About the Wilson penalty from AP story

[Crazy Canuck]

The NFL (No fun League) is about to become the NHL (No Hit League).

(Believe me... the real NHL would not have penalized AW's hit.)

 

[AZCB34]

The issue is just as much AW leaping towards the head of the TE on top of the perceived head contact. What TheCardFan is saying is, if AW had stayed on his feet and drilled Heap, no penalty would have ensued. The hit would have been almost as spectacular and the Ravens would not have gotten an extra 15 yards.

Refs are training in such a way that when a player leaves his feet and goes up towards the head, flags start to get reached for. Also remember that a ref doesn't have the advantage of seeing in in slo motion and all he gets is real time hit explosions. The problem is, it was close...I think it was a questionable call personally but if you take the call in it's proper context, the hit was not really clean. Bad call that hurt though

 

[ajcardfan]

I get why the ref ruled the way he did, even if I didnt like the ruling.

It was one of those plays where if it had been called the other way (a fumble) it still would've been upheld IMO.

 

[football karma]

This week we will get the official NFL version of the hit--

we will see if:

Wilson is fined, and/or

Lewis is fined

 

[ajcardfan]

The issue is just as much AW leaping towards the head of the TE on top of the perceived head contact. What TheCardFan is saying is, if AW had stayed on his feet and drilled Heap, no penalty would have ensued. The hit would have been almost as spectacular and the Ravens would not have gotten an extra 15 yards.

Refs are training in such a way that when a player leaves his feet and goes up towards the head, flags start to get reached for. Also remember that a ref doesn't have the advantage of seeing in in slo motion and all he gets is real time hit explosions. The problem is, it was close...I think it was a questionable call personally but if you take the call in it's proper context, the hit was not really clean. Bad call that hurt though

I can understand the call. What's hard to take is Lewis not getting flagged for a hit that was even more flagrant.

 

[Russ Smith]

From watching the highlights on NFL.com, how come nobody is complaining about the no call on the deep ball Matt threw to BJ where it looked like the Raven DB essentially tackled BJ before the ball arrived? Hard to tell on the angle did they rule the ball uncatchable?

Listening on radio both Pasch and Wolfley thought it was PI, and after seeing the replay I would have to agree unless the ball was uncatchable.

 

[AZCB34]

I can understand the call. What's hard to take is Lewis not getting flagged for a hit that was even more flagrant.

How did Wilson not get flagged for almost ripping McGahee's head of on that sideline tackle early in the game?

I remember the Lewis hit, but not well enough to really form an opinion on it. I don't recall lewis leaving his feet and turning into a missle towards Bienemans head and I really believe that is what got Wilson the flag...the way he propelled himself up and towards the head.

 

[Duckjake]

From watching the highlights on NFL.com, how come nobody is complaining about the no call on the deep ball Matt threw to BJ where it looked like the Raven DB essentially tackled BJ before the ball arrived? Hard to tell on the angle did they rule the ball uncatchable?

Listening on radio both Pasch and Wolfley thought it was PI, and after seeing the replay I would have to agree unless the ball was uncatchable.

It's been mentioned. The defender just basically turned and ran right into BJ before the ball arrived. Of course we don't get the call.

BTW: Anyone see what the ball hit? The thing bounced clear out of the endzone.

 

[AZCB34]

From watching the highlights on NFL.com, how come nobody is complaining about the no call on the deep ball Matt threw to BJ where it looked like the Raven DB essentially tackled BJ before the ball arrived? Hard to tell on the angle did they rule the ball uncatchable?

Listening on radio both Pasch and Wolfley thought it was PI, and after seeing the replay I would have to agree unless the ball was uncatchable.

Uncatchable because it was BJ trying to catch it?

It sure looked like PI but I think the refs were letting both teams get away with alot in the secondary IIRC.

 

[justAndy]

Any referee who takes a team's history into consideration should be fired. A play is a play is a play. Why should a team's history have anything to do with a ref's "respect"?

bro - fair enough - you speak of what should be, I'm just going with what is.
I don't like it either

 

[ajcardfan]

How did Wilson not get flagged for almost ripping McGahee's head of on that sideline tackle early in the game?

I remember the Lewis hit, but not well enough to really form an opinion on it. I don't recall lewis leaving his feet and turning into a missle towards Bienemans head and I really believe that is what got Wilson the flag...the way he propelled himself up and towards the head.

Lewis' hit was helmet-to-helmet on a defenseless receiver. There was even a blurb in today's paper where Bienemann showed a giant welt on his jaw to the reporter.

 

[joeshmo]

that was a tough call

McNairs arm does move forward and the ball goes to the ground -- what isnt clear was if the motion was 100% the result of the defender hitting the arm, or was it some combination of defender hitting it as well as McNair moving his arm forward.

I get why the ref ruled the way he did, even if I didnt like the ruling.

In Urbans blog today he clarified that rule a little bit. Even if they did find that it was a fumble in the review it would have still been Ravens ball at the spot of the fumble. Because whistles blew at the time the ball hit the ground you cannot give the ball to either team since the play had stopped, therefore its Ravens ball 2-3 yards further away from a first down rather then Cards ball.

 

[nidan]

Uncatchable because it was BJ trying to catch it?

It sure looked like PI but I think the refs were letting both teams get away with alot in the secondary IIRC.

Of course they were. With WRs letting the DBs loose a little clearly gives an advantage to the Ravens

 

[nidan]

Back to whistling the play dead then aren't we

 

[john h]

The NFL will make a ruling this week...

We will see.

5 people can view something and all see different things. The police do not even like to use personal witnesses as if you have 3 or so you will generally get 3 different opinions. You saw what you saw and I saw what I saw. Like you I have slow motion. The guy ended up with a concussion. Could have been the hit or him hitting the ground. Lets just agree to disagree as I am sure you saw what you saw. I have been a Cardinal fan since 1944 and as loyal a fan as there is. I can also be wrong. Just calling like I saw it.

 

[CardEd]

My feeling is the league will fine AW. Just to back up the Refs call.

BS all around

 

[CardLogic]

From watching the highlights on NFL.com, how come nobody is complaining about the no call on the deep ball Matt threw to BJ where it looked like the Raven DB essentially tackled BJ before the ball arrived? Hard to tell on the angle did they rule the ball uncatchable?

Listening on radio both Pasch and Wolfley thought it was PI, and after seeing the replay I would have to agree unless the ball was uncatchable.

It's been mentioned. The defender just basically turned and ran right into BJ before the ball arrived. Of course we don't get the call.

BTW: Anyone see what the ball hit? The thing bounced clear out of the endzone.

Two different plays Dj.

Russ is commenting about a play in the first half when the DB was climbing on BJ's back before the ball got there. Hard to say for certain, but it sure looked like a catchable ball. No call on the play.

The play you are talking about was the pass at the goal line to BJ from Warner in the 2nd half. As you said, the DB ran into BJ before the ball got there, plus the DB was basically face guarding because he never turned to look for the ball, in fact the ball hit the DB in the back of the helmet and caromed out of the end zone.
Should have been first and goal at the one, instead the Cardinals had to settle for a field goal.

 

[Jetstream Green]

This is what is really screwy about such calls. It seems that with hits like that, that if the Reciever drops the ball after the hit it is not usually called unless it's a helmet to helmet hit, if the reciever does catch it after such a hard hit...they get rewarded with added penalty yards. Should Wilson really be penalized for hitting hard in a contact sport?

 

[az1965]

I did not watch the game but watched the hit highlight several times. Even though I agree refs made a questionable call, I think that type of hit was unnecessary at that crucial drive. Wilson needs to be smart enough.

 

[Jetstream Green]

but then again, what if your Wilson. your thinking "I can't stop him from catching it now for a big gain but I know I can lay the wood and if I hit him hard enough he just might cough it up". Hard opinion to give actually on what Wilson did.

 

[az1965]

I'm not saying don't hit hard... it was how the hit delivered. BTW, I enjoyed it thoroughly... but from a game perspective, it hurt us more than probably it did Heap.

 

[football karma]

While I still dont think AW's hit warranted a penalty--

in the future, if AW would put the top of the shoulder pad right into the receivers solar plexus, the damage to the receiver would be greater.

 

[Russ Smith]

Two different plays Dj.

Russ is commenting about a play in the first half when the DB was climbing on BJ's back before the ball got there. Hard to say for certain, but it sure looked like a catchable ball. No call on the play.

The play you are talking about was the pass at the goal line to BJ from Warner in the 2nd half. As you said, the DB ran into BJ before the ball got there, plus the DB was basically face guarding because he never turned to look for the ball, in fact the ball hit the DB in the back of the helmet and caromed out of the end zone.
Should have been first and goal at the one, instead the Cardinals had to settle for a field goal.

Correct, I'm talking about the ball Matt threw down the left sideline not the one in the endzone that Warner threw.

 

[football karma]

Correct, I'm talking about the ball Matt threw down the left sideline not the one in the endzone that Warner threw.

That was Ed Reed in coverage -- he knew he was beat, couldnt see the ball, and just put the two hand shove into BJs back as the ball was getting there


I think it was clear that the refs were "letting em play" in the secondary --

my dissapointment is that in watching the Cards corners, they didnt raise their level of physicality to that of the Ravens

 

[green machine]

That was Ed Reed in coverage -- he knew he was beat, couldnt see the ball, and just put the two hand shove into BJs back as the ball was getting there


I think it was clear that the refs were "letting em play" in the secondary --

my dissapointment is that in watching the Cards corners, they didnt raise their level of physicality to that of the Ravens

It is a similar problem the Suns have against a team like the Spurs. If the refs allow the physical play without calling penalties or fouls, can the other team respond? What happens when the Cards get flagged for their physical play (AW play on Heap) and the Ravens do not for theirs (Lewis on Biennamen)? How can a team like the Cards handle that?