entire game---save three plays, the one where Deone Bucannon had tight enough coverage on Kyle Rudolph in the end zone which made it difficult to adjust to the pass, the one where Justin Bethel prevented a TD pass in the right corner on tight coverage and the other where Orhian Johnson timed a pass perfectly, stretched out and broke it up only to be called for PI from an official behind the play. Having heard at one of his pressers this week BA laud Jerraud Powers as the MVP of the defense---Powers was an MVP last night as in Most Very Poor---not only did Powers get toasted all night inside and out, he slipped and took a dive to the turf on the long TD to Kyle Rudolph who caught the ball well in front of Powers in order for Powers to make a tackle on him.

* No edge rush pressure from anyone all night.

* The penalties---highlighted by the difficulty getting the ball snapped out of the shotgun in the 4th quarter by a seemingly over-amped Ryan Lindley and a quick to jump off-sides RT in Bradley Sowell....amazingly bailed out by a miraculous rugby scrum backward pass by John Estes to Zach Bauman.

* The subpar kicking of Jay Feely whose counterpart, Blair Walsh, was booming kicks deep into the endzone or out of it---and the poor ST coverage in the return game...although both Feely and Walsh hit goalposts in the game, with Feely's going through (on a 33 yard extra point) and Walsh's clanking out, and later Walsh's 33 yard extra point went wide right.

QB (3): Palmer; Stanton; Thomas

Palmer and Stanton were solid and well composed in the game---as was Lindley to start the 2nd half. However, it would have been extra interesting to see Logan Thomas versus Teddy Bridgewater (who showed the poise under pressure that Lindley lacked).

RB (4): Ellington; Taylor; Dwyer; Hughes

This unit seems set, although Taylor, Dwyer and Hughes are so similar it makes you wonder whether keeping all three is the best way to go---plus, even though there will be times BA will want to run the ball, this offense is going to be very pass oriented.

TE (4): Carlson; Housler; Niklas; Fells

Aside from Fells' excellent TD catch---this was a very quiet unit last night. Fells had his hands full trying to block Chad Greenway, who got the better of him a few times. Greenway is very good, so that should not come as a real surprise.

The real question is---are the Cardinals more dynamic with 3-4 WRs in the game, than in 2-3 TE sets? BA will play a mixture of both, but the TE situation has not developed as nicely thus far as one would have hoped, both in blocking and in receiving. This could prompt BA to use the swing tackle at TE again in key blocking situations.

OL (8): Veldheer; Cooper; Sendlein; Fanaika; Massie; Starks; Larsen; Watford

Watford and Larsen were solid as key depth players and possible starters---which is very good news for BA and HC. Starks appears to be ahead in the competition for swing tackle, but his sore ankle could cast some doubt. However, with Potter ailing and Sowell incurring the wrath of the coaches, there really isn't much competition at that spot. A waiver wire addition could sneak right in come early September.

One has to be concerned about the continuity of the offensive line the more Cooper and Sendlein are sidelined. It seems quite possible at this point that Earl Watford could actually beat out Cooper for the LG spot early in this season, much to Steve Keim's frustration.

Keeping more than eight o-linemen would seem out of the question based on the relative lack of depth talent. But, in keeping eight, BA&SK have to stock the PS with 2-3 offensive linemen---one of whom could be T Kevin Palmer who is playing reasonably well for a rookie, even though he appears a tad undersized. Another could be G/C Philip Blake or G/C Tommie Draheim (who made an excellent block on Hughes' TD), both of whom have good size and decent strength. Thus far, we have yet to see a strong push from Alabama G Anthony Steen---not enough to even warrant a PS gig.

WR (6): Fitzgerald; Floyd; Ginn Jr.; John Brown; Jaron Brown; Powell

Interesting here that John Brown was only targeted twice in the game---the first he dropped on on a wide open intermediate post and the second he left he feet to catch, which he didn't have to do. Had he caught it in stride and made one defender miss, he could have had a TD similar to Kyle Rudolph's.

Not sure why Ted Ginn Jr. was active for this game after missing most of the week in practice. He did make one nice catch on a third down conversion.

There isn't any question as to whether Walt Powell will make the team. The coaches and the scouts think he's special---and they know other teams are eyeing the Cardinals' WR depth.

Brittan Golden is playing hard and is making some good plays---but one has to wonder if he can hold up physically because of his slight frame and he's not particularly elusive. He is fast and he is courageous, however.

NT (2): Williams; Ta'amu

Looking for Dan Williams to assert himself more---and this week the team welcomes back Almeda Ta'amu who, as we know, when healthy can be a disruptive force in the middle.

DE (5): Dockett; Campbell; Rucker; Martin; Stinson

Thus far, Frostee Rucker is outplaying all DEs not named Calais Campbell. He is getting into the backfield consistently and has been pressuring the QB as well as any player on the roster. He appears to be highly motivated. Darnell Dockett looks slow---he really hobbled after Cassell on scrambles. Kareem Martin and Ed Stinson have been very quiet thus far---which is some cause for concern. It would not surprise me if Bruce Gaston, if he returns to full health, finds a way to make the roster, as he has been making the most noise in practice. I think SK may think they will be able to waive Stinson and have him go unclaimed off waivers. Stinson is kind of a tweener---he's not big enough to be a stalwart inside and he's not athletic enough to be a force on the edge as a 43 DE.

The rookie DT Justin Renfro had an impressive sack versus Bridgewater last night. Things that make you go...hmm...

ILB (4): Minter; Foote; Bishop; Demens;

Demens and Foote played hard and reasonably well. Bishop showed his superior athleticism, range and blitzing explosiveness, which is just what this unit needs. He missed a tackle in the backfield, which he knew he woould normally make. But, he cleaned up well on the perimeter making a sure tackle on Adam Thielen after Justin Bethel missed.

The guy who is really struggling is Lorenzo Alexander. The way he got manhandled out of the hole on the long run by Joe Banyard was very disappointing, especially for a veteran playing against second stringers. Alexander was a captain last night---and he has a reputation of being a STs ace---but Kenny Demens is outplaying Alexander on STs thus far and by a significant margin.

OLB (5): Shaughnessy; Abraham; Benard; Okafor; Acho

Okafor, Benard and rookie Derrell Johnson were agressive in defending the run. Benard and Johnson came the closest to pressuring the QB, but time and time again the Viking QBs eluded pressure with relative ease. Acho had a good tackle on the opening kickoff, but didn't make much of an impact otherwise.

Adrian Tracy did not have the pressures he had a week ago.

I like this kid Johnson. He's strong at the point of attack---he can bullrush and shed fairly quickly. I am anxious to see what he does versus the Bengals this week.

CB (5): Peterson; Cromartie; Powers; Bethel; McCann

Tough night all around in the secondary, particularly at CB. Peterson got beat repeatedly---on the first series Cassell badly overthrew a wide open Cordarelle Patterson up the sideline who had streaked past Peterson and Peterson looked to be jogging on the play. Powers did not make a play all night. Bethel missed some tackles, but was the closest in coverage. McCann pushed his man in the back on the first punt and was not particularly effective in coverage.

One of the headsiest plays of the night came from rookie Brandon Sermons who neatly managed to prevent Jerome Simpson from going out of bounds with under a minute left.

S (4): Bucannon; Mathieu; Johnson; Jefferson;

If there was a defensive MVP other than Calais Campbell last night, it was Deone Bucannon. if you have the tape, go back and watch him in goal-line situations. He stepped up and made a couple big hits versus the run and he ran tight coverage on Kyle Rudolph. What's so impressive about Bucannon is he's a big hitter and yet he lowers his pads to get underneath the ball carrier the way Honey Badger does. And he gets to the ball in a hurry.

Johnson came up to force the run well. Jefferson was a step behind but close most of the night. Still, he's getting himself in a position to make plays.

Anthony Walters and Ohrian Johnson turned in solid games. Walters forced the run well and Johnson made a couple good plays in coverage.

ST (3): Catanzaro; Leach; Zastudil

At this point, the kicking decision would seem clear, as Jay Feely's kickoffs led to poor field positions and untimely momentum swings. The question may be whether Catanzaro can be good enough to win the job on his own merits or whether a kicker on waivers would be claimed.

Last 5 In:

TE Fells
DE Stinson
OLB Acho
CB McCann
K Catanzaro

First 5 Out:

WR Golden
DT Gaston
LB Alexander
CB Williams
S Walters

PS Leaders?

RB Bauman
T Palmer
G/C Blake
G/C Draheim
DT Gaston
DT Renfro
LB Derrell Johnson
LB Carson
LB Brown
CB Sermons
S Ohrian Johnson

Questions of the Week:

1. How is your roster projection different than mine?

2. Do you think there will be any surprise cuts? They seem to happen every year. don't they?

3. Do you think there is cause to worry about Darnell Dockett's level of play?

4. Do you think the rule changes regarding downfield contact will hurt Patrick Peterson's play?

5. Would you offer the Chiefs the 2015 1st round pick and the 2016 3rd round pick for Justin Houston (6-3, 258, 4, Georgia), assuming the Cardinals could sign him long term?

I am very curious to hear your answers first before and I explain mine.
 
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Jay Cardinal

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Mitch, I think your roster projections are pretty accurate. A lot of these spots are already locked in so I think only about 15-20% are up for grabs this year.

I would like to find a way to get Gaston on the active roster. Also very unimpressed with Hughes, I think Bauman adds a little more speed and diverse playing style than him at the backup RB spot.

I would be surprised to see Lorenzo Alexander cut, but you are correct he hasn't done much at all in his time here. I wouldn't be shocked to see Acho cut. I think Okafor looks better and the depth looks pretty good at OLB.

Not worried about Dockett or Peterson, I think they are proven veterans that will turn it on come regular season. I think Peterson will be able to handle the tighter calls on the outside. I think his play style is more athletic than physical. I would be much more concerned for Seattle's DBs.

If KC would trade Houston for a 1st and a 3rd I would do it. It is tough to trade draft picks, but he is elite. He is a better pass rusher than anyone in this recent draft not named Jadaveon Clowney and perhaps Khalil Mack. I think our pick will be in the 20 to (hopefully) 32 range and it is really tough to find pass rushers at that spot. We would be almost too deep this year at OLB, but next year he could jump right into Abraham's spot. Paying Houston would also probably take enough money that there would be no chance of Fitz renegotiating and staying.
 

BullheadCardFan

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Good write up and roster break down
The Cardinals' time-consuming TD drive to start the second half, featuring the hard-nosed runs by Stepfan Taylor and Robert Hughes (who hammered home the TD), and well orchestrated by Ryan Lindley.
I don't think Lindley did much on that drive to say it was well orchestrated.
 

Garthshort

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Mitch, though he didn't play last night, I like Williams better than McCann. He's bigger, faster and imo, has more upside. As for surprise cuts, I guess Alexander fits that description, though it would be a small surprise. You pointed out that Taylor, Dwyer and Hughes are similar in size and style, and of the three, Taylor has been least impressive. Barring injuries, I pretty much see what you see.
 

BullheadCardFan

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You pointed out that Taylor, Dwyer and Hughes are similar in size and style, and of the three, Taylor has been least impressive. Barring injuries, I pretty much see what you see.
I still say we may see another RB brought in after cuts are made. I'm not sold on what we have. Dwyer and Hughes ran hard but were not special looking. Taylor to me is bleh, nothing to get excited about.
 

Chopper0080

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Not sure what goalline coverage you were watching on Rudolph but I saw Cassel overthrow a wide open Rudolph after Bucannon whiffed on a jam at the line. I would say that Bucannon was running around last night though he wasn't really impactful in doing so. Hopefully with experience he will start making plays instead of getting there a bit too late.
 

Chopper0080

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I still say we may see another RB brought in after cuts are made. I'm not sold on what we have. Dwyer and Hughes ran hard but were not special looking. Taylor to me is bleh, nothing to get excited about.

I am hoping Bryce Brown gets cut in Buffalo though I doubt it happens.
 

Chopper0080

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I thought Veldheer and Massie looked pretty good. The interior lineman is another story...

Veldheer did ok but I would say that he needs to step up after these past two weeks. He wasn't great in week 1 nor in week 2.
 
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Mitch

Mitch

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Not sure what goalline coverage you were watching on Rudolph but I saw Cassel overthrow a wide open Rudolph after Bucannon whiffed on a jam at the line. I would say that Bucannon was running around last night though he wasn't really impactful in doing so. Hopefully with experience he will start making plays instead of getting there a bit too late.

It actually was one of the rare occasions last night where a Cardinals DB was stride for stride with his man. I just watched it again on the tape. Bucannon did get contact on his jam on Rudolph's inside shoulder (thus slowing his first step) and then when Rudolph made his cut, Bucannon was right there with him and gained on his route so much that he was inside of Rudolph which is what you prefer---if Rudolph is inside of Bucannon he could box him out for an easy TD. Because the coverage was so tight it looked to me like Bucannon's presence made it more difficult for Randolph to spot the pass which by then was going over the top---if the pass is thrown on a line Bucannon would likely have have intercepted it.
 

Chopper0080

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It actually was one of the rare occasions last night where a Cardinals DB was stride for stride with his man. I just watched it again on the tape. Bucannon did get contact on his jam on Rudolph's inside shoulder (thus slowing his first step) and then when Rudolph made his cut, Bucannon was right there with him and gained on his route so much that he was inside of Rudolph which is what you prefer---if Rudolph is inside of Bucannon he could box him out for an easy TD. Because the coverage was so tight it looked to me like Bucannon's presence made it more difficult for Randolph to spot the pass which by then was going over the top---if the pass is thrown on a line Bucannon would likely have have intercepted it.

Lol. It is so funny how people can watch the same play and see it two ways. I just watched it again and saw Bucannon lunge on his jam, Rudolph use a swim move and gain separation. Bucannon recovers but has his head down when the pass comes in and Rudolph drops it.
 
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Mitch

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Lol. It is so funny how people can watch the same play and see it two ways. I just watched it again and saw Bucannon lunge on his jam, Rudolph use a swim move and gain separation. Bucannon recovers but has his head down when the pass comes in and Rudolph drops it.

Bucannon's coverage forced Cassell to lob the ball over the top and treat the pattern as a fade, rather than a corner.

Rudloph wasn't expecting the tight coverage or the lob which is why inside coverage, which Bucannon accomplishes, is the much preferred case at the goalline. Lobbing the ball over the top is much more difficult than gunning the ball in there.

Did you see Bucannon's hits on the goalline in the 3rd quarter? Did you see his textbook tackle in the flat earlier in the game?

Thinking back to the Rudolph play, the good news is, how many times on the goal-line have we seen the TE literally wide open for a TD? Bucannon's effort is a sign of progress!
 
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CardNots

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Lol. It is so funny how people can watch the same play and see it two ways. I just watched it again and saw Bucannon lunge on his jam, Rudolph use a swim move and gain separation. Bucannon recovers but has his head down when the pass comes in and Rudolph drops it.

Exactly as I remember seeing it.:D
 

Buckybird

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Mitch thx for the thoughts & I agree with some & disagree on others. A few of mine:

1) to me Bucannon hasn't impressed me yet. He played tons last night, even into the 4th qtr & he did zero to leave an impression on me. I just don't see any explosiveness from him running to make any plays regardless of his 40 time that I did in Calvin Pryor. I know he's a rook, but you would think we would see at least 1 play from him where we said "wow". I agree with others, that he should've allowed the TD to Rudolph.

2) can we please limit Fitz's reps in the slot!!! I said it last year & I'm saying it again, that putting him there limits his effectiveness. He's not as explosive & elusive and tends to catch these shorter throws & tackled immediately because of this. Case in point was last night. Seems like his big plays come from mostly outside throughout his career.

3) I think BA screwed the pooch on playing Lindley. We all know he's toast because JT is gonna be the 3rd QB. Doesn't he need every rep he can get? Come on BA :mulli:

4) this team has to draft 2-3 OLBs every year early til they find 1 IMO. I've been amazed for years why they continue neglecting it when the 3-4 is pretty much predicated off of them! Thank goodness we still have Abraham or we would be sunk at the position.

5) I think Peterson sometimes reminds me of DRC. I think he tries to bait WRs & tends to be lazy at the start of plays thinking he make up with his speed & athletic ability later in the play & when he does that it's too late...getting burned in the process. I expect better from our gazillion $$$ CB.

Hope we see a little better performance defensively next Sunday night cause I still didn't like what a saw from the #1s on D last night.
 
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MrYeahBut

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Per #3, Bucky.... Who knows why coach gave lindley that much playing time, but in the grand scheme of things there's still the 4th game where Thomas could play a fair amount. If he needs work this year because he might see the field, Cards are toast anyway.

#4 agree completely

.
 

Snakester

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I think we will be fine at tackle Mitch. Massie has looked good in both games and Watford is better than I thought. I think Cooper and Watford will be the starters by mid season. I know Cooper is having problems now but I think he will be fine by game two. I have liked what I have seen from K Martin and Okafor. I think they will continue to get better. Our receiving will be strong this year for sure. I do not like our running backs. Ellington is the only good back we have to me. I am hoping we pick somebody up on the final cuts. I think Ryan Lindley has no chance to make this team after his play at Minnesota.
 

Catfish

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3) I think BA screwed the pooch on playing Lindley. We all know he's toast because JT is gonna be the 3rd QB. Doesn't he need every rep he can get? Come on BA :mulli:

.

Bucky, I believe that BA did this because he had said there would be fair competition for the 3rd QB. He was just keeping his word, which is important to ALL his players. He stresses loyalty and trust, and this is one way he gets it, by keeping his word. Also, after this performance, not even Lindley can have hard feelings if he is cut and Thomas sticks.

By the way, I see what you do with Peterson and Dockett. I wonder if both can simply flip the switch and turn it on when it counts. I don't really have a good feeling about that. We will see.
 

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Mitch, I agree with most of your roster assessments. I am waiting to see how Sendlein and Cooper pan out. I like what both Massie and Watford have shown, and Faniaka appears to be solid. I am hoping that Starks is able to weather the bad ankle and get strong as he upgrades our backup tackle slot.
 

Shaggy

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I don't think Lindley will be cut for a few more weeks. I hope Thomas does well with Cincinnati but he could have more pressure out there then he had with the Texans so we could see a different side of Thomas. I just think he had it easy with the Texans and his play will change with the more difficult D.
 

Jetstream Green

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One is not going to see much pressure from a team that has to generate a pass rush by using exotic schemes. It is preseason and one cannot expect a defense that thrives on exotic formations to show their hand before regular season :)
 

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