Zach Allen

cheesebeef

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As had Murphy.

All offseason we heard on this board how terrible the Cardinals CBs were. Murphy has been a good player for a bit now, dating back to his 2nd season.

Once Hamilton is back and Mullen is up to speed, the CB room will sudden look decent.

Allen and Lawrence are 2/3s of a decent unit. I'd think the Cardinals will consider a DL in round one next year. If Allen isn't resigned, the DL is going to be a major worry. I bet Thomas slides into the DL rotation as well at some point.
Except no one was saying Murphy was terrible. Everyone was saying he was the ONLY dependable CB on the team. And Mullen wasn’t on the team until Week 1 so he didn’t factor at all into the CB room discussion. And Hamilton has proven two things in this league… Jack and Squat.

You can keep trying to rewrite the narrative of what the arguments were against our CB room during the off-season, but no matter how hard you try and lie about what was actually said, it won’t make your argument true.

Also, it’s very strange to be beating your chest about how people we’re overreacting to the CB room when the pass defense is ranked 31st in the NFL.
 
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Krangodnzr

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Except no one was saying Murphy was terrible. Everyone was saying he was the ONLY dependable CB on the team. And Mullen wasn’t on the team until Week 1 so he didn’t factor at all into the CB room discussion. And Hamilton has proven two things in this league… Jack and Squat.
Not true at all. "He is only a nickelback".


You can keep trying to rewrite the narrative of what the arguments were against our CB room during the off-season, but no matter how hard you try and lie about what was actually said, it won’t make your argument true.
Nope people downplayed Murphy. All I'm saying.
Also, it’s very strange to be beating your chest about how people we’re overreacting to the CB room when the pass defense is ranked 31st in the NFL.
I don't find it strange that cool bro is going to cool and act like a jerk.
 

Krangodnzr

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Except no one was saying Murphy was terrible. Everyone was saying he was the ONLY dependable CB on the team. And Mullen wasn’t on the team until Week 1 so he didn’t factor at all into the CB room discussion. And Hamilton has proven two things in this league… Jack and Squat.

You can keep trying to rewrite the narrative of what the arguments were against our CB room during the off-season, but no matter how hard you try and lie about what was actually said, it won’t make your argument true.

Also, it’s very strange to be beating your chest about how people we’re overreacting to the CB room when the pass defense is ranked 31st in the NFL.
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Feel free to find more takes. There were quite a bit. I guess negative people don't sense negativity like positive people do.

Even included the quote from @Chris_Sanders because he specifically stated that there were lots of negative posts about Murphy.

As far as 31st pass ranking goes...it's two games. It's not like the Cardinals played the Jets and Falcons.
 

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Feel free to find more takes. There were quite a bit. I guess negative people don't sense negativity like positive people do.

Even included the quote from @Chris_Sanders because he specifically stated that there were lots of negative posts about Murphy.

As far as 31st pass ranking goes...it's two games. It's not like the Cardinals played the Jets and Falcons.
Dude, you have an Android?

Sad!
 

cheesebeef

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Feel free to find more takes. There were quite a bit. I guess negative people don't sense negativity like positive people do.

Even included the quote from @Chris_Sanders because he specifically stated that there were lots of negative posts about Murphy.

As far as 31st pass ranking goes...it's two games. It's not like the Cardinals played the Jets and Falcons.
It’s a message board of thousands of posters with hundreds of posts a day. The overwhelming majority of the board agrees that Murphy is at least a solid corner if not better.

The problem is if people aren’t singing the outright praises of your favorite players, that is somehow damning those players as trash.

It’s almost like when you took on Tango’s username, a BODY PARTS like possession has come over you where you can’t help yourself take his attitude of “if you’re not whistling zippidy-doo-dah out of your butthole about the Cardinals then you’re actually just taking a dump on them.”

It’s lame and tired.

Lots of people bang on Watt’s health. VJ’s D. Kyler’s leadership. Kliff’s collapses. Keim’s atrocious drafting.

But you’re making it seem like Murphy and Allen get the same trashing as those critical figures. And they don’t. And it’s not even close. No matter how much you want to say they are because you’ve already decided that you need to call out other wide swaths of fans… even for takes only a small sample size actually made.
 

BritCard

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Many players won't negotiate during the season because they feel it is a distraction. I don't know if that is the case for these two. The overall point is that both players are showing a continuation of what they showed last year. At some point, all Keim is doing is costing the team more dollars similar to the Kyler situation by waiting.

Like, Murphy's agent is going to bring up his client shutting down Davante Adams in any convo moving forward.

Agents though right? Not like the players are involved. Most players aren't Lamar.
 

Krangodnzr

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It’s a message board of thousands of posters with hundreds of posts a day. The overwhelming majority of the board agrees that Murphy is at least a solid corner if not better.

The problem is if people aren’t singing the outright praises of your favorite players, that is somehow damning those players as trash.

It’s almost like when you took on Tango’s username, a BODY PARTS like possession has come over you where you can’t help yourself take his attitude of “if you’re not whistling zippidy-doo-dah out of your butthole about the Cardinals then you’re actually just taking a dump on them.”

It’s lame and tired.

Lots of people bang on Watt’s health. VJ’s D. Kyler’s leadership. Kliff’s collapses. Keim’s atrocious drafting.

But you’re making it seem like Murphy and Allen get the same trashing as those critical figures. And they don’t. And it’s not even close. No matter how much you want to say they are because you’ve already decided that you need to call out other wide swaths of fans… even for takes only a small sample size actually made.
LOL.

Search Zach Allen as well. Probably half this board said he wasn't that good all offseason.
 

Stout

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LOL.

Search Zach Allen as well. Probably half this board said he wasn't that good all offseason.
I wouldn't say that many thought he wasn't that good. A lot, myself included, didn't see him as a star or standout. I wouldn't say he's a star yet, but he's been a standout player and definitely deserves an extension.
 

Krangodnzr

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I wouldn't say that many thought he wasn't that good. A lot, myself included, didn't see him as a star or standout. I wouldn't say he's a star yet, but he's been a standout player and definitely deserves an extension.
The numbers put him on par with Quinnen Williams. He was in the top third in pressures for an interior DL.
 

Krangodnzr

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I’m guessing because you admitted you didn’t see him as a stand out when his numbers show that he was even last year….
We have an extreme case of posters acting like the Cardinals don't have any good players.

It's funny to be gaslit. I read it all offseason. The Cardinals have a enough good players to win.
 

Chopper0080

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We have an extreme case of posters acting like the Cardinals don't have any good players.

It's funny to be gaslit. I read it all offseason. The Cardinals have a enough good players to win.
To a degree. On defense we have Zach Allen, JJ Watt, Jalen, Budda, Golden and Murphy. On offense it kinda depends on what you think of AJ Green. If you think AJ is a good #2 WR, you probably think we have enough good players. If you don't, you probably don't.

My position is that we have a nice collection of above average NFL players but no great ones at this point. Outside of S, we do not have any player who would be deemed a top 5 player at their position. You could probably argue the same for top 10 tbh.

(EDIT: maybe Hopkins is still that guy, we will see when he returns.)
 

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It seems Allen's gameplay went up a level or two since Watt got there. Recall someone reported that Watt was teaching Allen some Edge moves last offseason.

I think there was something about Watt helping Allen understand leverage and in those highlights you can see it. I remember seeing an interview with a former OL talking about Reggie White and he said the thing people didn't get about him was how smart he was he knew he was going to be double teamed but it didn't matter because he'd get skinny between you so one guy had his left hand on him and one had his right hand on him when you tried to turn your body to be able to use both hands he'd sudden explode and knock you back.

Watt does it too and I think Allen is learning it even if you're not double teamed instead of just bull rushing right through the guy or trying to run around him, get one one shoulder or the the other and then put all your leverage into that side.
 

Stout

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We have an extreme case of posters acting like the Cardinals don't have any good players.

It's funny to be gaslit. I read it all offseason. The Cardinals have a enough good players to win.
Okay, now that is rich, coming from the guy who sneered and mocked and threw around scorn like candy all offseason, claiming the roster was fine and there wasn't anything to be concerned about, only to go silent once the season started and our weaknesses were laid bare. I like you advocating for a good player in Zach Allen, but playing the victim card doesn't fit or suit you.
 

Krangodnzr

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Okay, now that is rich, coming from the guy who sneered and mocked and threw around scorn like candy all offseason, claiming the roster was fine and there wasn't anything to be concerned about, only to go silent once the season started and our weaknesses were laid bare. I like you advocating for a good player in Zach Allen, but playing the victim card doesn't fit or suit you.
OMG hilarious.

My point was that all offseason quite a few posters acted like Allen and Murphy were meh players....while others (and not just "Kool aiders) used actually objective fact to argue otherwise.
 

Krangodnzr

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To a degree. On defense we have Zach Allen, JJ Watt, Jalen, Budda, Golden and Murphy. On offense it kinda depends on what you think of AJ Green. If you think AJ is a good #2 WR, you probably think we have enough good players. If you don't, you probably don't.

My position is that we have a nice collection of above average NFL players but no great ones at this point. Outside of S, we do not have any player who would be deemed a top 5 player at their position. You could probably argue the same for top 10 tbh.

(EDIT: maybe Hopkins is still that guy, we will see when he returns.)
Enough to have a winning record I should say, not win a championship.
 

cardpa

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OMG hilarious.

My point was that all offseason quite a few posters acted like Allen and Murphy were meh players....while others (and not just "Kool aiders) used actually objective fact to argue otherwise.
Murphy and Allen are solid players, nothing more than that. They are contributers who make plays from time to time but they are definitely not dominant players. They should be paid like solid players, not top 10 or even top 20 money.
 

dreamcastrocks

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Except no one was saying Murphy was terrible. Everyone was saying he was the ONLY dependable CB on the team. And Mullen wasn’t on the team until Week 1 so he didn’t factor at all into the CB room discussion. And Hamilton has proven two things in this league… Jack and Squat.

You can keep trying to rewrite the narrative of what the arguments were against our CB room during the off-season, but no matter how hard you try and lie about what was actually said, it won’t make your argument true.

Also, it’s very strange to be beating your chest about how people we’re overreacting to the CB room when the pass defense is ranked 31st in the NFL.
... and we are giving up a full 1 point more per drive than anyone else in the league!
 

Krangodnzr

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... and we are giving up a full 1 point more per drive than anyone else in the league!
That's what happens when you give up over 40 with only two games, the numbers are skewed.

This weeks game will tell us a lot more. If the Cardinals get totally boat raced, we will know this team can't compete.
 

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