The Future Is Still "Bright"

[Errntknght]

Of course, 2) was a possibility, which is why I said that not getting McCarty might have had the effect of more development of a big lineup - didn't say it was a cinch. Giving a coach one more bad option is always a poor idea, especially one that figures to appeal to him.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

Didnt want to "bump" this thread up for at least another couple weeks if the Suns managed a miracle to overcome their 0-3 deficit.....

Anyways....I'll just drop this moot discussion with McCarty with this....

I wanted the Suns to even go to the CBA and acquire some physical player or someone who could rebound...someone like a Lonnie Jones or my laughable suggestion at the time (and it's still obviously laughable now) Olden Polynice... I made those 2 suggestions on here in a thread posted just prior to when the Suns traded for McCarty..I know Polynice is ancient/slow, but I thought he could counter in some situations the likes of Duncan and perhaps Shaq (later on) when the situation called for a quick stop or a hard-dirty physical foul.... But alas.. that's all moot now... the past obviously cannot be reversed, so no sense in reflecting on this topic further....

Again.. no absolutley no drastic wholesale changes.... Just add the 2 necessary missing components..... That prolific rebounder who is a force inside on both the offensive/defensive ends... Somone in the mold of Aaron McKie.... And then a dirty-nasty player ala Rick Mahorn who commits those hard-fouls... A player you hate when he's on your team, but would embrace when he actually is....

Just the Suns originally weren't built completely to win-it-all this season, but next year will be a completely different tale guys... Don't lose faith... to reiterate.. THE FUTURE IS STILL BRIGHT... it's only just begun.....

I appreciate for all what the Suns managed this season regardless of this series outcome.... Cotton is still smiling...this team will be a factor/force for many years...

Thanks Suns..and also thanks for everyone who joined in during gametime chats...I cannot wait to see every one of you next season as this team will be even better.....

 

[cly2tw]

For me as a fan, the playoffs and winning a championship in the next two years is the only important issue. And the strength and weakness of the Suns have all been displayed during this playoff run.

1. Spurs showed us that the fastbreak, trackmeet way of our offense can be contained. With the emergence of Amare and further development of JoeJ, we need to greatly expand our offensive arsenals, with more set halfcourt plays that could utilize different sides of talent already in the players.

2. Our interior defense and rebounding must improve.

3. Consequently, if we ignore the regular season stats a bit, moving Marion for some bigman and bench depth can help solve both issues 1 and 2. We lose our fastbreak prowess a bit but we trade it in for offensive variety.

4. Q is better than what he showed in the playoffs. Don't forget that he played 4 years with the Clippers and he had to change his game a lot this season. Yet, if we expand our offense, I expect that Q will get back his low post games and develop a better midrange jumper too. He is still young.

5. If we retain both JJs and shift the offense that Nash plays more like Stockton in that he gives up some ballhandling. Then a backup PG is not our priority at all. Unless Bobby Jackson wants to join us. Otherwise, develop Barbasa and get whoever is leftover in FA for the minmum.

6. To get the bigman, if we can get Swift or Brown with MLE then we can keep Marion and resign Hunter for the 1.6 exemption. Otherwise, I'm still in favor of a Marion for Chandler + Deng, or for Magloire + somebody deal.

7. I'd like to reiterate that we absolutely need to practise all kind of things for expanded offense to defense during the regular season with beating the Spurs in playoffs as the immediate goal. We can't have the attitude that our trackmeet style is good for 62 wins and to win 7-games series against all but maybe 3 teams, the Spurs, the Heats and the Pistons. Actually, Houston and Denver and maybe Goldenstate will improve further next year. We can't be just complacent.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

For me as a fan, the playoffs and winning a championship in the next two years is the only important issue. And the strength and weakness of the Suns have all been displayed during this playoff run.

6. To get the bigman, if we can get Swift or Brown with MLE then we can keep Marion and resign Hunter for the 1.6 exemption. Otherwise, I'm still in favor of a Marion for Chandler + Deng, or for Magloire + somebody deal.

Excellent post, however, the latter part of #6 is what I disagree with... Absolutely under no circumstances whatsoever do the Suns trade any intregal part of their current roster (that includes Marion).... I know many deem him as the "scape-goat" as to why the Suns lost this past series (of course I'm not denying that he didnt play up to his level/potential), however, the combination of playing a 1-on-1 game and D'Antoni for failing to make some necessary adjustments are partially to blame for the Suns demise against San Antonio as well (but D'Antoni will improve since this was his 1st exposure to the play-offs as an NBA coach)...... No way do the Suns lose any part of their nucleus...That would set them back some and also would affect the "awesome" team chemistry they have in place..... Also, Chandler and Deng are both inexperienced.... The Suns need to add players who have won in the NBA finals before (again, not just the 12th man on that team), but someone who contributed to another team's title run...

I hope they don't implode the current squad... will siginify desperation/panic and would cause the team to completely feel ill-at-ease (even us and the rest of the fanbase)..... The Pistons of the 80s and the Bulls of the 90s both remained patient... they would just add the missing ingrediants through drafts, sign some mid-tier players, and make minor trades...... I just can't fathom why people demand drastic measures to take place..especially with a team that gelled as quickly as they did w/out looking back (albeit a series in which they encountered a team that is just 2-years removed from winning it all themselves).... It's shades of the Pistons vs. Celtics.. the Bulls vs. Pistons folks... I see the Suns surpassing the Spurs possibly early as '05-'06.... or '06-'07 at the latest....

 

[Joe Mama]

Excellent post, however, the latter part of #6 is what I disagree with... Absolutely under no circumstances whatsoever do the Suns trade any intregal part of their current roster (that includes Marion).... I know many deem him as the "scape-goat" as to why the Suns lost this past series (of course I'm not denying that he didnt play up to his level/potential), however, the combination of playing a 1-on-1 game and D'Antoni for failing to make some necessary adjustments are partially to blame for the Suns demise against San Antonio as well (but D'Antoni will improve since this was his 1st exposure to the play-offs as an NBA coach)...... No way do the Suns lose any part of their nucleus...That would set them back some and also would affect the "awesome" team chemistry they have in place..... Also, Chandler and Deng are both inexperienced.... The Suns need to add players who have won in the NBA finals before (again, not just the 12th man on that team), but somone who contributed to another team's title run...

I hope they don't implode the current squad... will siginify desperation/panic and would cause the team to completely for ill-at-ease (even us and the rest of the fanbase)..... The Pistons of the 80s and the Bulls of the 90s both remained patient... they would just add the missing ingrediants through drafts, sign some mid-tier players, and make minor trades...... I just can't fathom why people demand drastic measures to take place..especially with a team that gelled as quickly as they did w/out looking back (albeit a series in which they encountered a team that is just 2-years removed from winning it all themselves).... It's shades of the Pistons vs. Celtics.. the Bulls vs. Pistons folks... I see the Suns surpassing the Spurs possibly early as '05-'06.... or '06-'07 at the latest....

I couldn't agree more. The Phoenix Suns should not and absolutely will not trade Shawn Marion this year. We might as well stop these trade proposals. It's not going to happen. the Suns will try to extend Amare, re-sign JJ, and improved the depth of the team, especially the frontcourt.

Joe Mama

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

I couldn't agree more. The Phoenix Suns should not and absolutely will not trade Shawn Marion this year. We might as well stop these trade proposals. It's not going to happen. the Suns will try to extend Amare, re-sign JJ, and improved the depth of the team, especially the frontcourt.

Joe Mama

Agree with both of you, you have to remember that cly2tw would trade Marion for nothing if it was his choice

 

[cly2tw]

Marion has his qualities and shortcomings. Playing in this season's run-n-gun Suns with the MVP as the PG, we saw all the great sides, as examplified in his stats. Only this series vs the Spurs exposed his weakness again which we all already discussed in length in years past.

If, in the coming season(s), we are set to play 95% of our offense the same way led by Nash as of now, we don't need to trade him at all. Yet, if we want to divert the offenses as I proposed in the last post, Marion's shortcomings will be exposed more. He will still be very valuable to us but just not this-season-valuable. For this reason, we might want to trade him when his value is the highest, as a matter of business fact. Nothing personal against Marion.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The Pistons of the 80s and the Bulls of the 90s both remained patient... they would just add the missing ingrediants through drafts, sign some mid-tier players, and make minor trades......

I agree pretty much with everything except for this part about the Pistons- the Dantley-Aguire tarde was HUGE when it went down. Dantley was their Marion when you think about it - but - they didn't do that until they failed several times - that's why Marion gets a free pass from me for another full season.

No drastic changes this year - just keep BUILDING. iF WE FLAME OUT NEXT YEAR - WE CAN TALK ABOUT TRADES THEN - BUT UNTIL THEN - ANYTHING else is extreme impatience(sorry bout the caps).

 

[KingLouieLouie]

I agree pretty much with everything except for this part about the Pistons- the Dantley-Aguire tarde was HUGE when it went down. Dantley was their Marion when you think about it - but - they didn't do that until they failed several times - that's why Marion gets a free pass from me for another full season.

No drastic changes this year - just keep BUILDING. iF WE FLAME OUT NEXT YEAR - WE CAN TALK ABOUT TRADES THEN - BUT UNTIL THEN - ANYTHING else is extreme impatience(sorry bout the caps).

Every time I read one of your posts regarding a particular event in the Suns history with such vivid and passionate detail..you really remind me of how I was with the Pistons while I was growing-up.....I can just recall nearly everything that transpired with them from around '83 to when I stopped following them over the past 2-3 years........

Anyways.... I recall the Dantley-Aguire trade (which I mention in the 1st post of this thread of those 2 posts I quoted).... I guess I only differ with you on saying that the trade was very significant... I believe the Pistons would have won without Aguire..... I'll start (just a tangent here) with a brief story....

First, I'll never forget when the Pistons acquired Dantley.... They traded away my favorite player, Kelly Tripucka, to Utah and I was driven to tears... I think I was around 9 or 10 and I remember upon hearing the news of the trade going outside and shooting baskets just saddened..... Ironically, a couple of years later I was "pissed" when the Pistons eventually traded Dantley to the Mavericks for Aguire since Dantley suddenly become a personal favorite of mine.... Isiah pretty much orchestrated that trade since him and Aquire were both best-friends while they grew-up in Chicago and Isiah demanded that the Pistons added him.... I think there also was a rift between Isiah and Dantley (suddenly that is coming back to me because I remember the television reports and newspaper reports a couple of days after the trade took place)...

Anyways.. I think the Pistons would have won regardless if the Aguire trade didnt take place because Rodman, Salley (the X-factor), and Dumars himself were all still improving their game.... In fact.. The Pistons still should have won Game 6 of the '88 finals (which would have clinched the title), however, Rodman missed some easy shots in the closing seconds and I remember him botching some rebounds.... I'll never forget the expression on Chuck Daly's face...I think he even mutter "F U Rodman" or some other cuss word.... I remember going outside and recreating those players immediately after the game on my drive-way because I was so dejected myself....

The Pistons also would have some bizarre fate against the Celtics such as that botched inbound pass by Isiah that Larry Bird intercepted, to that play when Vinnie Johnson and Dantley (if I recall) both collided heads and were both taken out of the game due to a concussion.........

I guess the point of this was before I went on memory lane of a team that many loved to hate is that trading Dantley wasnt as significant (at least to me anyways) compared to the Suns foolishly trading away one of their core players....

Yes.. it would be beyond impatient to trade someone like Marion or Q out of sheer impulse..... Just adding that brusing physical player and big man who can rebound with the team that already is in place would improve the Suns by leaps and bounds... No wholesale changes or the team will forever be in flex without a true identity.....

 

[Cheesebeef]

KLL - I don't know how you've been able to do what you've done switching teams. Not a knock on you, but man, just how in the hell did it happen? Did something just completely turn you off of the Pistons?

I only ask because there's only ONE thing I think that could POSSIBLY turn me off being a Suns fan - andf that would be the biggest disaster of ALL TIME (Suns-wise)... Amare leaving and becoming a Laker - at that point - if that nightmare were to come true I don't think I'd be able to watch basketball anymore. Was there something like that that happened to you?

 

[elindholm]

Amare leaving and becoming a Laker

As the Sports Guy would say, I just threw up in my mouth.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Amare leaving and becoming a Laker

As the Sports Guy would say, I just threw up in my mouth.

it's my worst nightmare and I think I literally wouldn't be able to watch basketball again. With MAGIC fans back in the day - I don't think it hurt as much because, well, they hadn't been through the pain of being a fan for years and years - they were spoiled from the beginning. If we were to suffer the same fate I would basically have to commit basketball suicide.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

KLL - I don't know how you've been able to do what you've done switching teams. Not a knock on you, but man, just how in the hell did it happen? Did something just completely turn you off of the Pistons?

I only ask because there's only ONE thing I think that could POSSIBLY turn me off being a Suns fan - andf that would be the biggest disaster of ALL TIME (Suns-wise)... Amare leaving and becoming a Laker - at that point - if that nightmare were to come true I don't think I'd be able to watch basketball anymore. Was there something like that that happened to you?

It all began on 5/12/02, the day I first moved out to Phoenix.... I started to gradually switch my alliances/loyalties over to the home team which I know a very few transplants do..... I know I'm a rare-breed in that regard.....

I agree with BIM that there's no such thing as duel-loyalties and I began to realize how I was following the AZ/Phoenix pro teams a lot more than I was the Detroit teams..that I wanted the Suns, Dbacks, Cardinals, and Coyotes to defeat the Pistons, Tigers, Lions, and Red Wings.... It honestly hasnt been a difficult transition since the Cardinals history parellels the Lions very closely, and I followed the Suns during the late 80s and early 90s because I loved Cotton and the likes of Chambers, KJ, Hornaceck, Thunder Dan, Mark West, and then eventually Barkley, Dumas, Miller, etc....

It wasnt anything specifically anything that the Pistons or any of the Detroit sports teams did whatsoever...It was just that I did some deep soul-searching I guess you can say and that's when I discovered that all my allegiances are with the AZ/Phoenix teams from here til eternity.. for richer or poor.. for sickness and health...... for championships and cellar dwellers... to contenders and pretenders... well.. you get the picture.... Heck.... I didnt even follow the Pistons title run last season and havent watched them at all this year whatsoever (except when they were playing the Suns).... What's so hilarious was that I was trying to find an AZ sports message board for a year, but I had to settle for a Detroit one instead and I began posting several threads regarding AZ/Phoenix teams...I even found this message board 2-years ago when I was trying to find some information regarding the '03 draft party and someone had posted a link to this message board and there really hasnt been any turning back since........

 

[Cheesebeef]

It all began on 5/12/02, the day I first moved out to Phoenix.... I started to gradually switch my alliances/loyalties over to the home team which I know a very few transplants do..... I know I'm a rare-breed in that regard.....

sounds like my Father - he was as big a Bears fan as they come but once we got the Cardinals he bought season tickets and it just went from there. He was never a HUGE Bulls and I think he got cuaght up in Suns fever back in 1976 (when I was born) and it just kind of stuck.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

It didnt completely happen over night... When I first came on here as KingLouieLouie (eventually changed my name to KLL because several would abbreviate it) and I began casually following the Cardinals in '02, but really didnt get into them completely until '03....thats when I began the season as a Lions fan (that's the game in which Anquan made his amazing debut) and I remember rooting for the Cardinals to come back and win that game.... Took until around Nov/Dec that I had become exclusively 100% faithful to the Cardinals and that I had pretty much became (now completely) that way with the remainder of the professional sports franchises out here.... I'm not a fair-weather..bandwagon fan whatsoever.... I do though get a lot of ribbing from some of my family and my friends back in MI for my conversion, but its worthwhile.....

I just feel all the sports teams out here are headed in the right direction.. Even though the both the Suns and Dbacks had among their worst seasons in their respective franchise history (Dbacks '04 and the Suns '03-'04) I rooted for them fully regardless.... Just now exciting to see the rapid turn-around they've made..and with Denny Green/Rod Graves both molding the Cardinals into a play-of calibre team, and Wayne Gretzky eventually guiding the Coyotes..it's like all of Phoenix sports teams are ascending from the ashes.... a true renaissance....

 

[George O'Brien]

I was a Warrior fan before moving to the Valley. In my case it was easier to make the transition because a new ownership dumped Don Nelson and ripped up an exiting if flawed squad leading to a decade plus of futility. I started getting really interested during the Kidd McDice season and never gave up even when things fell apart. Unlike with the Warriors, I always had feeling the Colangelos knew what they were doing. This season has been a kind of vindication of that feeling.

By the way, comments about Dantly reminds me of how I felt that Q reminds me of him. Dantley was only 6'5" and 210 pounds, but he was one of the best low post players in the NBA. He was not really a long range shooter, hitting just 17.1% for 3 for his career. But he averaged 24.3 ppg on 54% from the field.

I'd like to see Q develop his mid range game and become more like Dantley with three point range.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

After nearly a year of initially posting this... I still contend that the future is bright regardless of the potential outcome of this current series.....

We all know that Amare will return to action during the summer and will be fully recovered prior to training camp, so the Suns would be able to gradually work him back into the line-up without disrupting any chemistry whatsoever...

The Suns will definitely re-sign Boris Diaw to a long-term deal and will have starting line-up featuring Nash-PG, Bell-SG, Diaw-C, Amare-PF, Marion-SF....

I realistically dont envision Barbosa returning since his contract demands might be beyond what the Suns would be willing to invest in someone who isnt a true PG and the return of Tim Thomas is a major question mark as well..

It's hysterical reading though my initial post in this thread since the team did essentially implode to a lesser degree, however, in a more favorable manner..of course.. we didnt forecast then Amare missing virtually the entire season....

Regardless... the future is bright and we shouldnt overlook that at all...

 

[jandaman]

Nash has atleast 3 seasons left in him, and Amare with a season off, will come back fresh and healthy.

Marion is only 27 and will be in his prime come the next few seasons.... Diaw will become a better player next season too... so yeah its all about signing some valuable pieces and drafting/trading for missing pieces.