The "what went wrong" thread. Darksiders come on in.

AzStevenCal

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What the Suns have not done well in recent years: come from behind to win against inferior and shorthanded opponents.

What the Suns have done well in the recent years: buy into their own hype and not live up to expectations.

Mike Bidwill is the most relieved valley resident, at least for a couple of days, because the Suns ineptness took the eyeballs off the Cardinals.
I don't think the Clippers are all that inferior to us. Yes they were missing their 2nd best player and we were only missing our 5th best but their depth is far better than ours.
 

AzStevenCal

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They weren’t making a deep playoff run with the squad prior to the trade. But they do need better depth
How would we know, we never saw that squad. But we had one of the best records in the league during that short stretch where we had most of our players available. Anyway, get everyone healthy, solve the Crowder discontent and add a mid-season role player and that squad has pretty much the same chance this one does. Translated, that means neither version was (or is) likely to win a championship this season.

I think we've made a mistake trying to accelerate the timeline for this team. We clearly needed to add another star next to Devin to be an elite team and adding a player like (healthy) Durant is great but you still need a full team. When you lack quality from 5 through 8, that puts an unsustainable burden on the core starters IMO.
 
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Sunburn

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We saw it last year when blown out by Dallas on their home court. No excuses for it, it happened
We suffered a historic playoffs collapse last year as the 1 seed.

Mavs suffered a historic playoffs collapse in 2007 when they lost to an 8 seed as the 1 seed.

Mavs won the championship in 2011 as the 3 seed.
 

Chaplin

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What the Suns have not done well in recent years: come from behind to win against inferior and shorthanded opponents.

What the Suns have done well in the recent years: buy into their own hype and not live up to expectations.

Mike Bidwill is the most relieved valley resident, at least for a couple of days, because the Suns ineptness took the eyeballs off the Cardinals.
LOL There is absolutely NO comparison whatsoever between the Suns and the Cardinals today. None.
 

RON_IN_OC

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LOL There is absolutely NO comparison whatsoever between the Suns and the Cardinals today. None.
I know...the Suns, by a mile, are getting today's negative sports headlines. I may, and probably will change by tomorrow, but for a day, Mike can take a breath.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Rudy admitted the team wasn't running their stuff. Wait wut?!!? That is on the coach. Ty Lue said post game that he was trying to get the Suns to make Craig beat them.

So, our head coach admits we were not playing our stuff and the other coach says he was messing with us...successfully.

Enough said.
Wait a smart coach decided to do what I’ve been saying would happen for weeks?!? No way. And Monty played right into his hands. Again.
 

AzStevenCal

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We saw it last year when blown out by Dallas on their home court. No excuses for it, it happened
We saw a team play excellent basketball for 70 plus games and then we saw a noticably inferior version of that team finish the season and then struggle in the postseason and eventually get hammered. Why the incredible decline in play? Who knows. Myself, I buy the Covid explanation. I guess if you want to believe we just overachieved for much of the year, or we were just outcoached, or gutless or whatever, those are options too.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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We saw a team play excellent basketball for 70 plus games and then we saw a noticably inferior version of that team finish the season and then struggle in the postseason and eventually get hammered. Why the incredible decline in play? Who knows. Myself, I buy the Covid explanation. I guess if you want to believe we just overachieved for much of the year, that's an option too.
I think Paul’s wheels fell off and Monty couldn’t adjust. Even in the absence of the KD trade we would be stuck with the same Paul from last postseason. No way the pretense suns - with Monty at the helm - experience postseason success this year. With another coach who could’ve unlocked bridges, maybe. With Monty? No way.
 

Covert Rain

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We saw a team play excellent basketball for 70 plus games and then we saw a noticably inferior version of that team finish the season and then struggle in the postseason and eventually get hammered. Why the incredible decline in play? Who knows. Myself, I buy the Covid explanation. I guess if you want to believe we just overachieved for much of the year, that's an option too.
IMO, it's combination of things the last two seasons with one thing in common. Coaching. I could buy another explanation if this was an anomoly. It wasn't. We have seen it 2 years running. If this team gets bounced in the first round that will be 3 years running. That to me is a rock solid confirmation of the issue.
 

AzStevenCal

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I think Paul’s wheels fell off and Monty couldn’t adjust. Even in the absence of the KD trade we would be stuck with the same Paul from last postseason. No way the pretense suns - with Monty at the helm - experience postseason success this year. With another coach who could’ve unlocked bridges, maybe. With Monty? No way.
CP definitely wasn't the same player we'd seen in our finals season, that decline became obvious the year before and continued throughout last year and this season. But several other players looked like they were running in mud in that Dallas series. Maybe it was confusion due to poor coach preparation, I don't know but to me it looked more like a physical issue than not knowing what to do.

And I'm all in favor of moving on from Monty but there will likely be a public backlash, especially if Ishbia also replaces JJ which I expect to happen.
 

Covert Rain

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CP definitely wasn't the same player we'd seen in our finals season, that decline became obvious the year before and continued throughout last year and this season. But several other players looked like they were running in mud in that Dallas series. Maybe it was confusion due to poor coach preparation, I don't know but to me it looked more like a physical issue than not knowing what to do.

And I'm all in favor of moving on from Monty but there will likely be a public backlash, especially if Ishbia also replaces JJ which I expect to happen.
Honestly? This would bother me. Not the Monty part (based on what happens this playoffs) but getting rid of JJ. He isn't the owner. Sarver tied his hands IMO. I don't know of a single GM in the world that has a blank check sit back and go...."you know, I don't think I will try and improve the team". I don't buy it. I think getting rid of JJ as well as Monty is an overcorrection IMO.
 

AzStevenCal

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Honestly? This would bother me. Not the Monty part (based on what happens this playoffs) but getting rid of JJ. He isn't the owner. Sarver tied his hands IMO. I don't know of a single GM in the world that has a blank check sit back and go...."you know, I don't think I will try and improve the team". I don't buy it. I think getting rid of JJ as well as Monty is an overcorrection IMO.
I'm not in the blame JJ group, quite the opposite. I think he's done okay especially considering how poorly we managed the draft for several years under his predecessor. We should have had several more tradable assets than we did which meant every trade either used up picks or sent away a player we'd need. If we'd had 3 or 4 Bazley type players on the roster that had yet to blossom or wilt, I think JJ could have done a lot more. And we would have been better situated for a Durant type trade.

I mentioned JJ because I believe that was always Ishbia's plan, let JJ go and replace him with Isiah Thomas. And I'm not convinced that plan has changed, it's just been delayed.
 

Cheesebeef

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I'm not in the blame JJ group, quite the opposite. I think he's done okay especially considering how poorly we managed the draft for several years under his predecessor. We should have had several more tradable assets than we did which meant every trade either used up picks or sent away a player we'd need. If we'd had 3 or 4 Bazley type players on the roster that had yet to blossom or wilt, I think JJ could have done a lot more. And we would have been better situated for a Durant type trade.

I mentioned JJ because I believe that was always Ishbia's plan, let JJ go and replace him with Isiah Thomas. And I'm not convinced that plan has changed, it's just been delayed.
If this team bombs out of the first round and hires Isiah Thomas, that might be the nail in the coffin, laying my Suns fandom to rest for good.
 

ASUCHRIS

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Check out our bench. Just unplayable trash at this point. How does Warren get 0 minutes? He has to be better than the rest of these clowns.

If anyone should understand the value of true role players, it should be JJ.
 

AzStevenCal

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Check out our bench. Just unplayable trash at this point. How does Warren get 0 minutes? He has to be better than the rest of these clowns.

If anyone should understand the value of true role players, it should be JJ.
Yep. Our 1 through 4 are capable of being an elite team even as CP3 declines but we are very weak 5 through 7. If our first four aren't having at least an average game, we're in trouble.
 

Covert Rain

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I'm not in the blame JJ group, quite the opposite. I think he's done okay especially considering how poorly we managed the draft for several years under his predecessor. We should have had several more tradable assets than we did which meant every trade either used up picks or sent away a player we'd need. If we'd had 3 or 4 Bazley type players on the roster that had yet to blossom or wilt, I think JJ could have done a lot more. And we would have been better situated for a Durant type trade.

I mentioned JJ because I believe that was always Ishbia's plan, let JJ go and replace him with Isiah Thomas. And I'm not convinced that plan has changed, it's just been delayed.
Yeah, I didn't think you were. Just voicing my thoughts on it.
 

elindholm

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If this team bombs out of the first round and hires Isiah Thomas, that might be the nail in the coffin, laying my Suns fandom to rest for good.

Don't forget that they've given away all of their future picks.
 

Covert Rain

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Don't forget that they've given away all of their future picks.
No they haven't. Every other 1st round pick. They still have picks. Besides, if this team completely tanks and hits rock bottom? Expect, Ishbia to trade our stars and restock.
 

95pro

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Did CP3's ego come into play last night during the 4th quarter? CP3 had many attempts, KD did not. Or was this just more idiotic coaching?
 

AzStevenCal

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Did CP3's ego come into play last night during the 4th quarter? CP3 had many attempts, KD did not. Or was this just more idiotic coaching?
I don't know but I can't get over that quote from CP3 a few days ago where he said he had to tell KD (basically) that arguments are no big deal. I have no idea of the context of his statement but I find it worrisome especially when I see behavior that makes no sense (such as Durant going invisible).
 

Covert Rain

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I don't know but I can't get over that quote from CP3 a few days ago where he said he had to tell KD (basically) that arguments are no big deal. I have no idea of the context of his statement but I find it worrisome especially when I see behavior that makes no sense (such as Durant going invisible).
Unless the context was CP3 getting in arguments with his own team and Durant was telling him to chill. If that was the case, this is a known with CP3 long before he got here and I doubt it's a big deal.
 
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