Draft Positioning Week 16

[Chopper0080]

The other interesting question is if the Giants don't go QB at 1, would they really draft Arvell Reese at 1 with Brian Burns on his huge contract, just having drafted Abdul Carter last year at 3 overall, and having Thibadeaux at 14 mil. Obviously they could probably unload Thib but that would still be a lot of assets allocated to the EDGE position on a roster lacking talent.

That kinda leads to a trade back scenario which then would cause a little more uncertainty with QB needy teams (potentially) like the Rams and Dolphins lurking in the 10-15 range.

 

[GatorAZ]

The other interesting question is if the Giants don't go QB at 1, would they really draft Arvell Reese at 1 with Brian Burns on his huge contract, just having drafted Abdul Carter last year at 3 overall, and having Thibadeaux at 14 mil. Obviously they could probably unload Thib but that would still be a lot of assets allocated to the EDGE position on a roster lacking talent.

That kinda leads to a trade back scenario which then would cause a little more uncertainty with QB needy teams (potentially) like the Rams and Dolphins lurking in the 10-15 range.

I believe they would take a good package but not a massive haul for that reason. Dart isn’t special but he’s shown enough for the Giants to take on an extra first from NYJ or AZ.

Let’s say we’re at #5 and we want Mendoza. I’m offering #5 and our 27’ 1st but not additional 2nd’s. I like but don’t love these QB’s. If the Jets outbid us I can live with that.

 

[kerouac9]

I believe they would take a good package but not a massive haul for that reason. Dart isn’t special but he’s shown enough for the Giants to take on an extra first from NYJ or AZ.

Let’s say we’re at #5 and we want Mendoza. I’m offering #5 and our 27’ 1st but not additional 2nd’s. I like but don’t love these QB’s. If the Jets outbid us I can live with that.

Yup and probably a new GM who will happily show off how smart and savvy he is by negotiating a trade of a dollar for two quarters three dimes and two nickels.

 

[PDXChris]

QB - Mendoza
QB - Simpson
QB - Moore

What do you feel the drop off is from each QB?

 

[Chopper0080]

What do you feel the drop off is from each QB?

Mendoza gives you the most experience and best size of the bunch. He isn't a top athlete but can move around. You have to determine what to make of his Cal years and how much of his improvement is due to the Indiana environment vs Mendoza getting better.

Simpson is more polished than Moore and could start early, but his physical tools are not as significant. The question will be asked why he didn't play more prior to this year.

Moore is just very raw, and is going to need a lot of teaching/coaching/developing. He hasn't really had a game where he played well vs a tough opponent.

I view them all pretty close. What probably should end up separating them will be things I won't ever have access to. Which one is the most relentless worker? Which one is the most critical of themselves? What has really changed about Mendoza's level of play from Cal to Indiana? Can Dante Moore beat a good team? What level of arm talent does Simpson actually have? What NFL arm is it comparable to?

 

[Harry]

I kinda agree. The toughest part will be finding someone to trade up IMO.

While I understand that interest in building the offensive line, I don't believe it is so desperate that you pass up a potentially game changing pass rusher for it. This is why I find @Stout 's viewpoint a little funny. I feel like he has been fairly critical of Monti passing up Will Anderson for Paris Johnson and this would be essentially making the same decision again (without probably trading back up) but he is now for it.

I think trades will be there. For example if a team wants a RB, Love is far and away the best option. If Downs is there, he’s unique in this draft. Those are the guys people typically trade up to get. It’s also possible that someone sees a WR as separating from the pack. There are GMs that make that play also. I think the Cards can move if they choose to do so.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I think trades will be there. For example if a team wants a RB, Love is far and away the best option. If Downs is there, he’s unique in this draft. Those are the guys people typically trade up to get. It’s also possible that someone sees a WR as separating from the pack. There are GMs that make that play also. I think the Cards can move if they choose to do so.

I have a love love relationship with Love.

 

[Harry]

Monti? I mentioned it in a reply to Harry but you are essentially advocating to do this year what Monti did in 2023 except (maybe) without the trade back. I am shocked you want to potentially pass on Will Anderson, again.

The 2023 draft was weak in OTs. The Cards felt somewhat pressured to protect Murray coming back from an ACL tear. Humphries was starting to decline, so OT was a serious concern. Certainly Anderson was potentially the player he turned out to be. In retrospect he was the better choice, though I think Johnson is underrated by the board. I don’t see this year as identical. Fano and Mauigoa are currently above the others. The second tier showed marked improvement as the season went on. Proctor and Goosby closed a lot of ground. Lomu also looked improved as well. I like you choice of Mauigoa, but I think the next 3 would be functional.

 

[Harry]

I have a love love relationship with Love.

He’s very impressive.

 

[Chopper0080]

The 2023 draft was weak in OTs. The Cards felt somewhat pressured to protect Murray coming back from an ACL tear. Humphries was starting to decline, so OT was a serious concern. Certainly Anderson was potentially the player he turned out to be. In retrospect he was the better choice, though I think Johnson is underrated by the board. I don’t see this year as identical. Fano and Mauigoa are currently above the others. The second tier showed marked improvement as the season went on. Proctor and Goosby closed a lot of ground. Lomu also looked improved as well. I like you choice of Mauigoa, but I think the next 3 would be functional.

Interesting. I don't really like Proctor or Lomu that much in terms of top 20. I think there is a big gap between them and Fano/Mauinoga. I haven't focused much on Goosby yet tbh.

 

[Chopper0080]

The more and more I watch of David Bailey, the more and more I think he would be a great option for AZ. Fast off the ball. Nice dip. Has a spin and a rip. Plays with violence. Great production. EDGE is a really important position, and the Cardinals could use an actual rush threat opposite of Sweat.

 

[Denny Green Fan]

He’s very impressive.

That would be crazy to draft a runner that high with no quarterback or o line…..I would be pissed for sure

 

[Stout]

IMO...the top OTs are not the same level of prospects as the top EDGE players from what I have seen. They are good players but not top 5 guys. They would both be a reach for need.

I cannot claim I know anything about them, really, so I can't argue. I did hear one of the edge prospects have short arms, though. That would be a no thank you from me.

 

[Stout]

I kinda agree. The toughest part will be finding someone to trade up IMO.

While I understand that interest in building the offensive line, I don't believe it is so desperate that you pass up a potentially game changing pass rusher for it. This is why I find @Stout 's viewpoint a little funny. I feel like he has been fairly critical of Monti passing up Will Anderson for Paris Johnson and this would be essentially making the same decision again (without probably trading back up) but he is now for it.

That's fair. Like I said, it's mainly because I don't know the prospects.

 

[Stout]

Mendoza gives you the most experience and best size of the bunch. He isn't a top athlete but can move around. You have to determine what to make of his Cal years and how much of his improvement is due to the Indiana environment vs Mendoza getting better.

Simpson is more polished than Moore and could start early, but his physical tools are not as significant. The question will be asked why he didn't play more prior to this year.

Moore is just very raw, and is going to need a lot of teaching/coaching/developing. He hasn't really had a game where he played well vs a tough opponent.

I view them all pretty close. What probably should end up separating them will be things I won't ever have access to. Which one is the most relentless worker? Which one is the most critical of themselves? What has really changed about Mendoza's level of play from Cal to Indiana? Can Dante Moore beat a good team? What level of arm talent does Simpson actually have? What NFL arm is it comparable to?

The tiebreaker for Mendoza for me is the sheer amount of work he puts in. The one game he was interviewed, and we learned he gets up, watches film, hits the gym, practices, throws extra with his WRs, goes to school, then watches film again. I am all in on that kind of prospect, after what we have endured. Plus I caught some real clutch moments from him in the very little CFB viewing I have done.

 

[Harry]

The more and more I watch of David Bailey, the more and more I think he would be a great option for AZ. Fast off the ball. Nice dip. Has a spin and a rip. Plays with violence. Great production. EDGE is a really important position, and the Cardinals could use an actual rush threat opposite of Sweat.

I think he goes too early. Only fit is if they trade down a little. Of course if they do get a decent QB or a young one, they must fix the Oline.

 

[Harry]

That would be crazy to draft a runner that high with no quarterback or o line…..I would be pissed for sure

Not my choice but an exciting player.

 

[Harry]

The tiebreaker for Mendoza for me is the sheer amount of work he puts in. The one game he was interviewed, and we learned he gets up, watches film, hits the gym, practices, throws extra with his WRs, goes to school, then watches film again. I am all in on that kind of prospect, after what we have endured. Plus I caught some real clutch moments from him in the very little CFB viewing I have done.

Gym rat indeed.

 

[GatorAZ]

The Raiders, Giants, Browns and Titans all have winnable games tomorrow. All 3pt or less dogs.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I think trades will be there. For example if a team wants a RB, Love is far and away the best option. If Downs is there, he’s unique in this draft. Those are the guys people typically trade up to get. It’s also possible that someone sees a WR as separating from the pack. There are GMs that make that play also. I think the Cards can move if they choose to do so.

If no trade up for a QB, I'm trying to prepare everyone for Downs being the pick. That's a Gannon/Monti pick to the tee.

 

[Chopper0080]

I think he goes too early. Only fit is if they trade down a little. Of course if they do get a decent QB or a young one, they must fix the Oline.

Maybe. I do seem to be higher on him than most. I don’t really understand why. Maybe as more concrete testing info comes out it will be clearer.

 

[Chopper0080]

If no trade up for a QB, I'm trying to prepare everyone for Downs being the pick. That's a Gannon/Monti pick to the tee.

Come on man. I can’t be thinking about this in late December

 

[Harry]

The curse continues. The teams with the best chance of winning in week 18 are the Giants and the Raiders. We need both to win 2 games. Ironically they play each other this week, so only one can win 2 games, Hilarious! Best hope is for the Raiders to beat the Giants and the KC. Seems remote. I just don’t think any QB is likely unless Simpson comes out. Can’t get any read on how the Cards feel about him. Supposedly they like Willis & Jackson.

 

[SpokaneCardfan]

The curse continues. The teams with the best chance of winning in week 18 are the Giants and the Raiders. We need both to win 2 games. Ironically they play each other this week, so only one can win 2 games, Hilarious! Best hope is for the Raiders to beat the Giants and the KC. Seems remote. I just don’t think any QB is likely unless Simpson comes out. Can’t get any read on how the Cards feel about him. Supposedly they like Willis &

 

[SpokaneCardfan]

What happens if the Titans and saints tie