OT: Kyler Murray Debacle Thread

[DVontel]

Who are the 5 qbs you think actually matter?

- Lamar
- Allen
- Herbert
- Mahomes, even though he has been way below his own high standard the past few years.
- Hurts, even though he’s polarizing to a lot people.
- Baker, I’d throw him in there, too.

So, 6 maybe.

 

[BritCard]

- Lamar
- Allen
- Herbert
- Mahomes, even though he has been way below his own high standard the past few years.
- Hurts, even though he’s polarizing to a lot people.
- Baker, I’d throw him in there, too.

So, 6 maybe.

Fair, these are about the 6 that you feel can actually drive the team and get a win when the chips are down.

 

[Stout]

Kyler did have that indefensible, boneheaded play, and he wasn't great overall, but I am actually here with a Kyler defense. On one play, I watched him do all the things he normally doesn't--he steps up in the pocket, takes a hit, and delivers a perfect ball. Then MHJ drops it. That about sums up what it is to be a Cards fan lol

 

[kerouac9]

Who are the 5 qbs you think actually matter?

Lamar
Allen
Mahomes
Herbert
Stafford
Hurts

 

[DVontel]

Lamar
Allen
Mahomes
Herbert
Stafford
Hurts

Baker?

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Wanted to throw out there K1 looked pretty fast yesterday.

He got to the edge a few times and converted a couple of 3rd and longs with his legs.

That's a good sign at least.

 

[Oklahoma Card]

Actually, he had a chance to seal the game when rabbit got that interception giving us the ball back, tied with 6 minutes left. He promptly crapped the bed and went 3 and out and was only in position to win the game because the D scored a safety after the offense failed again post turnover.

This is where I'm at with Murray. And this is a constant theme. He doesn't come through when needed.

He had the ball tied with 5 minutes. Go score and win. Nope...3 and out.

He had the ball up by 2 with 3 minutes left. Can only burn 1 minute.

Then I look at Tampa, Baker has 3 game winning drives this season. Does Murray even have 3 in his career?

 

[kerouac9]

Baker?

I get the argument but I need to see that the Bucs are real. They’re 3-0 but needed game winning drives to beat Atlanta, Houston, and the Jets.

I love Baker’s game and I wish here were our QB, but those other guys have a chance to win the Super Bowl (or already have). For me, the argument is does Herbert actually belong on that list RN, which is another way of asking how wide is this path.

 

[BritCard]

We have Kyler's tendencies in the stats from the 2023 season when we had two starting QB's.

In the 9 games with Dobbs, Trey had 31.8 yards per game and Mike Wilson had 50.1. In the games after Kyler returned Trey had 72 YPG and Mike had 17.

Same goes for Hollywood, who dropped from 48.8 to 26.8.

It's very clear Kyler doesn't like to throw the outside routes that his receivers are running from just watching him play, but these numbers confirm it. Mike Wilson didn't get 33 YPG worse when Kyler returned.

 

[BritCard]

I get the argument but I need to see that the Bucs are real. They’re 3-0 but needed game winning drives to beat Atlanta, Houston, and the Jets.

I love Baker’s game and I wish here were our QB, but those other guys have a chance to win the Super Bowl (or already have). For me, the argument is does Herbert actually belong on that list RN, which is another way of asking how wide is this path.

I'd count Baker, the game winning drives are what shows Baker has IT. But I think you're right on Stafford too, just age really keeeping him on the fringe.

 

[BritCard]

Kyler did have that indefensible, boneheaded play, and he wasn't great overall, but I am actually here with a Kyler defense. On one play, I watched him do all the things he normally doesn't--he steps up in the pocket, takes a hit, and delivers a perfect ball. Then MHJ drops it. That about sums up what it is to be a Cards fan lol

How does the MHJ drop excuse Kyler? We got the first down later and went down the field.

 

[DVontel]

I get the argument but I need to see that the Bucs are real. They’re 3-0 but needed game winning drives to beat Atlanta, Houston, and the Jets.

I love Baker’s game and I wish here were our QB, but those other guys have a chance to win the Super Bowl (or already have). For me, the argument is does Herbert actually belong on that list RN, which is another way of asking how wide is this path.

I mean, tbh, only ones I think have a realistic chance to win a Super Bowl from that list are Lamar, Hurts, & maybe Stafford/Mahomes.

Allen is incredible/speechless, but his roster is mediocre to me. He is doing a lot of heavy lifting.

Chargers’ roster is fine to me, but I feel like their roster’s ceiling isn’t the highest. Herbert is incredible though obviously.

 

[Russ Smith]

I'm really not sure how anyone can think that was an ok performance and it was others that let us down. Every team has drops, nobody would be talking about them if we were up 10 as we should have been with the TOP we had.

That was the joint 4th worst YPA of Kyler's career. We have lost every game except 1 where he has throws for less than 5.5 YPA, and that was the Giants in 2020 when we ran all over them. That's an 8% win percentage. A loss is practically baked. Even under 6.5 YPA we only have a 30% chance of winning.

He has 12 games in his career with less than 5.5 YPA. He's only played 84 games. 14% of his career games are sub 5.5 YPA. Matt Stafford has 17 in a 224 game career.

The offense has one hand tied behind it's back. It must be absolutely miserable playing WR in this offense. It's the world's most frustrating cardio workout. Nobody can get hot, nobody can even get luke warm. You can go multiple quarters as a WR without a target. I don't blame the receivers, they made some bad drops today for sure, but it's hard to be on form when you see so little of the ball.

Kyler was not good we agree but it's the height of statistics absurdity to complain about his YPA and excuse the drops. We have no idea but Marv dropped a pass that was at least 40 yards in the 3rd quarter and then dropped one even longer in the endzone. Jones had a big drop. There's well over 100 yards in drops on just those 3 passes. Now compute the YPA again if they make those catches?

it can be both, but the big problem yesterday was WHEN we had chances to make big plays, we dropped them. That one drive was insane Marv wide open drops an at least 40 yard gain that might have gone 70. But we get the big run by Benson to get in striking distance and then DeMercado drops a TD and we settle for a FG

 

[DVontel]

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[urs]

Kyler was not good we agree but it's the height of statistics absurdity to complain about his YPA and excuse the drops. We have no idea but Marv dropped a pass that was at least 40 yards in the 3rd quarter and then dropped one even longer in the endzone. Jones had a big drop. There's well over 100 yards in drops on just those 3 passes. Now compute the YPA again if they make those catches?

it can be both, but the big problem yesterday was WHEN we had chances to make big plays, we dropped them. That one drive was insane Marv wide open drops an at least 40 yard gain that might have gone 70. But we get the big run by Benson to get in striking distance and then DeMercado drops a TD and we settle for a FG

According to Brit, 100+ in lost yardage would only account for about .2 ypa...he maths gud.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

I can't believe how little joy we've gotten out of 6+ years of Kyler...his one incredible scramble a game do nothing to offset the rest of the experience. It'll be 7 years in the desert with ONE interesting year. Not great for the #1 overall pick!

 

[602 Native]

I can't believe how little joy we've gotten out of 6+ years of Kyler...his one incredible scramble a game do nothing to offset the rest of the experience. It'll be 7 years in the desert with ONE interesting year. Not great for the #1 overall pick!

You play for one of the worst franchises historically in the league there won't be very many high points.

We have changed coaches, gms, players, stadiums, cities, and yet the team is no better than it was in 88.

Can't put my finger on what really needs to change.

 

[GatorAZ]

Kyler played well enough to win which is all you can ask for of a non-elite QB. Complaining about that performance is a waste of time.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

You play for one of the worst franchises historically in the league there won't be very many high points.

We have changed coaches, gms, players, stadiums, cities, and yet the team is no better than it was in 88.

Can't put my finger on what really needs to change.

This is one of the worst 7 year periods in recent memory - Kyler is a big part of that.

 

[PDXChris]

Kyler did have that indefensible, boneheaded play, and he wasn't great overall, but I am actually here with a Kyler defense. On one play, I watched him do all the things he normally doesn't--he steps up in the pocket, takes a hit, and delivers a perfect ball. Then MHJ drops it. That about sums up what it is to be a Cards fan lol

Same on the drop by Jones that would had sealed the game. He stepped in the pocket and put it right in Jones's hands. If jones hangs on, that is the game. I agree otherwise.

 

[BooksOrangePlanet]

1 pick thru 3 games and that pick was tipped - that's great but shows he may be more concerned about making a mistake than making a huge play - i think warner lowkey said the same thing about kyler last week

 

[Chopper0080]

1 pick thru 3 games and that pick was tipped - that's great but shows he may be more concerned about making a mistake than making a huge play - i think warner lowkey said the same thing about kyler last week

Agreed. Conner and McBride were the only two offensive players who were playing like they had a huge set. The rest act like their nuts have been cut off. They have bought into the Gannon philosophy of playing not to lose. No swagger just clutching their pearls.

 

[602 Native]

This is one of the worst 7 year periods in recent memory - Kyler is a big part of that.

K1s win loss record says otherwise.

 

[602 Native]

Agreed. Conner and McBride were the only two offensive players who were playing like they had a huge set. The rest act like their nuts have been cut off. They have bought into the Gannon philosophy of playing not to lose. No swagger just clutching their pearls.

Attitude reflects leadership

 

[BritCard]

Kyler was not good we agree but it's the height of statistics absurdity to complain about his YPA and excuse the drops. We have no idea but Marv dropped a pass that was at least 40 yards in the 3rd quarter and then dropped one even longer in the endzone. Jones had a big drop. There's well over 100 yards in drops on just those 3 passes. Now compute the YPA again if they make those catches?

it can be both, but the big problem yesterday was WHEN we had chances to make big plays, we dropped them. That one drive was insane Marv wide open drops an at least 40 yard gain that might have gone 70. But we get the big run by Benson to get in striking distance and then DeMercado drops a TD and we settle for a FG

The pass Marv dropped was 25 yards. The one he dropped in the EZ wasn't even intended for him, it was underthrown to Jones and Marv tries to make a miracle catch out of nothing, I'm not counting that. It was an underthrown pass.

The Zay Jones drop was 17 yards. Let's be generous and call it 50. That would give him 5.91. Still dog crap.