Preliminary extension talks have begun with Shipley

[Solar7]

The O-line coaches job is to train and select the top 5 week to week. That Cole can't displace 3 experienced interior lineman at this point is hardly reason to wring one's hands. He has an important function and we'll see where he fits in seasons to come.

That we spent a third round pick on another player who barely contributes is a reason to wring our hands. Given that we're actively working to get back Shipley, it is clear we don't trust Cole and that when the time comes up for him to be a free agent, he will likely be gone.

This team needs to get into the business of drafting players that see the field, not that sit around as backups. This is already being discussed in another thread, but only 5 players that we have drafted actively start for us. And that's being generous and assuming Keim re-signs Humphries and Gunter.

 

[GuernseyCard]

That we spent a third round pick on another player who barely contributes is a reason to wring our hands. Given that we're actively working to get back Shipley, it is clear we don't trust Cole and that when the time comes up for him to be a free agent, he will likely be gone.

This team needs to get into the business of drafting players that see the field, not that sit around as backups. This is already being discussed in another thread, but only 5 players that we have drafted actively start for us. And that's being generous and assuming Keim re-signs Humphries and Gunter.

What is clear in the Cole case is your conjecture.

Having a cheap fit at three inside O-line positions and the added benefit that Cole played LT in College is an important game day asset. He's under control through the 2021 season.

Pugh is under contract through the end of 2022 and Sweezy is under control for next season.

Given below, it strikes me that re-signing Shipley is a good idea.

The offensive line was ranked No. 10 in the NFL for ESPN’s Pass-Block Win Rate, as Murray’s decision-making in the backfield was oftentimes more responsible for sacks than his blockers. A.Q. Shipley finished fifth among centers, winning 95% of his matchups.

 

[Solar7]

What is clear in the Cole case is your conjecture.

How is it conjecture? He lost the job this year. We are re-signing someone to start at his position. The only path he has to playing time next year is an injury. It is not conjecture to say the plan is to have him be a backup. Maybe, possibly, in 2021, Shipley will retire or Sweezy will leave, but until that happens, he is a backup not playing for us. It's not like OL is a rotational position like DL.

 

[Dayman]

The O-line coaches job is to train and select the top 5 week to week. That Cole can't displace 3 experienced interior lineman at this point is hardly reason to wring one's hands. He has an important function and we'll see where he fits in seasons to come.

He is the new Earl Watford. That isn't necessarily bad, but when was the last time you heard anyone around here lament not having Earl Watford around anymore?

 

[GuernseyCard]

How is it conjecture? He lost the job this year. We are re-signing someone to start at his position. The only path he has to playing time next year is an injury. It is not conjecture to say the plan is to have him be a backup. Maybe, possibly, in 2021, Shipley will retire or Sweezy will leave, but until that happens, he is a backup not playing for us. It's not like OL is a rotational position like DL.

Given that we're actively working to get back Shipley,

it is clear we don't trust Cole and that when the time comes up for him to be a free agent, he will likely be gone.

= Conjecture!

 

[GuernseyCard]

He is the new Earl Watford. That isn't necessarily bad, but when was the last time you heard anyone around here lament not having Earl Watford around anymore?

I remember Earl subbing at RG... not at left or centre and certainly couldn't play tackle in a pinch.

 

[Solar7]

Given that we're actively working to get back Shipley,

it is clear we don't trust Cole and that when the time comes up for him to be a free agent, he will likely be gone.

= Conjecture!

Okay, what indicates at all he's part of our long term future? We have shifted his position to one different than we drafted him at, one that has two firmly entrenched starters. This makes him a poor pick. Don't play, poor pick. Simple as that. Fine if you want to call that one comment conjecture, but he is not a good pick if he doesn't see the field. Not sure how someone could view the pick as a positive.

 

[CardNots]

Not exactly excited about this.

Hope the contract is only a safety net and he doesn’t make it through camp with little to no cap hit other than guarantees.

 

[Solar7]

I remember Earl subbing at RG... not at left or centre and certainly couldn't play tackle in a pinch.

Earl Watford was also a late 4th round pick. That's acceptable to be a backup bouncing between spots as needed. Cole was drafted at a point where we could have a player that starts or contributes for us at another position.

I personally wish Cole could have gotten a chance to start for us in 2019.

 

[Dayman]

I remember Earl subbing at RG... not at left or centre and certainly couldn't play tackle in a pinch.

Watford started at RT in 2015 when Massie was suspended. Played there a couple times in 2016, too. He also saw game action at LG, and there was a big offseason story in 2017 about him learning at Center.

 

[GuernseyCard]

Okay, what indicates at all he's part of our long term future? We have shifted his position to one different than we drafted him at, one that has two firmly entrenched starters. This makes him a poor pick. Don't play, poor pick. Simple as that. Fine if you want to call that one comment conjecture, but he is not a good pick if he doesn't see the field. Not sure how someone could view the pick as a positive.

Can't see why anyone would consider the last pick of the third round, who is presently the #1 sub at three positions on game day, as a negative. He's under control for two more seasons for under $2m.

We have issues this offseason but this one falls into the category of worrying about flies buzzing around your head when you're up to your ass in crocodiles.

 

[Solar7]

Can't see why anyone would consider the last pick of the third round, who is presently the #1 sub at three positions on game day, as a negative. He's under control for two more seasons for under $2m.

We have issues this offseason but this one falls into the category of worrying about flies buzzing around your head when you're up to your ass in crocodiles.

My concern is that exactly one player from the 2018 draft actually plays in games, and a good amount of us think he's a #3 WR and are looking for a #1. Same with 2017. One starter. Zero from 2016.

We're even sitting here right now with two starters from the 2019 draft, and really it's only Kyler that is guaranteed to be next year's starter.

It's a Keim thing. It's why we have 9 open starting roles going into 2020 and have to dole out a ton of free agency contracts instead of being able to target just a few elite guys to get us over the top.

 

[GuernseyCard]

Earl Watford was also a late 4th round pick. That's acceptable to be a backup bouncing between spots as needed. Cole was drafted at a point where we could have a player that starts or contributes for us at another position.

I personally wish Cole could have gotten a chance to start for us in 2019.

Cole was a supplemental pick at the end of the third round (97) one could argue he was first of the fourth round. Earl was Round: 4 / Pick: 116. A bit of a distinction without much difference.

 

[Solar7]

Cole was a supplemental pick at the end of the third round (97) one could argue he was first of the fourth round. Earl was Round: 4 / Pick: 116. A bit of a distinction without much difference.

I would argue that supplemental or not, in the third round, you're still looking for players that should have the capability to start. I wouldn't be frustrated if it at least looked like they had a game plan for developing him, and he had taken a year to supplant an outgoing starter, but instead he's trending in the wrong direction with a position change and all.

 

[GuernseyCard]

I would argue that supplemental or not, in the third round, you're still looking for players that should have the capability to start. I wouldn't be frustrated if it at least looked like they had a game plan for developing him, and he had taken a year to supplant an outgoing starter, but instead he's trending in the wrong direction with a position change and all.

The trend I see is that of a 23-year-old who could be a starter at one of three positions in the not too distant.

 

[Solar7]

The trend I see is that of a 23-year-old who could be a starter at one of three positions in the not too distant.

...You mean in the final year of his contract? Maybe? Just in time for us to pay him?

 

[wit3card]

Overall we need to upgrade over AQ Shipley, he is a bad run Blocker and against guys like Donald he gets pushed backwards into your QB.

He is worse than Sendline and Sendline wasn't great. For me Bohem played not that much worse last year with the two statues in backfield.



Shipley should be a backup C and not the starter on a Team that wants to have more wins than loses in a devision with guys like Donald. Because if we can't run, we are very one dimensional and if the opponent DL dictates what we can do or don't this will always be games were we are more likely to lose then to win.

 

[wa52lz]

He is the new Earl Watford. That isn't necessarily bad, but when was the last time you heard anyone around here lament not having Earl Watford around anymore?

I was lamenting it last year for sure.

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[wa52lz]

Maybe we should wait to see what type of deal Shipley is getting. $5 million to be a starter or another $1.5-2 indicating they want him back but hope he isn't the starter. The guy was a captain so he is definitely respected by his teammates and someone the organization wants around. I think the fact that Cole was getting regular snaps(not filling in for injury) at three positions down the stretch indicates the team sees value and a future for him. Why would they be wasting snaps on a guy that you think is sub par especially when he was protecting your #1 overall pick.

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[wa52lz]

That wasn’t the context of my comment. I said that resigning an elderly underwhelming Shipley can be taken as an indictment of galliards “progress” (or apparent lack thereof).

You said nothing about the possibility of Gaillard's progress not going well, your comment was that he was a swing and a miss.

"To me it screams Cole and galliard are swings and misses in the draft. Again. By bluto."

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[Solar7]

Maybe we should wait to see what type of deal Shipley is getting. $5 million to be a starter or another $1.5-2 indicating they want him back but hope he isn't the starter. The guy was a captain so he is definitely respected by his teammates and someone the organization wants around. I think the fact that Cole was getting regular snaps(not filling in for injury) at three positions down the stretch indicates the team sees value and a future for him. Why would they be wasting snaps on a guy that you think is sub par especially when he was protecting your #1 overall pick.

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Uhhh... Sweezy had an ankle injury he struggled with throughout the end of the season. That wasn't just "here have some snaps man."

He even took a snap at WR.

 

[GuernseyCard]

...You mean in the final year of his contract? Maybe? Just in time for us to pay him?

Yes, I imagine that he will be paid for services to be rendered; in fact, I believe it's required.

 

[GuernseyCard]

Overall we need to upgrade over AQ Shipley, he is a bad run Blocker and against guys like Donald he gets pushed backwards into your QB.

He is worse than Sendline and Sendline wasn't great. For me Bohem played not that much worse last year with the two statues in backfield.



Shipley should be a backup C and not the starter on a Team that wants to have more wins than loses in a devision with guys like Donald. Because if we can't run, we are very one dimensional and if the opponent DL dictates what we can do or don't this will always be games were we are more likely to lose then to win.

Did you take a moment to look at our run stats before posting?

AQ centred a line that delivered the second highest average per carry in the League (5yds)

AND

The offensive line was ranked No. 10 in the NFL per ESPN’s Pass-Block Win Rate and Shipley finished fifth among centers, winning 95% of his matchups.

Sendlein, Boehm - ???

 

[Solar7]

Yes, I imagine that he will be paid for services to be rendered; in fact, I believe it's required.

In time for us to pay him a nice fancy contract if we want to keep him around, I mean.

 

[mjb21aztd]

Well guess will always be mediocre at center...

Hoping cards atleast improves lbers... and not sign a aging one