Rapoport: Cardinals trading out of #3 very very likely

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Simeon Rice or Jonathan Ogden?

That’s not really arguing in good faith because:

1. You chose a loaded antagonist in rice who is despised on the board for abandoning the cards and calling us the armpit of the nfl;

2. You play games with hindsight selecting an okay passrusher and a HOF tackle;

3. If both had stayed and lived up to their billing rice would’ve been more impactful bc our defense would have had to carry us because we never had a QB worth protecting, thereby lessening Ogden’s value; and I’ll play . . .

4. . . Tony mandarich or Derrick Thomas?

 

[QuebecCard]

That’s not really arguing in good faith because:

1. You chose a loaded antagonist in rice who is despised on the board for abandoning the cards and calling us the armpit of the nfl;

2. You play games with hindsight selecting an okay passrusher and a HOF tackle;

3. If both had stayed and lived up to their billing rice would’ve been more impactful bc our defense would have had to carry us because we never had a QB worth protecting, thereby lessening Ogden’s value; and I’ll play . . .

4. . . Tony mandarich or Derrick Thomas?

122 sacks = better than OK.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

122 sacks = better than OK.

Regardless, he wasn’t comparing apples to apples

 

[BritCard]

It's rare that a player improves on inaccuracy, not the norm

Also, Allen was a big time prospect going into his junior year and he wasn't surrounded by the level of talent Richardson had at Florida.

Richardson was terrible on film, his stock is going up because he is running around an empty field and throwing it to trainers.

This reminds me of when Yi Jianlian had his stock climb prior to the NBA draft because of his workout footwork while being guarded by... a chair...

It really depends why they are inaccurate.

I can see Richardson getting better because I think a lot of his accuracy issues aren't mental or arm talent but are down to mechanics. They are pretty bad, especially his feet.

Fix his feet and you may see a big leap, also may not.

 

[Krangodnzr]

That’s not really arguing in good faith because:

1. You chose a loaded antagonist in rice who is despised on the board for abandoning the cards and calling us the armpit of the nfl;

2. You play games with hindsight selecting an okay passrusher and a HOF tackle;

3. If both had stayed and lived up to their billing rice would’ve been more impactful bc our defense would have had to carry us because we never had a QB worth protecting, thereby lessening Ogden’s value; and I’ll play . . .

4. . . Tony mandarich or Derrick Thomas?

Naw it's not loaded.

It was an actual choice that the Cardinals made.

Rice was a fantastic pass rusher. If Anderson is as good as Rice, we will be ecstatic.

But the difference between an elite edge vs an elite LT is that an elite LT gives you more overall value. They win way more often than an elite edge does.

LOL Mandarich vs Thomas? That's a completely different equation. One was a monumental bust. I at least provided a choice between a near HOF edge vs a HOF LT, and a choice that the Cardinals actually made.

Calling Rice an okay pass rusher is ridiculous. He was fantastic.

 

[Krangodnzr]

It really depends why they are inaccurate.

I can see Richardson getting better because I think a lot of his accuracy issues aren't mental or arm talent but are down to mechanics. They are pretty bad, especially his feet.

Fix his feet and you may see a big leap, also may not.

It's really hard to just change mechanics.

 

[kerouac9]

I thought Ogden told us not to draft him. I think it was in The Blind Side.

 

[QuebecCard]

Naw it's not loaded.

It was an actual choice that the Cardinals made.

Rice was a fantastic pass rusher. If Anderson is as good as Rice, we will be ecstatic.

But the difference between an elite edge vs an elite LT is that an elite LT gives you more overall value. They win way more often than an elite edge does.

LOL Mandarich vs Thomas? That's a completely different equation. One was a monumental bust. I at least provided a choice between a near HOF edge vs a HOF LT, and a choice that the Cardinals actually made.

Calling Rice an okay pass rusher is ridiculous. He was fantastic.

Mandarich wasn't quite the 'bust' often quoted as an example. He flamed out as a tackle but came back after rehab as a starting guard and had a few good years until injuries caught up with him.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

calling us the armpit of the nfl;

In retrospect, armpit seems getting off easy.

 

[RON_IN_OC]

Mandarich wasn't quite the 'bust' often quoted as an example. He flamed out as a tackle but came back after rehab as a starting guard and had a few good years until injuries caught up with him.

He was a bust from the standpoint of where he was drafted and expectations. He will even own up to it. Ironically, he's become an awesome photographer and has his business in the Phoenix area. I've attended workshops with him and he's a pretty cool dude.

 

[QuebecCard]

He was a bust from the standpoint of where he was drafted and expectations. He will even own up to it. Ironically, he's become an awesome photographer and has his business in the Phoenix area. I've attended workshops with him and he's a pretty cool dude.

His older brother was a long-time O-lineman in the CFL who died prematurely from skin cancer.

 

[TRW]

ASFN should just shut down for the day

Day of Maintenance. Maintenance of some's sanity. LOL

 

[RON_IN_OC]

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

 

[dreamcastrocks]

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

2nd and a 3rd isn't enough IMO.

 

[Snakester]

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

If we are targeting Carter then we probably end up with him along with the high 2nd and 3rd. Or that other DE.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

If we are targeting Carter then we probably end up with him along with the high 2nd and 3rd. Or that other DE.

I could see that. Thought the same thing when I thought about the trade back. I still think they should get another 2nd or 3rd at least.

 

[Snakester]

I could see that. Thought the same thing when I thought about the trade back. I still think they should get another 2nd or 3rd at least.

I can definitely see a 2024 pick added as well.

 

[Cheesebeef]

That’s not really arguing in good faith because:

1. You chose a loaded antagonist in rice who is despised on the board for abandoning the cards and calling us the armpit of the nfl;

2. You play games with hindsight selecting an okay passrusher and a HOF tackle;

3. If both had stayed and lived up to their billing rice would’ve been more impactful bc our defense would have had to carry us because we never had a QB worth protecting, thereby lessening Ogden’s value; and I’ll play . . .

4. . . Tony mandarich or Derrick Thomas?

ouchie... come on dude. Simeon was an "okay" pass-rusher? he was one of the best pass rushers of his era.

that said, there is NO ONE CLOSE to Jonathan Ogden in this draft so making the comparison as if that's what we're looking at here doesn't make sense either. not sure if that's whats happening as I skimmed this.

and I think both you and krang are cacca-doo-doo heads.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

ouchie... come on dude. Simeon was an "okay" pass-rusher? he was one of the best pass rushers of his era.

that said, there is NO ONE CLOSE to Jonathan Ogden in this draft so making the comparison as if that's what we're looking at here doesn't make sense either. not sure if that's whats happening as I skimmed this.

and I think both you and krang are cacca-doo-doo heads.

Couldn't agree more.

 

[football karma]

in the FWIW file:

PFF was doing a post combine mock.... from the combine

something interesting they said: the mock draft world views the gap between Anderson and Tyree Wilson as large, but NFL people view the gap between them as small

 

[Arz101]

Where is Keim when we need to draft another line backer?

 

[bankybruce]

2nd and a 3rd isn't enough IMO.

Arizona
3 - 2200

Oakland
7 - 1500
38 - 520
70 - 240
Total - 2260

Fair trade

2024 NFL Trade Value Chart

 

[GatorAZ]

Option 1:
Cards take Anderson at #3

Option 2:
Cards trade back with Panthers to #9 for the Trey Lance package (two 1st’s not including #9 plus additional 3rd) and Anderson goes #4 before Seattle

 

[BritCard]

2nd and a 3rd isn't enough IMO.

Yup. Jurecki is a bonehead who thinks the trade value chart is a recipe book.

The pick value charts just tells you what a pick is worth. If someone wants something you aren't selling they have to overpay.

History already provides a trade value chart for us and it's all over the place because it depends how much a team wants to move up and how much one want to move down.

These picks to move back 4 spots is peanuts. The Rams moved back 4 spots from 2nd to 6th in the RG3 trade and got 3 first round picks and a 2nd round pick.

The Ryan Leaf trade for the Cardinals got them an extra 2nd round and 1st round pick just for moving from 2nd to 3rd.

If Stroud is available at #3 and somebody loves him, or Richardson and somebody loves him, then the Cards should get a haul for trading back. Whether it be Raiders, Falcons or Panthers.

The Raiders would need to give up at least a 2nd and 4th this year plus next years 1st. Bare minimum.

And if you have multiple teams you can play off against each other the sky is the limit.

 

[BritCard]

in the FWIW file:

PFF was doing a post combine mock.... from the combine

something interesting they said: the mock draft world views the gap between Anderson and Tyree Wilson as large, but NFL people view the gap between them as small

I just don't believe that. Nobody can watch those 2 players and think the gap is small.

Wilson's agent is a legend.