Drafting Andy Isabella over D.K. Metcalf... Damn!

Russ Smith

The Original Whizzinator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
84,235
Reaction score
32,848
AJ Brown was the bigger miss. I remember seeing him the year before he was draft eligible and touting him as the Cards 1st rounder when he was in the draft. Of course, I didn’t know they’d have the #1 overall but they could’ve had him.

Any scout that had Isabella with a higher grade than Brown or MCLaurin should probably be selling insurance or in another line of work.


Yeah but we took Isabella over Metcalf, Brown was already off the board, to get him we don't take a CB in round 2 at least not where we did.

McLaurin the whole NFL missed on twice, he was the best rookie WR in the draft until they changed Qb's, Brown will probably end up better he's so much bigger, but McLaurin is legit.
 

Chopper0080

2021 - Prove It
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
26,631
Reaction score
34,717
Location
Colorado
I read a PFF story an interview with Isabella from Feb before the draft. He was talking about how frustrating playing the slot at the Senior bowl was, but it was a learning experience. And he said his goal was to be a big play guy, OBJ, Tyreek Hill at the NFL level. he wanted to show teams he could play outside not have to move to the slot because of his size.

So to reiterate, Keim and KK drafted a guy who played outside in college, was recruited as a RB, and who admitted he was "frustrated" trying to play slot at the Senior Bowl, and they drafted him to play out of the slot, and they expected him to contribute right away coming from a small school? I hope he figures it out but even the PFF guys, who loved him, said things we've all seen. Doesn't run good routes, he himself said that's teh problem with the slot you can't just use your speed you have to run great routes. Couldn't get off the press well, even PFF said that's true but when guys come up to get him and miss, he's going to beat them deep. That happend a few times but not many. And one guy, who had him in the first round, said "his catch radius is about as small as you ever see in the NFL" but then claimed it was the new trend in the NFL?

I hope he gets better, but here's a guy we took that high and in Feb before the draft he said he was willing to play anywhere in the NFL, outside, slot, RB, and in another interview he said some NFL teams had in fact told him they were seeing him as a possible RB, a 3rd down RB type guy.
Yes. This is why Keim fails at being a good GM. Poor process regardless of a few good outcomes. He doesn't learn.
 

Solar7

Go Suns
Joined
May 18, 2002
Posts
10,973
Reaction score
11,582
Location
Las Vegas, NV
the world would be such a better place if people could just say "Yup. Blew that one!" and move on.

the fact that there are 5 pages here is ridiculous in light of what's actually happened on the field.
Man, I don't get this line of thinking. That's one thing if someone makes a stupid decision in day-to-day life but ends up fine at the end of it... but a continued stack of poor decisions at my job doesn't go ignored as a "Yup. Blew that one!" We are paying customers, and the more Keim gets a pass on continued poor decisions means we're sinking our money and time into this.

At my job, if I consistently choose the wrong vendor to supply services or be a part of our campaign, I will get disciplined or fired.
 

LoyaltyisaCurse

IF AND WHEN HEALTHY...
Joined
Aug 10, 2004
Posts
53,873
Reaction score
19,663
Location
CA
Man, I don't get this line of thinking. That's one thing if someone makes a stupid decision in day-to-day life but ends up fine at the end of it... but a continued stack of poor decisions at my job doesn't go ignored as a "Yup. Blew that one!" We are paying customers, and the more Keim gets a pass on continued poor decisions means we're sinking our money and time into this.

At my job, if I consistently choose the wrong vendor to supply services or be a part of our campaign, I will get disciplined or fired.
I think Cheese is on your side. I interpreted his post as not understanding why defenders of picking AI over DK can’t just admit it was a screw up. @cheesebeef , am I correct?
 

football karma

Happy in the pretense of knowledge
Joined
Jul 22, 2002
Posts
14,742
Reaction score
12,876
the results speak for themselves -- but a reminder on DK Metcalfs rep around draft time:

a workout warrior who had marginal production in college, an injury history, suspect hands and likely was limited to slants, posts and go patterns.

give the Seahawks credit: he fits perfectly with what they do-- he can run slants, posts and go patterns all day long in their offense
 

Cardsfaninlouky

ASFN Lifer
Joined
Jan 10, 2019
Posts
4,424
Reaction score
5,819
Location
Louisville
This is a discussion we're having in the playoffs thread, and I think @SoonerLou did a good job of addressing the issue...

...It's not just DK Metcalf. It's AJ Brown, Deebo Samuel, Terry McLaurin, Darius Slayton, etc. that are really wild misses at this point.

I can accept taking a shot at a small school kid sometimes. What I struggle with is taking a guy who doesn't seem to have a place to fill on your roster. Both Fitz and Kirk play there, and we had already discussed the need to find outside players. At the time, we thought maybe Kevin White could play the role, if you're an optimist.

Nearly everyone said "who?" when we picked Isabella. Even his highlights weren't that amazing. It's not so much that we didn't take Metcalf, but we took someone who looked like he'd be around in the 4th.
Exactly. Isabella was more of a 4-5 round pick, not a 2nd. Size & where a kid played college ball would hold more draft value to me if I was a GM. That's not always the case because big school kids fail in the NFL also, having said that, I would take my chances with big school kids more often than not. They've played against stronger competition.
 

dreamcastrocks

Chopped Liver Moderator
Super Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2005
Posts
45,668
Reaction score
10,867
the results speak for themselves -- but a reminder on DK Metcalfs rep around draft time:

a workout warrior who had marginal production in college, an injury history, suspect hands and likely was limited to slants, posts and go patterns.

give the Seahawks credit: he fits perfectly with what they do-- he can run slants, posts and go patterns all day long in their offense

That's what you want players like him to do. Those types of players work in ANY offense.
 

Cardsfaninlouky

ASFN Lifer
Joined
Jan 10, 2019
Posts
4,424
Reaction score
5,819
Location
Louisville
If he ends up having a better career than Metcalf you are right, this take won’t age well.

So far after a full season and a playoff game (for D.K. of course), Metcalf is off to one hell of a head start in that race!
Not only a head start, he's lapped him about 10 times lol.
 

pinetopred

Registered
Joined
May 17, 2002
Posts
756
Reaction score
215
the results speak for themselves -- but a reminder on DK Metcalfs rep around draft time:

a workout warrior who had marginal production in college, an injury history, suspect hands and likely was limited to slants, posts and go patterns.

give the Seahawks credit: he fits perfectly with what they do-- he can run slants, posts and go patterns all day long in their offense
If we draft DK Metcalf everybody is dissapointed because we have a rookie QB, the hags have a somewhat decent qb throwing to him but yes he can't run a route to save his life. Doesn't matter we have who we have and hope he develops. Hope Metcalf becomes nothing because I hate everything Seahags
 

LoyaltyisaCurse

IF AND WHEN HEALTHY...
Joined
Aug 10, 2004
Posts
53,873
Reaction score
19,663
Location
CA
If we draft DK Metcalf everybody is dissapointed because we have a rookie QB, the hags have a somewhat decent qb throwing to him but yes he can't run a route to save his life. Doesn't matter we have who we have and hope he develops. Hope Metcalf becomes nothing because I hate everything Seahags
Did you state DK can’t run a route to save his life? That’s a curious statement considering it’s widely reported the SheHags knew in training camp he would be a good addition because he was able to run the whole tree. The games I’ve seen him in very sing belie your statement as well. Not saying he is an all pro route runner, but he’s not a scrub either.
 
Last edited:

TheCardFan

Things have changed.
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
12,028
Reaction score
14,549
Location
Charlotte

LoyaltyisaCurse

IF AND WHEN HEALTHY...
Joined
Aug 10, 2004
Posts
53,873
Reaction score
19,663
Location
CA
One more thing about MetCalf to those who may have said he wasn’t a fit for cards, Ole Miss ran the air raid offense under Longo.
 

LoyaltyisaCurse

IF AND WHEN HEALTHY...
Joined
Aug 10, 2004
Posts
53,873
Reaction score
19,663
Location
CA

LoyaltyisaCurse

IF AND WHEN HEALTHY...
Joined
Aug 10, 2004
Posts
53,873
Reaction score
19,663
Location
CA
Grading the 2019 NFL season for Seahawks rookie WR DK Metcalf


Metcalf showed his ability to run crisp routes that no one thought he would be able to run at the NFL level. There is still a lot of work for him to do in this category, but it was a successful first year.

Also, the Seahawks were able to use Metcalf as a vertical threat. He has top-notch speed and his frame makes him nearly impossible for defensive backs to completely shut down. For the first time in his career, Russell Wilson finally had a wide receiver capable of winning jump balls on a consistent basis.

There is still a lot of room for growth and improvement. Metcalf is nowhere near reaching his full potential. That being said, his first season was an absolute success and the fans should be excited about his potential to develop into a top wide receiver.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/clutch...season-for-seahawks-rookie-wr-dk-metcalf/amp/
 

Chopper0080

2021 - Prove It
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
26,631
Reaction score
34,717
Location
Colorado

LoyaltyisaCurse

IF AND WHEN HEALTHY...
Joined
Aug 10, 2004
Posts
53,873
Reaction score
19,663
Location
CA
Here was PFF pre-draft:


Why DK Metcalf is PFF's top wide receiver in the 2019 NFL Draft
That’s because there is no Universal Truth when it comes to the draft. Everyone has the exact same tape and workout data at their disposal, yet come to vastly different conclusions. That’s why we at PFF try to look for skills or data points that we can stably project from college to the pros. When it comes to evaluating wide receivers, one of the biggest such skills is separating down the field. Being able to dictate coverages from opposing defenses before the ball is even snapped has value in and of itself. No one in this draft commands that more than D.K. Metcalf, and it’s a big reason why he’s the top receiver on PFF’s draft board.

You must be registered for see images attach


The obvious red flag with Metcalf coming out has been his lack of production. That will always be concerning, especially to us here at PFF, but each prospect is unique and the reason for that lack of production needs to be examined. With Metcalf, there were legitimate excuses for why his numbers were so low. The biggest was a neck injury that limited him to only 201 pass routes in 2018. On a per route basis, he was actually more productive (Metcalf averaged 2.83 yards per route) than guys like N’Keal Harry (2.71), Preston Williams (2.64), Antoine Wesley (2.59) and Stanley Morgan Jr. (2.23) – all 1,000+ yard receivers this past season. Before he was lost for the season against Arkansas, Metcalf ranked eighth in the country with 304 deep receiving yards. Metcalf was legitimately producing, but he simply didn’t see the field enough to show it in his raw numbers.

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-why-dk-metcalf-is-pffs-top-wide-receiver-in-the-2019-nfl-draft
 

Russ Smith

The Original Whizzinator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
84,235
Reaction score
32,848
Here was PFF pre-draft:


Why DK Metcalf is PFF's top wide receiver in the 2019 NFL Draft


https://www.pff.com/news/draft-why-dk-metcalf-is-pffs-top-wide-receiver-in-the-2019-nfl-draft


Well that and the guy playing Wr opposite of him was better than him in college. They were both there at the same time for 3 years. First year Brown 29 catches Metcalf 2, 2nd year Brown 75 catches Metcalf 39, last year Brown 85 Metcalf 26. Metcalf was injured his junior year and it held his stats down yes, but the reality was Brown was better than him in college, and was better than him this year in the NFL.
 

LoyaltyisaCurse

IF AND WHEN HEALTHY...
Joined
Aug 10, 2004
Posts
53,873
Reaction score
19,663
Location
CA
Well that and the guy playing Wr opposite of him was better than him in college. They were both there at the same time for 3 years. First year Brown 29 catches Metcalf 2, 2nd year Brown 75 catches Metcalf 39, last year Brown 85 Metcalf 26. Metcalf was injured his junior year and it held his stats down yes, but the reality was Brown was better than him in college, and was better than him this year in the NFL.
They actually had pretty comparable seasons. Brown has better drop rate, I believe.

edit:

Here is season comparison:

https://www.pro-football-reference....toyear_2=2019&player_id2=BrowAJ00&idx=players
 

LoyaltyisaCurse

IF AND WHEN HEALTHY...
Joined
Aug 10, 2004
Posts
53,873
Reaction score
19,663
Location
CA
Seem like Seattle was deliberate with how they rolled our DK to the league and seems they saved his development (unleashed him) for the playoffs :

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

full game:

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media
 

Russ Smith

The Original Whizzinator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
84,235
Reaction score
32,848
They actually had pretty comparable seasons. Brown has better drop rate, I believe.

edit:

Here is season comparison:

https://www.pro-football-reference....toyear_2=2019&player_id2=BrowAJ00&idx=players

I guess I mean eye test but honestly Brown got much better when TEnn benched Mariotta for Tannehill, DK gets to play with the best long ball thrower in the entire NFL.

Brown had a slightly better catch per target %(62 to 58) and about 4.5 YPC more. Brown in the first half of the year was very similar mostly deep routes, only after Tannehill became the QB did they start using him more. He's much more polished than Metcalf runs better routes, has better hands. They're both good it's frankly amazing Ole Miss wasn't a better team with those 2 guys. I think they have the same concern you hope they don't get much bigger, they're both fast now but if they bulk up much more you would worry they'd lose speed faster.
 

JeffGollin

ASFN Icon
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
20,472
Reaction score
3,056
Location
Holmdel, NJ
Confession - I ranked Metcalf #1 WR and Isabella #8.

Doesn't matter - it is what it is.

That said - the optimist in me believes that Kingsbury's offensive scheme and board created "sub-positions" at WR where certain players fit fairly narrow profiles. (Isabella = small, speedy field-stretcher. Butler = "sky-hook." Johnson = Mr. Velcro hands). Cards may have passed on Metcalf because they felt Butler would be there a round or two later.

Who figured Metcalf would develop so quickly in his 1st year and Butler would get injured?

That's how things work. The draft remains an imperfect science.
 

Forum statistics

Threads
534,858
Posts
5,246,908
Members
6,274
Latest member
G-PA
Top