Will the O-line shine

[BirdGangThing]

i was reading @Cardiac 's positional ranking thread - i think he has our o-line at a b-plus and it got me thinking - i remembered not going guard in the draft and monti missing out on the big name guard in free agency and so i came up with a big fat c-minus

but then i smoked some weed tonight and googled a bunch of rankings - i was sure we'd be bottom tier but i was way wrong - started off thinking our run blocking would be our strongsuit but i was wrong again

we were ranked ass to start 2024 but now some sites have us top ten and most have us top 15 - they love paris and jonah and especially fro for some reason but the reasoning seems to be they're all coming back

i also read we had a 21% pressure rate - good for lowest in the nfl - that was surprising as i seem to remember kyler fleeing frequently

 

[JosiahLee]

Yeah I tend to agree they are overrated. To Kyler’s credit, he makes them look much better than they are.

 

[oaken1]

i was reading @Cardiac 's positional ranking thread - i think he has our o-line at a b-plus and it got me thinking - i remembered not going guard in the draft and monti missing out on the big name guard in free agency and so i came up with a big fat c-minus

but then i smoked some weed tonight and googled a bunch of rankings - i was sure we'd be bottom tier but i was way wrong - started off thinking our run blocking would be our strongsuit but i was wrong again

we were ranked ass to start 2024 but now some sites have us top ten and most have us top 15 - they love paris and jonah and especially fro for some reason but the reasoning seems to be they're all coming back

i also read we had a 21% pressure rate - good for lowest in the nfl - that was surprising as i seem to remember kyler fleeing frequently

Our line is pretty solid. Definitely better than average.
The problem is, what stands out from last season was Seattle's d line blowing through our guys seemingly at will. Overlooked in that situation was the fact we were starting a developmental rookie who had nearly zero nfl experience. Had Hernandez been playing that would not have happened.
Fortunately Adams has developed and Hernandez is back so we shouldn't see that situation this season.
The sad fact though is that DT's and DE's have out paced o linemen in athleticism...until that pendulum swings back the other way QB's just won't see the protection levels they did 15 years ago.
But our guys have been well coached..Hopefully the new guy is as good as the last guy.

 

[BACH]

My two cents as an OL nerd....

The O-Line is good.

Above average and better than the talent suggest.

Why is that? Because the skill set of especially the interior line fits the scheme. They are big bodies that are good in space, which fits the gap scheme. They can overpower, pull and dominate when in space. Froholdt is the perfect example of this type.

That also means that their weakness is "box" pass protection. They are amazing athletes for their size, but not as quick on their feet in pass pro as the usual lighter zone blockers. The line ranked somewhere from 10-15 last season with the RT and swing tackle missing multiple games and the starting RG missed 11 games. The back-up were not good enough.

We haven't seen Adams play in a meaningful game, but he certainly looks the part for now. Gaines looked good in the pre-season, Hernandez was brought back and Williams will hopefully be healthty for more games. I like Christian Jones and Fryer as developmental players. I am positive about the O-Line. Would it be nice to have elite talent on all positions? Well, duh! But the talent is good enough.

What concerns me is the lack of adjustments we saw in games - especially vs. Seahawks. That has to change whether it was on Petzing, Clayton Adams or Froholdt. I was screaming at the TV watching the same pulls being called over and over when is was obvious that Leonard Williams was just shooting the gaps and too good to stop within the blocking scheme.
To mitigate, you can move to a more zone style combo block or you slow the DT's overaggresiveness down by making him think - more screens, play actions or you design some sort of trap block. I believe that what exactly what we saw on Reiman's pancake against the Chiefs. Cleverly designed trap with Reiman trapping outside - in and then moving the Gap out to off tackle. Cannot wait to see that kind of adjustments we are going to see in the regular season.

And if you are looking for a reason to love Froholdt, @BirdGangThing? Try to re-watch the Jets game. The long screen to Connor early in the game. Froholdt puts the critical block on a LB to spring Connor. I do not believe any other interior OL in the league would make that block. Watching him in space is a thing of beauty.

 

[BritCard]

Best O line in years. Top half of the league for sure. And getting better. Guys like Paris and Fro are improving every year. Everyone seems to like Adams in camp. We have good depth with Hernandez back and WIlliams is solid is he can stay healthy at RT but if not, Beechum is solid.

There are no O line excuses available for Kyler.

 

[BigDavis75]

I like our starters for the most part but the depth really concerns me, especially at this stage in the season with Hernandez coming off injury without a full camp and Jones out for at least a few weeks. I see a lot of the success of the line this year hinging on Adams but I’m optimistic there. Would love to see Paris become an elite LT as well.

 

[CardNots]

A top 10 maybe top 5 OL barring injuries.

 

[BulldogCard]

They're a decent starting OL if healthy. The Hernandez signing was good and I like the NE player they will develop on the PS. Jones hopefully is back soon. Hernandez and Jones might need a few weeks to get ready for their best play but overall a decent unit. The depth is thin in spots so hopefully they a little set aside just in case.

 

[eastcoastDave]

If the players on the o-line stay healthy, we’ll be very good; not very good if two or more go down with significant injuries. Preseason games taught us that we’re not deep on either line. However, our depth this year is better than 2024 and that’s a good thing.

 

[Chopper0080]

It's a good unit.

 

[QuebecCard]

i was reading @Cardiac 's positional ranking thread - i think he has our o-line at a b-plus and it got me thinking - i remembered not going guard in the draft and monti missing out on the big name guard in free agency and so i came up with a big fat c-minus

but then i smoked some weed tonight and googled a bunch of rankings - i was sure we'd be bottom tier but i was way wrong - started off thinking our run blocking would be our strongsuit but i was wrong again

we were ranked ass to start 2024 but now some sites have us top ten and most have us top 15 - they love paris and jonah and especially fro for some reason but the reasoning seems to be they're all coming back

i also read we had a 21% pressure rate - good for lowest in the nfl - that was surprising as i seem to remember kyler fleeing frequently

Smoking weed equals clearer thinking. I thought this was a myth perpetuated by drug-induced hallucinations.

 

[QuebecCard]

If the players on the o-line stay healthy, we’ll be very good; not very good if two or more go down with significant injuries. Preseason games taught us that we’re not deep on either line. However, our depth this year is better than 2024 and that’s a good thing.

We identified and removed the weak links following the preseason.

Did our #1 swing tackle (Beach) see any action?

Our #1 backup guard (Hernandez) saw none.

 

[Garthshort]

So, we go into the season with a pretty healthy OL. If all 'rooms' perform as well as the OL rooms, we're in for a very successful year. In the many years of following the team, we've had a long history of our OL being a strength. I'm talking Dierdorf, Dobler, Banks, Sharpe, Another VG OT (Brain cramp), McMillan (??). Seemed that defense was usually the problem. So while I have faith in our OL this year, I think that the DL will determine how well we'll do.

 

[DVontel]

Yeah I tend to agree they are overrated. To Kyler’s credit, he makes them look much better than they are.

I think the Kyler frustration is making people not think logically with all the thumbs down.

We all(or a majority at least) know Kyler is a very flawed QB, but are we now pretending that his extraordinary athleticism doesn’t at least help out the OTs because the pass-rushers have to play contain instead of rushing straight up? Has our OL ever been a liability since drafting Kyler?

CJ Stroud is clearly, clearly a better QB than Kyler, but this OL would look worse with Stroud as opposed to Kyler.

 

[Shane]

I think the Kyler frustration is making people not think logically with all the thumbs down.

We all(or a majority at least) know Kyler is a very flawed QB, but are we now pretending that his extraordinary athleticism doesn’t at least help out the OTs because the pass-rushers have to play contain instead of rushing straight up?

CJ Stroud is clearly, clearly a better QB than Kyler, but this OL would look worse with Stroud as opposed to Kyler.

While I agree in general. There are too many times where Kyler gets happy feet and scrambles and moves when he doesn’t really have to. Countless times we’ve seen where he could just step up into a pocket. Or runs when not necessary. He def has some spectacular scrambles in his career on tape that’s for sure. The most recent being that raiders game scramble. Insane.

 

[DVontel]

While I agree in general. There are too many times where Kyler gets happy feet and scrambles and moves when he doesn’t really have to. Countless times we’ve seen where he could just step up into a pocket. Or runs when not necessary. He def has some spectacular scrambles in his career on tape that’s for sure. The most recent being that raiders game scramble. Insane.

Not disagreeing with a majority here, but his athleticism still helps more than hurts at the end of the day. For example, Nick Bosa has played against Kyler 7 times in his career & only has 2 sacks. Guys like Stroud & Herbert (again, clearly better QBs), Bosa would probably double or even triple those amount of sacks. People acting like Kyler doesn’t help out the OTs with his athleticism are futile.

 

[Chopper0080]

Not disagreeing with a majority here, but his athleticism still helps more than hurts at the end of the day. For example, Nick Bosa has played against Kyler 7 times in his career & only has 2 sacks. Guys like Stroud & Herbert (again, clearly better QBs), Bosa would probably double or even triple those amount of sacks. People acting like Kyler doesn’t help out the OTs with his athleticism are futile.

IMO, his poor pocket presence and tendency to double clutch offsets his mobility to a degree but it does help. Something I will look for this season.

 

[DVontel]

IMO, his poor pocket presence and tendency to double clutch offsets his mobility to a degree but it does help. Something I will look for this season.

That degree has to be quite small. The EDGEs still plays contain. Jared Verse is a menace, but dude is not the bendy type & I expect him to keep struggling to sack us as long as Kyler is the QB.

 

[Stout]

It's a good unit.

We hope. It all hinges on one player, as Fro can't make up for both his Gs needing help. As Adams goes, so goes the OL.

 

[Stout]

While I agree in general. There are too many times where Kyler gets happy feet and scrambles and moves when he doesn’t really have to. Countless times we’ve seen where he could just step up into a pocket. Or runs when not necessary. He def has some spectacular scrambles in his career on tape that’s for sure. The most recent being that raiders game scramble. Insane.

Exactly. It all kind of washes out.

 

[JosiahLee]

I think the Kyler frustration is making people not think logically with all the thumbs down.

We all(or a majority at least) know Kyler is a very flawed QB, but are we now pretending that his extraordinary athleticism doesn’t at least help out the OTs because the pass-rushers have to play contain instead of rushing straight up? Has our OL ever been a liability since drafting Kyler?

CJ Stroud is clearly, clearly a better QB than Kyler, but this OL would look worse with Stroud as opposed to Kyler.

Appreciate your logic. To your point, stick someone back there like Kirk Cousins and watch the O Line stats fall off a cliff.

Of course K1 is flawed, but he does things no other qb can do athletically…Like that 50 yard TD scramble against SF last year in week 5. NO ONE else is making that play, not Lamar, not Hurts, not anyone.

His escapability totally pads their stats…I liken it to how Steve Nash made everyone he played with so much money lol

All that to say, I do think they are good. I just don’t believe they’re great.

 

[Shane]

Appreciate your logic. To your point, stick someone back there like Kirk Cousins and watch the O Line stats fall off a cliff.

Of course K1 is flawed, but he does things no other qb can do athletically…Like that 50 yard TD scramble against SF last year in week 5. NO ONE else is making that play, not Lamar, not Hurts, not anyone.

His escapability totally pads their stats…I liken it to how Steve Nash made everyone he played with so much money lol

All that to say, I do think they are good. I just don’t believe they’re great.

It helps but you’re 1000% overstating. Lol

 

[Proximo]

i was reading @Cardiac 's positional ranking thread - i think he has our o-line at a b-plus and it got me thinking - i remembered not going guard in the draft and monti missing out on the big name guard in free agency and so i came up with a big fat c-minus

but then i smoked some weed tonight and googled a bunch of rankings - i was sure we'd be bottom tier but i was way wrong - started off thinking our run blocking would be our strongsuit but i was wrong again

we were ranked ass to start 2024 but now some sites have us top ten and most have us top 15 - they love paris and jonah and especially fro for some reason but the reasoning seems to be they're all coming back

i also read we had a 21% pressure rate - good for lowest in the nfl - that was surprising as i seem to remember kyler fleeing frequently

Our line is pretty good.

RT and LG would be nice to upgrade, but I really like Paris, Adams, and Froholdt

 

[BirdGangThing]

Our line is pretty good.

RT and LG would be nice to upgrade, but I really like Paris, Adams, and Froholdt

a healthy jonah is no slouch either

 

[Proximo]

a healthy jonah is no slouch either

I think he is pretty average. I want above average.