Jazz @ Suns 11-1-13

[sunsfan88]

Jazz fans on the Suns game

The tank is coming together nicely - Phoenix isn't an easy team to lose to.

PRE GAME:

The key will be stopping Miles Plumlee...I can't write that with a straight face. Woof, the Suns lineup really sucks.

This is a game I feel like they should pound the ball inside to Kanter/Favors. Phoenix just doesn't have an answer for them.

Just beat up their bigs terribly. Make a statement.

Agreed. On the flip side, what on earth are the Jazz going to do about Dragic and Bledsoe?

Run and hide?

Funnel to Favors?

Hire an assassin?

Start Burks at PG and Hayward at SG?

Fake an injury?

Hire the Suns cheerleaders to distract them?

Should I keep going?

Forget that! Who ever is guarded by Morris, feed him the rock all night long.

Damn that suns lineup is ugly as fuuu

AFTER THE GAME:

Isn't that exactly how we want every game to end?

Perfect win in tank battle!

I'm actually glad to see the Suns win that way.

Awesome, great result

Suck it Phoenix, we've got the tiebreaker now.

Yup. Entertaining to watch and our lottery odds increase haha. This game was more fun to watch than most games last year.

Give the Suns credit though. They hustled like ****.

This team is awesome.
They keep the competition close enough to call it a game, yet still manage to lose it!
Young Guns are playing, Jazz are losing!
This is called improvement!
Special Tanks to "great" coach TyCo.

And should be noted that many Jazz fans love and miss Hornacek. They are all jealous that we have him and applauded him greatly before and after the game. They are very pissed that the Jazz decided to keep Corbin instead of Hornacek.

Also, they created a thread dedicated to our Gortat trade about how we have a smart FO:

http://jazzfanz.com/showthread.php?20751-The-Suns-traded-their-veteran-when-they-saw-they-had-a-better-younger-player-%28Plumlee%29&

 

[Gaddabout]

A couple of thoughts:

- Watching Goodwin in the 2nd was both awkward and exciting. He's a greased rooster with the ball -- aimless, but unstoppable. He seems to have zero basketball IQ on the offensive end, but amazing instinct on the defensive end. Basically, the scouting report has been spot on so far.

- I started the season thinking both Dragic and Bledsoe would prove to be stop-gap measures after two or three years. It's hard for me to think these guys were going to be happy playing together. It's also hard for me to imagine either of them running a top-flight offense. They are better than I thought they would be, but last night showed what I think will be the norm against more physical teams. When they can't get in the lane they will take the entire team down with them ...

- Not that it matters this year, because the Suns have no go-to offensive options after them. Plumlee is not a guy who demands the ball and expends a lot of injury on defense. He put in 35 minutes last night. That's still too many, IMO. Len spends most of his time getting in the way of his own teammates right now, but I still think he's going to have to give at least 18 minutes a night. He only played 13 last night.

- When Frye rediscovers his shot (and does anyone think he won't?), the Suns are going to get better. And people here are going to be screaming for him to be traded, because 10 to 12 points a night from him can be a difference maker. But the Suns won't out of respect to him and his health issues.

- Doctors say Dragic isn't concussed, but he was experiencing blurriness in his eye after the game. That never sounds good.

 

[82CardsGrad]

The question is, would you rather have Goran at 7-8 per year, or Bledsoe at 12-15?

I think that answer is pretty simple.

Bledsoe at 12-15??? Seriously??? He's good and might continue to improve, but he definitely not in that category! He'll be signed by someone for 8-9 million per... 10 at most.


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[SunsTzu]

Bledsoe at 12-15??? Seriously??? He's good and might continue to improve, but he definitely not in that category! He'll be signed by someone for 8-9 million per... 10 at most.


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He'll get more than 10. No team is going to bother giving him a contract that the Suns don't even have to think about matching. Lakers seems like the best bet to go big at Bledsoe, though Orlando could conceivably carve out max cap space as well.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Not sure why the sarcasm is needed. Suns get blown out in this game without Bledsoe.

Bledsoe was more a liability than anything else until the 4th quarter.

Steve

 

[JS22]

Rumor has it online that he wanted the max.

I needed a laugh this morning.

If that's true... Welp, cya Bledsoe.

 

[elindholm]

This backcourt probably doesn't work. But not because it fails on it's value, which is what you originally implied.

I didn't imply any such thing. What are you talking about?

 

[Mainstreet]

Not sure why the sarcasm is needed. Suns get blown out in this game without Bledsoe.

When I made the comment Bledsoe was having a horrible game and I believe he only had 1 point at the time.

However, all is well that ends well. Bledsoe stepped up big time at the end. In the 4th quarter, it kept rattling around my head (when Bledsoe stepped up), this is what stars do, especially hitting that winning shot as time wound down. At the moment, it's hard to think of a Suns player that said, I am going to take the last shot and there is nothing you can do about it.

 

[JCSunsfan]

He'll get more than 10. No team is going to bother giving him a contract that the Suns don't even have to think about matching. Lakers seems like the best bet to go big at Bledsoe, though Orlando could conceivably carve out max cap space as well.

Unless he has an incredible year, he is not getting a max deal unless the Lakers or Knicks clear space. It would have to be one of those deep pocket teams. For a rebuilding team, he is clearly not the #1 option.

 

[Mainstreet]

He'll get more than 10. No team is going to bother giving him a contract that the Suns don't even have to think about matching. Lakers seems like the best bet to go big at Bledsoe, though Orlando could conceivably carve out max cap space as well.

If a team goes hard at Bledsoe, I hope it is a team that has the assets to do a sign and trade, not the Lakers. However, if Bledsoe works out, I'd like to keep him.

 

[SunsTzu]

Unless he has an incredible year, he is not getting a max deal unless the Lakers or Knicks clear space. It would have to be one of those deep pocket teams. For a rebuilding team, he is clearly not the #1 option.

You don't need to be a #1 option to get a max contract and the Lakers have the most capspace next year.

 

[elindholm]

For a rebuilding team, he is clearly not the #1 option.

True, but neither was Eric Gordon. I think it's unlikely that a desperate team might throw a maximum offer at Bledsoe, but I wouldn't rule it out.

 

[JCSunsfan]

You don't need to be a #1 option to get a max contract and the Lakers have the most capspace next year.

Until the re-ink Kobe. But they will still have space for a max player. Is Bledsoe what they want. The Lakers will likely have the pick of the best free agents, if they want to give Bledsoe the max, it will likely be because he is worth it.

 

[elindholm]

Until the re-ink Kobe. But they will still have space for a max player. Is Bledsoe what they want. The Lakers will likely have the pick of the best free agents, if they want to give Bledsoe the max, it will likely be because he is worth it.

The best free agent on the market next summer will be LeBron James.

 

[SirStefan32]

I am not understanding the love affair some of you guys have with Bledsoe. You would think he averaged 25 and 12 for two season in a row with shooting percentages of 60 from the field, 50% from the three point range, and 98% from the free throw line.

Sure, 4th quarter was quite impressive, but we are talking about one single game here, and for that game, he shot 4-15, including 2-7 from the three. He also managed to turn the ball over 5 times. He is a nice gimmick player who can get hot and score a lot of points quickly, but at the end of the day, he is not some kind of an all star you guys are making him out to be.

 

[Suns_fan69]

Is Bledsoe a top 50/60 guy in the league? I don't buy it. I don't even think he's a top 15 pg now and barely in the top 20 (though maybe he can get there). I find it difficult to believe someone will offer him the max but as many others have mentioned, it only takes one desperate team who thinks he's worth it.

 

[SirStefan32]

True, but neither was Eric Gordon. I think it's unlikely that a desperate team might throw a maximum offer at Bledsoe, but I wouldn't rule it out.

If some GM is stupid enough to offer Bledsoe anything near the max, McD needs to make sure we don't save them from their own stupidity.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I am not understanding the love affair some of you guys have with Bledsoe. You would think he averaged 25 and 12 for two season in a row with shooting percentages of 60 from the field, 50% from the three point range, and 98% from the free throw line.

Sure, 4th quarter was quite impressive, but we are talking about one single game here, and for that game, he shot 4-15, including 2-7 from the three. He also managed to turn the ball over 5 times. He is a nice gimmick player who can get hot and score a lot of points quickly, but at the end of the day, he is not some kind of an all star you guys are making him out to be.

maybe not, but I don't think you can deny his potential and ceiling could be very high. in his first two starts we're 2-0, he's averaging 19 ppg, 6 assist and 5 rebounds, while completely taking over a fourth quarter and hitting the game winner. That's a pretty damn good start for a guy who's finally getting his own team to run and is still REALLY young.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I wonder how some of the tankers are feeling tonight. Mind you, I really hope they're terrible and get a top 3 pick. But I cannot actively root for them to lose.

I'm one of the tankers, but tonight doesn't bother me. Wish I had caught some of the game. what will happen will happen with tanking/getting a great pick/etc...but right now, I'm just happy that I actually give a damn about the team again.

and Plumlee, while maybe not being able to keep up this pace, looks like a steal in that Indy trade. If he does end up panning out as a true starting C...fantastic! but even if he doesn't, he looks like an incredibly serviceable big man off the bench at worst.

McD has my faith at this point.

 

[SirStefan32]

maybe not, but I don't think you can deny his potential and ceiling could be very high. in his first two starts we're 2-0, he's averaging 19 ppg, 6 assist and 5 rebounds, while completely taking over a fourth quarter and hitting the game winner. That's a pretty damn good start for a guy who's finally getting his own team to run and is still REALLY young.

Sure, he is averaging 19 points, 6 assists, and 5 rebounds, but he is also shooting 40% (20% for three), and 4.5 turnovers per game.

I am not disputing he is talented and has potential- I am just saying that some of you guys are overestimating that potential. At the end of the day, he is a 6'1 shooting guard who cannot shoot worth crap. He cannot run a team as he is NOT a point guard, and while I really like his defensive intensity, he is not really able to guard SGs.

 

[Superbone]

Plumlee is not a guy who demands the ball and expends a lot of injury on defense.

I sure hope not!

 

[AzStevenCal]

Sure, he is averaging 19 points, 6 assists, and 5 rebounds, but he is also shooting 40% (20% for three), and 4.5 turnovers per game.

I am not disputing he is talented and has potential- I am just saying that some of you guys are overestimating that potential. At the end of the day, he is a 6'1 shooting guard who cannot shoot worth crap. He cannot run a team as he is NOT a point guard, and while I really like his defensive intensity, he is not really able to guard SGs.

I like his form, especially on his 3 point shot. He looks like a different player though when he tries to shoot off the bounce from mid-range or deeper. If he can't develop that shot, he might end up being no more than what you've called him, a gimmick player.

I think it's a bit harsh to say he can't run a team though. He sure looks like he can to me. He penetrated and created easy shots for teammates a couple of times (with at least one beautiful pass) and that was against a defense that was clearly playing him to penetrate and dish (not to mention their interior giants). Granted, nobody has bothered to really scout and prepare for Bledsoe so it remains to be seen what will happen when everyone has a book on him. But I'm surprised that anyone is anything less than excited by what he's shown so far even with the horrible shooting percentage.

Steve

 

[sunsfan88]

How can you tell that he can't run a team when he has never got that opportunity?

If Dragic misses games cause of his contusion then we can see but to say he can't run a team right now is ridiculous.

And if he can average 20, 5 and 5 for the whole season, he will likely get a max offer from elsewhere and I would expect us to match it also.*

*please remember that we are talking about the rookie max here. Bledsoe will not be making $25M/season or anything.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Sure, he is averaging 19 points, 6 assists, and 5 rebounds, but he is also shooting 40% (20% for three), and 4.5 turnovers per game.

I am not disputing he is talented and has potential- I am just saying that some of you guys are overestimating that potential. At the end of the day, he is a 6'1 shooting guard who cannot shoot worth crap. He cannot run a team as he is NOT a point guard, and while I really like his defensive intensity, he is not really able to guard SGs.

It's actually 20-6-6 to be exact. Also it is really hard to put too much in shooting percentage this early because it can so easily be skewed in either direction. For example, if Bledsoe had 1 more made FGA right now he would be shooting 44.4%, 2 more made and it would be 48%. Bottom line is he had one tremendously efficient game against Portland (22 points on 12 FGAs) and and 1 mediocre efficient game against Utah (18 points on 15 FGAs). My prediction at the beginning of the year was that he would shoot around 44-46% from the field and that wouldn't be bad at all for a guard and I think he will keep his average right around 20 PPG as well.

 

[sunsfan88]

You don't need to be a #1 option to get a max contract and the Lakers have the most capspace next year.

This. I think too many people here are living in the past when only the top 10-15 players got the max. That's not the case any longer.

Even 3rd options are gonna start commanding max or very close to it soon.