Herm will be Back in 2022

AzStevenCal

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The fact is Herm stinks as a coach. ASU could hire literally just about anybody and get essentially the same results they have gotten with Herm. He has done pretty much the same as Graham, Erickson, and Koetter... all of whom were acknowledged underachievers here. The only difference being they didn't have some old pal as the AD covering for them.
I think you've blacked out some of the memories since Cooper left. Marmie went 22-31-1.

Bruce Snyder had a decent winning percentage thanks to back to back years where we went 20-4 but he was a sleep inducing 38-41 over the other 7 seasons.

Dirk went 40-34 but we all know it wasn't just our record that got him fired.

Todd Graham started out great going 28-12 but closed out his ASU career with 3 seasons where he went 18-20.

Ignoring the 2-2 Covid season, Herm is 23-15 over his 3 years. That's not exactly impressive and the infractions detract from his legacy but 8 wins per season still shines compared to what we've seen the past three plus decades.
 

Absolute Zero

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The fact is Herm stinks as a coach. ASU could hire literally just about anybody and get essentially the same results they have gotten with Herm. He has done pretty much the same as Graham, Erickson, and Koetter... all of whom were acknowledged underachievers here. The only difference being they didn't have some old pal as the AD covering for them.


I appreciate the sentiment, but you are overstating your case. The Pac12 is full of mediocre and floundering programs and coaching turnover. There's at least a half dozen HC's out there in the PAC12 alone that would not fare any better at ASU.
 

ASUCHRIS

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This team is going nowhere fast with Herm at the helm. Our only real chance was for AP and the boys to recruit, and for this staff to take advantage of a down Pac. They failed miserably, and now there is no direction, and we're stuck with Herm, a guy who the game has passed, and a HC who is lacking the passion necessary to lead a program.

Yay!
 

Mainstreet

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This team is going nowhere fast with Herm at the helm. Our only real chance was for AP and the boys to recruit, and for this staff to take advantage of a down Pac. They failed miserably, and now there is no direction, and we're stuck with Herm, a guy who the game has passed, and a HC who is lacking the passion necessary to lead a program.

Yay!

If ASU had an opportunity to replace Herm with a better coach I would support it.

What I think happened this last season (besides injury and the NCAA investigation) is ASU lost several coaches due to suspension. That had to impact play on the field.
 

Absolute Zero

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This team is going nowhere fast with Herm at the helm. Our only real chance was for AP and the boys to recruit, and for this staff to take advantage of a down Pac. They failed miserably, and now there is no direction, and we're stuck with Herm, a guy who the game has passed, and a HC who is lacking the passion necessary to lead a program.

Yay! :sarcasm:

FIFY

I know that all sports teams need to shoot for the championship. That is what I want for ASU, Championship, Pac 12 Title, Rose Bowl, Pac 12 South championship, etc. But there is also part of me what wonders how realistic that is every year, competing with over 120 other schools, all the injuries that had key players out in the big games this year, coaching suspensions, and the fact that these players are just "kids". I don't know, the stars really didn't line up for us this year, we are probably pretty fortunate to finish 8-4.
 

ASUCHRIS

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If ASU had an opportunity to replace Herm with a better coach I would support it.
Me too, considering the circumstances, we'd probably be looking at a Danny Gonzales type hire looking for significant guarantees. I'd rather keep Herm around for that.

What I think happened this last season (besides injury and the NCAA investigation) is ASU lost several coaches due to suspension. That had to impact play on the field.
People can make whatever excuses they want, this is an undisciplined team that never learned details.
 

Mainstreet

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Me too, considering the circumstances, we'd probably be looking at a Danny Gonzales type hire looking for significant guarantees. I'd rather keep Herm around for that.


People can make whatever excuses they want, this is an undisciplined team that never learned details.

I think losing several coaches had to impact the play on the field although a more disciplinary type coach would have cleaned up a lot of the penalties.

There are no excuses for that many flags.
 

Raindog

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Me too, considering the circumstances, we'd probably be looking at a Danny Gonzales type hire looking for significant guarantees. I'd rather keep Herm around for that.


People can make whatever excuses they want, this is an undisciplined team that never learned details.

This.

I don't expect ASU to be in the playoffs every year (or even any year, really), but I do think it's reasonable to expect an upward trend of performance on the field if the coaching staff is even mildly competent, instead of the massive backslide of fundamentals we have seen under Herm.

And as for Herm's record so far vs. his predecessors, well we only have the half story on that. Most of the ones AZStevenCal referenced did very well immediately after inheriting the prior regime's upper level classes, and then gradually trended downward once their own indolence permeated the program. I am afraid that is the same cycle we are seeing with Herm. The idea was allegedly he was going to be here for a couple/three years to set a template for success and a successful transition to another coach. Now it's starting to look like he's just another guy coasting and collecting paychecks until he hits retirement... not much unlike Mr. Erickson of not so long ago.
 

Mainstreet

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This.

I don't expect ASU to be in the playoffs every year (or even any year, really), but I do think it's reasonable to expect an upward trend of performance on the field if the coaching staff is even mildly competent, instead of the massive backslide of fundamentals we have seen under Herm.

And as for Herm's record so far vs. his predecessors, well we only have the half story on that. Most of the ones AZStevenCal referenced did very well immediately after inheriting the prior regime's upper level classes, and then gradually trended downward once their own indolence permeated the program. I am afraid that is the same cycle we are seeing with Herm. The idea was allegedly he was going to be here for a couple/three years to set a template for success and a successful transition to another coach. Now it's starting to look like he's just another guy coasting and collecting paychecks until he hits retirement... not much unlike Mr. Erickson of not so long ago.

Herm doesn't strike me as someone who is in it for the money. He could be doing sports on television if he wanted.
 

Raindog

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Herm doesn't strike me as someone who is in it for the money. He could be doing sports on television if he wanted.
But was anyone paying him $4 million per year to be on TV? I am not guessing so.
 

Absolute Zero

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...And so will Lole... this is great news:

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Mainstreet

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I wasn't quite sure where to put this. Chase Lucas has accepted an invitation to play in the 2022 East-West Shrine Bowl.

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