Mythbusters: PFF Edition

Krangodnzr

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I just want to get better on the line, man. None of our players are or ever have been elite there in my lifetime, and it's tough to swallow another 4-5 years of a guy who is only worth re-signing because we're scared of the alternative. It seems like a perfect time to get a blue chip offensive line talent even if we suffer marginally for part of a year while he gets up to speed.

I'm not going to scream and cry if we retain him, but it's just so meh. Everyone seems to want these flashy/sexy picks without building what successful teams seem to have.

Not every team with a blue chip lineman has the LT as their best player.

Draft someone like Wirfs and you got yourself a monster RT
 

Krangodnzr

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No. I think Kyler bailed them out and they still sucked as much as I expected. They're a bottom tier OL, and just because they played like garbage instead of hot garbage does not mean they're improved.

What's to say they won't be better with another year together is that they're limited by talent. There is not a single guy on this OL that would be guaranteed a starting spot on any other roster in the league.

This of course ignores the fact that the run game set a Cardinals record for yards per carry.
 
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BritCard

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I know how how the CAP works!

And, yes, that's precisely how it would be structured.

Johnson didn't tear his MCL. It was a strain and he didn't require surgery.

"Jan 1, 2017 NFL Knee MCL Sprain Grade 2"

"A grade 2 MCL injury means that your ligament has been partially torn."
 
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BritCard

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That's assuming ANY of the top tackles this year can play LT at even a middling NFL level.

Wirfs? RT mostly
Wills? RT
Thomas? Scouts doubt he can even hold up at EITHER tackle.
Becton? LT but he's raw.

What we 100% know is Hump can't play tackle at a middling NFL level. Middle by definition is average. Hump is not average.
 
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BritCard

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We also need to stop thinking about individual players when we evaluate the offensive line. Think of the offensive line as a unit.

Wouldn’t you agree this o-line played better this year than expected? What’s to say they won’t even be better with another year together?

Read any analysts break down of our needs there are only 2 versions of the same story.

The first is they say we desperately need to improve the O line because it sucks. So they have us drafting O line at #8.

The second is they have us taking Lamb at #8 but always mention that O line is the biggest need but they can't resist pairing Lamb with Murray.

If you look at the wider NFL media world can anyone find a single person that thinks our O line should stay the same? The universal consensus is that it's still bad. Just not so God awful bad as last year.
 

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"Jan 1, 2017 NFL Knee MCL Sprain Grade 2"

"A grade 2 MCL injury means that your ligament has been partially torn."

He didn't go under the knife and was squatting 500+ early in the off-season. And, yes, one can make the technical argument that every strain has a tearing effect. Happy now?
 

Krangodnzr

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Read any analysts break down of our needs there are only 2 versions of the same story.

The first is they say we desperately need to improve the O line because it sucks. So they have us drafting O line at #8.

The second is they have us taking Lamb at #8 but always mention that O line is the biggest need but they can't resist pairing Lamb with Murray.

If you look at the wider NFL media world can anyone find a single person that thinks our O line should stay the same? The universal consensus is that it's still bad. Just not so God awful bad as last year.

Right....because the national media watches every Cardinals game.

They look at the stats and see over 50 sacks! OMGz the Cardinals need OLz! Instead of you know, crunching the numbers and seeing that about the same time that they abandoned the I'll fitting 10 personnel, protection improved dramatically.

Weak sauce argument.
 
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Hes has the Humphries Derangement Syndrome. LOL

I, like literally everyone in football, think Hump is a bottom tier LT.

About 95% of Cards fans thought the same until 2 months ago. I bet if I looked I could find a whole bunch of old posts bashing Hump.

One year healthy with 2 sacks because Kyler evaded a bunch and some want to give him 55m+.

I prefer to judge players on what they have been most of the time. Not the one healthy contract year they decided to turn up. Even then he was the 23rd ranked LT.

From where I'm standing I'm not the deluded one.
 

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I, like literally everyone in football, think Hump is a bottom tier LT.

About 95% of Cards fans thought the same until 2 months ago. I bet if I looked I could find a whole bunch of old posts bashing Hump.

One year healthy with 2 sacks because Kyler evaded a bunch and some want to give him 55m+.

I prefer to judge players on what they have been most of the time. Not the one healthy contract year they decided to turn up. Even then he was the 23rd ranked LT.

From where I'm standing I'm not the deluded one.

'Weak sauce' arguments invariably have unsupported claims of support and percentages pulled from the nether region and always end with the delusional assertion of being the only rational, sane person in the debate.
 

Solar7

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Not every team with a blue chip lineman has the LT as their best player.

Draft someone like Wirfs and you got yourself a monster RT
I'm fine with Wirfs too, and he doesn't have to replace Humphries.

I just want a really great player somewhere across the line.

This of course ignores the fact that the run game set a Cardinals record for yards per carry.
Just because we've been awful and weren't as awful does not mean we are good.
 

WildBB

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No. I think Kyler bailed them out and they still sucked as much as I expected. They're a bottom tier OL, and just because they played like garbage instead of hot garbage does not mean they're improved.

What's to say they won't be better with another year together is that they're limited by talent. There is not a single guy on this OL that would be guaranteed a starting spot on any other roster in the league.
I think you underestimate how bad too many teams are there. Yes QB's make a huge difference. But difference between last yr. and 2018 was we actually had all our starters sans RT. It was a pretty big step forward for this group.
 

Solar7

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I think you underestimate how bad too many teams are there. Yes QB's make a huge difference. But difference between last yr. and 2018 was we actually had all our starters sans RT. It was a pretty big step forward for this group.
Many teams are terrible there. The good ones aren't. That's the issue.

I am sick and tired of comparing anything to 2018. We were historically bad. Let's compare it to 2015, the year we had a legitimate shot at winning it all, where we should want to be as fans.
 

WildBB

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Many teams are terrible there. The good ones aren't. That's the issue.

I am sick and tired of comparing anything to 2018. We were historically bad. Let's compare it to 2015, the year we had a legitimate shot at winning it all, where we should want to be as fans.
Stay healthy, keep adding legit pieces. I'm seeing improvement, keep improving. Keep getting more physical. Ramming speeedddd. :D :newcards:
 

Krangodnzr

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I'm fine with Wirfs too, and he doesn't have to replace Humphries.

I just want a really great player somewhere across the line.


Just because we've been awful and weren't as awful does not mean we are good.

No, not a good group, but much closer to league average than awful. Replace Justin Murray and have him as a backup. Draft Wirfs, Wills, or Becton and watch the group become pretty good.
 
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'Weak sauce' arguments invariably have unsupported claims of support and percentages pulled from the nether region and always end with the delusional assertion of being the only rational, sane person in the debate.

Here's your franchise LT

On the floor, leading to an INT. Oh but it wasn't a sack so it doesn't count right?

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Or here letting a free runner to Kyler in his 1st ever road game

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Here's fans voting pre season to send Hump AND a 2nd round pick for a 31 year old injury prone LT

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Here's Bleacher Reports "Most overpaid players on every team" where DJ took the crown. And thats when he was paid $10m.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2840350-every-nfl-teams-most-overpaid-player#slide1

Here's DJ getting owned by rookie Bradley Chubb late in 2018

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Then there's all the crucial penalties

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https://twitter.com/Kyle_Odegard/status/1190067806705840128

https://twitter.com/sbordow/status/1185991554240012289


And I know with every bone in my body as soon as he signs that deal it's back to the same old Hump. Poor play, 5 games a season, then IR with a knee injury.
 
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BritCard

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Bite your tongue!

DJ is mediocre, and both his floor and ceiling is mediocre! He's barely worth a bucket of spit.

He had one good game all season against the Niners in a short week Thursday night game. Big whoop.
 

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Might take pictures & frame Brit’s reaction once Humphries returns.
 

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I take 30 seconds to post and anal BritCard is off on a wild search to find a bit of video in support of his preposterous assertions.

Easiest guy to windup since Mitch!
 
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BritCard

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I take 30 seconds to post and anal BritCard is off on a wild search to find a bit of video in support of his preposterous assertions.

Easiest guy to windup since Mitch!

Took me about a minute. Search his name on Twitter and all you get is clips of him getting punk'd, DJ saying he thinks he's one of the best tackles in the league (lol), fans complaining about him sucking, articles saying we shouldn't take his 5th year option, posts about his penalties and notifications of him being put on IR.

He's clearly not a good player and frankly if Keim hadn't put us in a position where we have no alternatives there wouldn't be anyone here fighting to keep him. The only argument is, "Well he's not complete trash and we have nobody else so what choice do we have?"

But you do you. You don't agree, thats fine. We can revisit this next season when he hits IR after game 4 and you can tell me how it wasn't his fault he got rolled up on or some other BS.
 

GuernseyCard

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Took me about a minute. Search his name on Twitter and all you get is clips of him getting punk'd, DJ saying he thinks he's one of the best tackles in the league (lol), fans complaining about him sucking, articles saying we shouldn't take his 5th year option, posts about his penalties and notifications of him being put on IR.

He's clearly not a good player and frankly if Keim hadn't put us in a position where we have no alternatives there wouldn't be anyone here fighting to keep him. The only argument is, "Well he's not complete trash and we have nobody else so what choice do we have?"

But you do you. You don't agree, thats fine. We can revisit this next season when he hits IR after game 4 and you can tell me how it wasn't his fault he got rolled up on or some other BS.

:violin:
Take a pill!
 
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