OT: Arians doing it again

Cardsfaninlouky

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MB is watching the same crap product we are and paying franchise record amounts of dead cash. 2015 was a long time ago.
I hear ya & I understand that part. I just have seen too many times how he acts & defends every move made by SK. He says "We" as in the decisions made by SK. I will be totally shocked if SK is fired this offseason. If we suck next season? Then yeah, I think he would probably be fired at that point. That's my opinion.
 

CardsSunsDbacks

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I hear ya & I understand that part. I just have seen too many times how he acts & defends every move made by SK. He says "We" as in the decisions made by SK. I will be totally shocked if SK is fired this offseason. If we suck next season? Then yeah, I think he would probably be fired at that point. That's my opinion.
Of course he is going to make statements supporting his current employee. Doesn't mean he will remain loyal to him if SK is doing a poor job. One thing to keep in mind is that we don't see what happens behind the scenes and just what moves were SK's ideas and what SK may have been out voted on. Not trying to make excuses for him, but it is quite possible that SK had some ideas that were overruled or out voted that would have been good moves for us and MB realizes that. Of course I can't be sure of that, but I also can't be sure that it isn't that way either.
 

swagron

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Insanity? Watching Stanton under center was like watching paint dry. That was insanity. I may have been stretching it a bit at 1-15. But I definitely would take a 4-5 win season under Murray than an 8 win season watching a Stanton led offense.

Houston ...we have a problem. AZ sports fan in a nutshell. Winning really doesn’t matter.
 

phillycard

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It’s a huge IF to think that Jameis will be able to pull his head out of his a$$. A tiger is a tiger. No one is saying that Jameis doesn’t have talent. But even under the tutelage of the QB whisperer, he still can’t stop turning the ball over. With BA’s advanced age, I can’t see him being there long enough to fix that portion of Jameis that continues to drive Bucs fans crazy. In addition to being a more talented overall QB, where Murray really separates himself from Jameis is in how firmly is head is in the game.

Fair enough kind sir. I won't argue that point with you. Clearly his boneheaded INT's are what will stop the Bucs from really being bout that action. I do think though, he'll be back next year aaaand ultimately of I had to choose between the two. Kyler all day every day is my choice.
 

Chopper0080

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Seriously. If we'd ended the season on a nine-game losing streak — plus having only beaten/tied teams picking alongside us in the top 5 — there was only a 40% chance he'd be fired. This is a family business, and Michael Bidwill hired Steve Keim. Steve Keim hired Kliff Kingsbury. Steve Keim drafted Kyler Murray. Probably two of these three guys (at least) need to sour on Keim for anything to happen.
I hate how accurate this probably is.
 

wit3card

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Arians does what? He takes a franchise that had 5 wins and lost about 7 games by less than 1 TD to 7-7.

Look Arians is a good HC but he merly won against us else he wouldn't be even 7-7 maybe he goes to 8-8 if he manages to win against Texans or Falcons, maybe with luck 9-7 but the bucs last year were badly coached and now are good coached. and some games could have gone different ways this year.

Overall he has again his buddys on his sideline and as soon as the dust settles and everyone in that division and all other teams remember it, they will force his QB to do, Palmer things. The run game will never be good and you can't pay 2 Top WR and 2 good TE + good QB and all the D guys. Overall I think his antics and his playcalling will get back in check and even if they manage to get in the postseason with him his postseason production is not even "lame" we barley managed to win against GB...
 
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Arz101

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Forward to 2020 Cardinals will be eliminated from playoffs in September and win three games in December and voila Keim will be back. The Cardinals standard my friends.


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JeffGollin

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I still have a problem when a team lets quality coaching and player talent fly the coop without a big fight.

It's a quick way to deplete your roster and drain the team culture.
 

cardsfanmd

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Two games left, but rookie stats...

KM: 4 wins, 1 tie. 3,279 yards passing, 21 TDs (tot), 10 INTs, 87.5 Rating.
JW: 6 wins, 4,042 yards passing, 28 TDs (tot), 15 INTs, 84.2 Rating.

Seems equal to me, if not a win for Jameis. Gotta stop counting chickens before they hatch.
Sorry bub but if you think there is 1 single GM in the league who would rather have Jameis than Kyler, you need to put the pipe down.
 

cardsfanmd

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It's a weird assumption to think that Stanton would go 8-8 as a starter considering during his time here he was 9-4 as a starter. There's no foundation for hating Stanton as a starting QB. He didn't put up fireworks here, but he got the job done.
It’s a weird assumption to think Stanton would play 16 games considering he got hurt every time we had to turn to him.
 

Cardsfaninlouky

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Of course he is going to make statements supporting his current employee. Doesn't mean he will remain loyal to him if SK is doing a poor job. One thing to keep in mind is that we don't see what happens behind the scenes and just what moves were SK's ideas and what SK may have been out voted on. Not trying to make excuses for him, but it is quite possible that SK had some ideas that were overruled or out voted that would have been good moves for us and MB realizes that. Of course I can't be sure of that, but I also can't be sure that it isn't that way either.
You are correct, doesn't mean he will stay loyal. However, by watching the videos of MB & SK together & in the draft/war room together, he seems very much behind what SK says. Yes, we have no idea what coaches & players SK wanted that differed from MB. If KK & KM were both the coach & player SK wanted, then MB must have been ok with it, he signed off on both & sung their praises during both introductory press conferences. During the draft & post draft. If they were both more SK decisions than MB, he will give him at least next season to add more players to see if those decisions were right or not. We have no way of knowing who chose who like you said. We're just fans guessing on it.
 
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Solar7

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Sorry bub but if you think there is 1 single GM in the league who would rather have Jameis than Kyler, you need to put the pipe down.
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Jokes aside, no, of course no one would pick Jameis over Kyler right now. But we can keep pretending our QB has proven everything he's needed to prove, or be aware that he has a ton of growth to achieve.

It's exhausting pretending we're already dialed in with elite QB play.
 

CardsSunsDbacks

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Jokes aside, no, of course no one would pick Jameis over Kyler right now. But we can keep pretending our QB has proven everything he's needed to prove, or be aware that he has a ton of growth to achieve.

It's exhausting pretending we're already dialed in with elite QB play.
I am struggling to find these comments. Essentially every one of his "believers" has been talking throughout the season that Kyler clearly has things to improve upon and thus has plenty more that he needs to prove.
 

Solar7

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I am struggling to find these comments. Essentially every one of his "believers" has been talking throughout the season that Kyler clearly has things to improve upon and thus has plenty more that he needs to prove.
This thread has comments like "K1 >>>>>>> Jameis" and "Kliff + Kyler > Bruce + Jameis."

Our team has done jack poo, Kyler is good but not proven, and we need to see years and years of consistent play and wins before we can start declaring victory at the QB position. This is maddening.
 

Chopper0080

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This thread has comments like "K1 >>>>>>> Jameis" and "Kliff + Kyler > Bruce + Jameis."

Our team has done jack ****, Kyler is good but not proven, and we need to see years and years of consistent play and wins before we can start declaring victory at the QB position. This is maddening.
I don't know that this is wrong. I do agree that Kliff/Murray do not have any sort of resume to be elevating them over proven NFL coaches and QBs. Do I think Murray has a chance to be better than Jameis? Yes. Do I think he is better right now...probably not. Do I prefer Murray on a rookie deal to Jameis getting 25mil+ on a new contract...yes I do. Also, Arians is reinforcing the argument that he is a pretty special coach.
 

Solar7

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I don't know that this is wrong. I do agree that Kliff/Murray do not have any sort of resume to be elevating them over proven NFL coaches and QBs. Do I think Murray has a chance to be better than Jameis? Yes. Do I think he is better right now...probably not. Do I prefer Murray on a rookie deal to Jameis getting 25mil+ on a new contract...yes I do. Also, Arians is reinforcing the argument that he is a pretty special coach.
I understand conceptually saying "well I don't want to spend $25 mil," but that isn't really what those posters are saying. K1 has potential, and K2 is garbage until proven otherwise. Make all the excuses in the world for him, the fact of the matter is that he hasn't won anything at any level, and hoping he will is nothing but blind hope.
 

kerouac9

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I understand conceptually saying "well I don't want to spend $25 mil," but that isn't really what those posters are saying. K1 has potential, and K2 is garbage until proven otherwise. Make all the excuses in the world for him, the fact of the matter is that he hasn't won anything at any level, and hoping he will is nothing but blind hope.

Wait... what?
 

Solar7

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Wait... what?
A little Friday morning hyperbole for you, but the guy didn't win in college, and isn't winning now. He has no say over his own defense, and constantly makes poor calls.

K2 has potential to be good in the same way that the guy working at the gas station down the street has of being CEO of a Fortune 500 company. It could happen, technically, but there's nothing to indicate it will in his history.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Two games left, but rookie stats...

KM: 4 wins, 1 tie. 3,279 yards passing, 21 TDs (tot), 10 INTs, 87.5 Rating.
JW: 6 wins, 4,042 yards passing, 28 TDs (tot), 15 INTs, 84.2 Rating.

Seems equal to me, if not a win for Jameis. Gotta stop counting chickens before they hatch.
What were Jameis’ rushing stats?
How many times has kyler had issues with the law or been suspended?

let’s look at everything solar.
 

Solar7

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What were Jameis’ rushing stats?
How many times has kyler had issues with the law or been suspended?

let’s look at everything solar.
Jameis had over 200 yards rushing and Kyler has more. Jameis did not have issues with suspension or the law until after his rookie season, which is all I'm comparing. Undoubtedly, Kyler has a ton of potential. But he could just as easily never fully reach it. Like I said before, I'm sure there were a ton of Bucs fans who thought Jameis was going to be the future of their franchise after that first season, and now they're sitting there debating whether or not to keep him. That's why I find it ridiculous to anoint Kyler as better than anyone with similar stats.
 

MadCardDisease

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Jameis had over 200 yards rushing and Kyler has more. Jameis did not have issues with suspension or the law until after his rookie season, which is all I'm comparing. Undoubtedly, Kyler has a ton of potential. But he could just as easily never fully reach it. Like I said before, I'm sure there were a ton of Bucs fans who thought Jameis was going to be the future of their franchise after that first season, and now they're sitting there debating whether or not to keep him. That's why I find it ridiculous to anoint Kyler as better than anyone with similar stats.

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Krangodnzr

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Jameis had over 200 yards rushing and Kyler has more. Jameis did not have issues with suspension or the law until after his rookie season, which is all I'm comparing. Undoubtedly, Kyler has a ton of potential. But he could just as easily never fully reach it. Like I said before, I'm sure there were a ton of Bucs fans who thought Jameis was going to be the future of their franchise after that first season, and now they're sitting there debating whether or not to keep him. That's why I find it ridiculous to anoint Kyler as better than anyone with similar stats.


His penchant for turnovers (which he did demonstrate at FSU) and his off field issues are the primary reason.

Since he came into the NFL, he leads the league in turnovers.
 

Solar7

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I want to clarify that yes, while he had some issues at FSU, they did not prevent him from being the first overall pick, or lead to suspension. They had all of that information in front of them. Yes, the long term showed some other issues, but given that we don't have a full career to look at with Kyler, it's hard to call him dramatically better than Winston.

For all we know, Kyler could be smuggling child clowns out of Kazakhstan and get suspended, or choose to play baseball, or just never elevate the team with his play in a way that turns into wins.
 
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