the "What Ended Season 2022?" thread

[Superbone]

I keep seeing comments that we fell apart the last week or so of the season and IMO that's just not accurate. I started talking about it more than a month before we mailed it in at season's end.

The problem was, we were still winning but we were no longer the team we had been. And that should have been clear to anyone watching this team every night. If it hadn't been for 4th quarter heroics mostly by CP3 we might have lost another dozen games or so after the all star break.

And maybe that's all this is, we had a false sense of invincibility because most nights we'd play uninspired basketball for 3 quarters yet we'd always pull out the victory. And then come the playoffs, for whatever reason, Chris was no longer capable of carrying us late in the games.

But whether it was injury or defensive adjustments or whatever, we got our butts kicked by a team that didn't have anywhere near the weapons we had.

The Knicks game was the beginning of the end.

 

[AzStevenCal]

The Knicks game was the beginning of the end.

Pretty much. I'd also point to the game where Monty returned from Covid and immediately stopped using Holiday and BB - but the injury to CamJ in that Knicks game really changed our fortunes for the worse.

 

[how_sweet_it_is]

Is anyone bored of hearing the current Suns team suffer disrespect? The problem is that while anyone has a right to find a comment tiresome, the disrespect is fair--the Suns deserve it. If Chris Paul or Devin Booker or DeAndre Ayton publicly complained that they're tired of hearing how they let everyone down, they wouldn't have a leg to stand on. Being 42, I have not seen every notable Suns team; but I have never heard of a Suns team that did this. And I'm not one of these people who thinks the Suns players took bribes from the Mafia to lose.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Is anyone bored of hearing the current Suns team suffer disrespect? The problem is that while anyone has a right to find a comment tiresome, the disrespect is fair--the Suns deserve it. If Chris Paul or Devin Booker or DeAndre Ayton publicly complained that they're tired of hearing how they let everyone down, they wouldn't have a leg to stand on. Being 42, I have not seen every notable Suns team; but I have never heard of a Suns team that did this. And I'm not one of these people who thinks the Suns players took bribes from the Mafia to lose.

I'm not sure what you're referring to? Are the Suns complaining about being disrespected or am I misreading between the lines here?

I'm not following the sports media right now as I have no desire to hear what those guys have to say. I'm sure we deserve highly critical analysis of our team's playoff performance just like I'm sure some of them will go too far in their critiques.

 

[how_sweet_it_is]

The problem was, we were still winning but we were no longer the team we had been. And that should have been clear to anyone watching this team every night. If it hadn't been for 4th quarter heroics mostly by CP3 we might have lost another dozen games or so after the all star break.

Quite honestly, if the Suns had lost an extra dozen games (and therefore finished with approximately the same record as last season), maybe it would have made them stronger, by teaching them something about how to lose. I've heard it said that Dirk Nowitzki's past playoff losses made him and his teams mentally tougher. But these Suns? Devin Booker knows about regular-season losing, because of his time served on tankers; but the only Suns player who knows anything about repeated playoff humiliations is Chris Paul. The rest of the team were Johnny-come-latelys to success. From tanking to the bubble straight to the Finals. Then they got beaten four straight; and the next year they just gave up.

 

[how_sweet_it_is]

I'm not sure what you're referring to? Are the Suns complaining about being disrespected or am I misreading between the lines here?

I'm not following the sports media right now as I have no desire to hear what those guys have to say. I'm sure we deserve highly critical analysis of our team's playoff performance just like I'm sure some of them will go too far in their critiques.

No, I'm not really referring to anything. Just anticipating that someone will express that they're bored of the disgust; and I immediately think too bad--it's warranted.

I wonder if any Suns players would show the audacity to complain of feeling disrespected.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Quite honestly, if the Suns had lost an extra dozen games (and therefore finished with approximately the same record as last season), maybe it would have made them stronger, by teaching them something about how to lose. I've heard it said that Dirk Nowitzki's past playoff losses made him and his teams mentally tougher. But these Suns? Devin Booker knows about regular-season losing, because of his time served on tankers; but the only Suns player who knows anything about repeated playoff humiliations is Chris Paul. The rest of the team were Johnny-come-latelys to success. From tanking to the bubble straight to the Finals. Then they got beaten four straight; and the next year they just gave up.

I don't know. I've watched a lot of basketball in my life and IMO the Suns team that played the first 60 plus games of the season was one of the mentally toughest teams I've ever seen. I've never seen such consistent 4th quarter dominance.

I have a lot of wild guesses but I honestly have no clue what factors took that team from midseason championship form to postseason chumps. Keep in mind we didn't just lose to the Mavericks, we struggled mightily to beat the Pelicans before that.

 

[newBluePlanet]

also keep in mind, that we were 1 game away from the conference finals!

before last season, i'd have said having a season like this would be a dream-come-true

may i have another, please?
(personally, i'll take the hit of another horrific game 7 loss in exchange for another satisfying 64 nights of regular season winning and 7 playoff game wins)

 

[Mainstreet]

I don't know. I've watched a lot of basketball in my life and IMO the Suns team that played the first 60 plus games of the season was one of the mentally toughest teams I've ever seen. I've never seen such consistent 4th quarter dominance.

I have a lot of wild guesses but I honestly have no clue what factors took that team from midseason championship form to postseason chumps. Keep in mind we didn't just lose to the Mavericks, we struggled mightily to beat the Pelicans before that.

I have no clue what happened to the Suns especially in games 6 and 7 against the Mavericks.

The only thing I think could deflate the team that much is a conflict over leadership but I have seen no evidence of this. I don't think a coaching conflict with Ayton could do this.

 

[Russ Smith]

I have no clue what happened to the Suns especially in games 6 and 7 against the Mavericks.

The only thing I think could deflate the team that much is a conflict over leadership but I have seen no evidence of this. I don't think a coaching conflict with Ayton could do this.

I assume you guys have discussed the rumor that Booker and Jenner broke up prior to game 7?

NBA ought to pass a rule no players can date a Kardashian or Jenner they're wrecking the league.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I assume you guys have discussed the rumor that Booker and Jenner broke up prior to game 7?

NBA ought to pass a rule no players can date a Kardashian or Jenner they're wrecking the league.

I missed that one.

 

[elindholm]

NBA ought to pass a rule no players can date a Kardashian or Jenner they're wrecking the league.

Eh, it's sort of like covid. Pretty soon everyone gets the infection, and we make our way toward herd immunity.

 

[Folster]

The last two teams that have traded Kelly Oubre made it to the Finals the following season.

 

[Russ Smith]

I missed that one.

I have no idea if it's true but same source as the Celtics fight after game 6 which apparently was true but don't 100% know.

 

[Folster]

This was Landry Shamet's 4th straight season of losing a Game 7 in the 2nd round on a different team.

2019: Philly
2020: LAC
2021: Brooklyn
2022: Phoenix

We need to trade him to a WC rival this offseason.

 

[Finito]

This was Landry Shamet's 4th straight season of losing a Game 7 in the 2nd round on a different team.

2019: Philly
2020: LAC
2021: Brooklyn
2022: Phoenix

We need to trade him to a WC rival this offseason.

Monty’s step son is a damn jinx

 

[nashman]

I like Shamet more than Payne off the bench personally.

 

[Covert Rain]

We went over this already. Nobody was complaining about momentum after scoring 250 points thru games two vs Dallas or blowing them out by 30 in game 5. They just got big heads and choked.

I never talked about it and everybody was saying the team didn't look right even during the Pelican series. Then again was talking about the team not looking right after the other team tied it up in both rounds. The team went 7-6 in the playoffs barely above .500 basketball which looked every similar to how they finished. Aside from a couple blowout games the team never looked right in the playoffs and everybody was saying it.

 

[how_sweet_it_is]

(personally, i'll take the hit of another horrific game 7 loss in exchange for another satisfying 64 nights of regular season winning and 7 playoff game wins)

I personally will take the exact opposite! In exchange for beating a playoff opponent in a game 7, I would be happy with winning only 55 games. Or even 50. It would get the Suns used to working harder. They obviously had a problem with that.

 

[how_sweet_it_is]

This thread is so long that I can't find the comment where someone talked about Chris Paul's "act wearing thin after a couple of years." What exactly is his act? What did he do before?

 

[AzStevenCal]

I personally will take the exact opposite! In exchange for beating a playoff opponent in a game 7, I would be happy with winning only 55 games. Or even 50. It would get the Suns used to working harder. They obviously had a problem with that.

A lot of fans would agree with you, probably most of them. But I think you'd find a fair number of fans that actually attend or watch every game would feel differently. I'm hugely disappointed in how we finished but I had 64 great games to watch during the season. But yeah, I'd gladly trade 10 or 15 of those wins for a better postseason outcome.

I have to say though, I don't buy your theory about them not working hard enough. Given how seldom it happens, I'm pretty sure that winning 64 games in a regular season requires a lot of hard work.

 

[AzStevenCal]

This thread is so long that I can't find the comment where someone talked about Chris Paul's "act wearing thin after a couple of years." What exactly is his act? What did he do before?

He tends to clash with teammates after a while. He's a strong leader, very demanding and in the past has been very hard on some less than cerebral teammates. But more than a few former teammates have applauded him as a leader and as a teammate. So IOW he's probably like most perfectionists.

 

[how_sweet_it_is]

He tends to clash with teammates after a while. He's a strong leader, very demanding and in the past has been very hard on some less than cerebral teammates. But more than a few former teammates have applauded him as a leader and as a teammate. So IOW he's probably like most perfectionists.

As long as he doesn't punch teammates (Michael Jordan) or demean them in front of others (Kevin garnett, and again Michael Jordan). Surely Ayton's too mentally and emotionally weak to tolerate being screamed at or insulted. Maybe that's exactly what happened and is why Ayton allegedly quit.

Common sense and an understanding of temperaments tells me that besides needing to be a veteran in order to easily tolerate being screamed at, one would have to have a thick skin. It would also especially help to be as much of a jerk as the screamer; e.g., jerks are usually better at handling jerks.

Maybe Ayton tried to convince Paul to feed him the ball more, and Paul yelled at Ayton for it. Or coach shot it down. Either could be what went wrong for game 7.

 

[Peter Sheldon]

A lot of fans would agree with you, probably most of them. But I think you'd find a fair number of fans that actually attend or watch every game would feel differently. I'm hugely disappointed in how we finished but I had 64 great games to watch during the season. But yeah, I'd gladly trade 10 or 15 of those wins for a better postseason outcome.

I have to say though, I don't buy your theory about them not working hard enough. Given how seldom it happens, I'm pretty sure that winning 64 games in a regular season requires a lot of hard work.

There is something to be said about starting slow and getting better as the season progresses. I think the Suns were phoning it in most of the season because they could turn it on in the 4th quarter via CP3. rip-throughs, etc.

Against the Pels, the Suns could not get rebounds. Against the Mavs, the Suns got demoralized because the Mavs would hit 3 after 3. And when they weren't, Luka would drop a shoulder into the defender and always get the hoop or a FT. Suns had no 3 point shooters in the playoffs and no way to generate fouls. And when Book got double-teamed, coach had no plan for someone to pop open. I swear a good H.S. coach could have done better! And Ayton has no desire to get open and make himself available for the ball. And the second he puts it on the floor, it gets stripped.

It was a pretty pathetic team to watch in these playoffs. GSW would have swept them if they had managed to squeak by Mavs.

 

[Finito]

As long as he doesn't punch teammates (Michael Jordan) or demean them in front of others (Kevin garnett, and again Michael Jordan). Surely Ayton's too mentally and emotionally weak to tolerate being screamed at or insulted. Maybe that's exactly what happened and is why Ayton allegedly quit.

Common sense and an understanding of temperaments tells me that besides needing to be a veteran in order to easily tolerate being screamed at, one would have to have a thick skin. It would also especially help to be as much of a jerk as the screamer; e.g., jerks are usually better at handling jerks.

Maybe Ayton tried to convince Paul to feed him the ball more, and Paul yelled at Ayton for it. Or coach shot it down. Either could be what went wrong for game 7.

Everyone wants to point to game 7 but this team didn’t look right a month before the playoffs started. after game 5 is when it actually blew up. We got blown out in game 6 & 7.

By the time game 7 came around the entire team checked out.

Chris is a hard ass he’s very demanding and he can ride guys but when your a leader you have to know when it’s enough it’s a fine line. There is a time and place. I’ve seen grown men break down and cry.

If someone is made to feel no matter what they do it’s never good enough then eventually they will stop caring what you say and you’ll eventually get guys pushing back but not in a good way. This isn’t an Ayton thing it’s a human thing. When Paul went to get in Crowders face and Crowder blew him off right then and there it let you know they’ve tuned him out.

You can be that guy all day long but when you suddenly become the weak link you need to be self aware. If Paul was hurt he needs to say I can’t go. If Monty told him to sit and Paul said no and went out there and crapped the bed then guys are gonna be looking at him sideways and pissed.

The thing is Paul isn’t the coach of this team Monty is. Monty doesn’t have the personality to check Paul. I could totally see Paul questioning Monty and overriding him. The team sees it to.

I can easily see Paul undermining Monty and Monty taking it.