I've never had more hope for a HC and staff

Krangodnzr

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You then went on to excuse every single one of his mistakes that you deigned to reply to. He was HORRIBLE with those bad, needless spins into the pass rush, where he often spurned a pocket and caused a sack where he didn't need to. He was AWFUL at long throws. Etc. The list goes on. He was bad, independent of anybody else, last year. Yes, Kliffy gets the lion's share of the blame. Yes, Kyler was bad last season and could have been a lot better. Both can be true.

I know, I'm beating my head against the wall, but you are great at painting over his faults.
I mean, we saw countless videos of multiple players open that Murray missed.
 

CardNots

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It seemed Kyler was focused on Hopkins.

The other slant on this, his visibility over or through the offensive line wasn’t good.

If Kyler is the long term solution at the QB position Gannon will need to scheme more visibility for him.

In another post, it was mentioned QB under center for Dobbs was far less in our offense set than I expected. Maybe this is the model used for Kyler when he returns.

Dobbs is 6’3 and I noticed plays where Kyler doesn’t make the throw due to the pressure. It could be we have faced aggressive DLs so far and the scheme isn’t related to Kyler at all.

It will be very interesting to see how Gannon and company will utilize Kyler.

The other question, what happens with the 6’3 Tune when Kyler returns to game time. Can they sneak him on the practice squad or do they carry 3 QBs on the 53 man roster?
 

Garthshort

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I know very little of what the team will do, but since Tune is a Monti 'pick' I would think they'd keep him on the 53. And if they don't it tells me that they are not as high on him as fans are. Keep in mind I started this post with I know very little........
 

cheesebeef

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Not even close! I can't believe no one has hung the Squidward moniker on him yet! Since he's earning some good early reviews we can do so in good fun, rather than as an insult. :D

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I prefer Dr. Evil.
 

BirdGangThing

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Not even close! I can't believe no one has hung the Squidward moniker on him yet! Since he's earning some good early reviews we can do so in good fun, rather than as an insult. :D

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I've just been calling him the Shiny One
 

Redsz

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What has impressed me is JGs effect on our Defense. They are playing above their talent level which is direct reflection on coaching. It's nice to see. Hope it continues.
 

DaHilg

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Not smart enough to be an NFL head coach and he knew it.

McDaniels is so much brighter an offensive mind it isn't even funny - literally different leagues.
Wild that anyone would disagree with this post at this point.
 

slanidrac16

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Interesting article on Gannon by ESPN.

Gannon
Nice. I think his scouting background is a big part of his success. To recognize how a players talent and ability fits his scheme has got to be a good thing.
I really thought Gannon was going to be jumping all over the sidelines during games.
Instead he’s as cool as a cucumber.
 

kerouac9

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Nice. I think his scouting background is a big part of his success. To recognize how a players talent and ability fits his scheme has got to be a good thing.
I really thought Gannon was going to be jumping all over the sidelines during games.
Instead he’s as cool as a cucumber.
Weinfuss is such a terrible writer.
 

CardsSunsDbacks

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Eh…he definitely could’ve played better last year. That being said the whole organization was a clown car sh-t show last year.
Well it's hard for a QB to play all that well when the talent and scheming isn't very good. Of course it can also work the other way where the QB can make those things look worse. No way to be 100% sure how much blame each one holds.

What I will say is that the team looks way more prepared and organized on both sides of the ball so far with JG at the helm and IMO a much less talented QB under center right now in Dobbs. I have a hard time seeing Kyler not at least matching and probably exceeding the performance of Dobbs so far.
 

PACardsFan

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No Kliff didn't use motion much at all. Still doesn't change the fact that Murray has plenty of blame on himself for his poor play.
OROY, 2 pro bowls & 1 year of unmitigated disasters that he had very little to do with NEVER EVER equates to plenty of blame & poor play. People have a very short memory. When you literally have to carry a team on your shoulders, it will ALWAYS catch up to you. Archie Manning was one of the greatest QB’s to ever enter the NFL, but he never got rescued from a pathetic organization & poor coaching.
 

Krangodnzr

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Well it's hard for a QB to play all that well when the talent and scheming isn't very good. Of course it can also work the other way where the QB can make those things look worse. No way to be 100% sure how much blame each one holds.
The answer is that both hold blame. Kliffs scheme worked when players weren't checked out. Once the team hit some adversity and play fell off, there was no accountability for mistakes. That includes Kyler too.

The Kyler apologists can't explain away how many errant deep passes he threw. Statistically he was amongst the worst deep passers in the league. That was uncharacteristic of his career so far, but that's on Kyler to complete those passes. One could argue if he had completed those passes at his career average, the Cardinals absolutely win more. This also isn't accounting for all of the open receivers he wasn't seeing either.
 

Krangodnzr

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OROY, 2 pro bowls & 1 year of unmitigated disasters that he had very little to do with NEVER EVER equates to plenty of blame & poor play. People have a very short memory. When you literally have to carry a team on your shoulders, it will ALWAYS catch up to you. Archie Manning was one of the greatest QB’s to ever enter the NFL, but he never got rescued from a pathetic organization & poor coaching.
This isn't the binary argument you are making it out to be.

Murray very much showed a lot of promise until last year. I haven't forgotten that.

But you are clearly in denial. He played poorly last year.
 

CardsSunsDbacks

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The answer is that both hold blame. Kliffs scheme worked when players weren't checked out. Once the team hit some adversity and play fell off, there was no accountability for mistakes. That includes Kyler too.

The Kyler apologists can't explain away how many errant deep passes he threw. Statistically he was amongst the worst deep passers in the league. That was uncharacteristic of his career so far, but that's on Kyler to complete those passes. One could argue if he had completed those passes at his career average, the Cardinals absolutely win more. This also isn't accounting for all of the open receivers he wasn't seeing either.
Sure, but we may find that Kliff holds a vast majority of the blame once Kyler gets back on the field. Or we will find that Kyler was a bigger part of it than we think. Can't be sure until we see him out there playing for a new coach.
 

Krangodnzr

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Sure, but we may find that Kliff holds a vast majority of the blame once Kyler gets back on the field. Or we will find that Kyler was a bigger part of it than we think. Can't be sure until we see him out there playing for a new coach.

The hope is that Kyler has grown, because what we have seen from him so far isn't good enough to lead this team. I'm a huge Kyler Murray fan, but to act like Murray wasn't part and parcel a part of the problem last year is just straight ignoring objective facts.

Kliff ain't here anymore and so far the JG/Monti experiment is looking pretty damn positive.
 
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