Signings, Trades, Rumors including Suns and NBA

[Cheesebeef]

I just have to say this... I can’t believe the Cardinals and Suns got #1 picks in the same year, drafted athletic freaks at CRUCIAL positions both teams have been starving for for years and NEITHER of them are slam dunk candidates for extensions like other sure-fire #1 picks/superstars.

That sucks!

 

[Finito]

I just have to say this... I can’t believe the Cardinals and Suns got #1 picks in the same year, drafted athletic freaks at CRUCIAL positions both teams have been starving for for years and NEITHER of them are slam dunk candidates for extensions like other sure-fire #1 picks/superstars.

That sucks!

I think Ayton is a slam dunk max extension. He’s played his role great. For those wanting a post up guy that’s not how basketball is played anymore.

Kyler is blame everything on Kliff. He’s had late season meltdowns no matter who his QB had been. I look at Kyler like Amare. Freak talent but Amare had so many flaws and was always kind of the same player because he came into a butter soft system. He was never challenged or forced to be better

 

[Covert Rain]

I think Ayton is a slam dunk max extension. He’s played his role great. For those wanting a post up guy that’s not how basketball is played anymore.

Kyler is blame everything on Kliff. He’s had late season meltdowns no matter who his QB had been. I look at Kyler like Amare. Freak talent but Amare had so many flaws and was always kind of the same player because he came into a butter soft system. He was never challenged or forced to be better

I think he means purely from a basketball perspective. In terms of contract, because of market, it is a slam dunk.

Does anyone know how to find the Suns' team defensive stats in games with Ayton this season versus games without? statmuse.com gives the offensive numbers, and the harsh reality is that the Suns are better offensively without him.

Record: 23-7 with, 18-3 without
Points: 111.8 with, 114.8 without
FG%: .483 with, .474 without (appears to be a slight edge to "with," but...)
3FG: 30.8 attempts per game at .365 with, 33.0 attempts per game at .364 without (so they shoot more threes without Ayton, and make them at the same clip)
Assists: 26.4 with, 26.7 without
Turnovers: 14.0 with, 11.0 without (this one is damning -- the turnovers aren't Ayton's necessarily, but force-feeding him is still a low-percentage play)
Steals: 8.3 with, 9.1 without
Blocks: 3.5 with, 5.2 without (surprising)
FTA: 21.6 with, 18.1 without (offensively, this is the best number in Ayton's favor -- he's not getting to the line himself, but his presence puts extra pressure on the defense)

So I'd really like to see opposition FG% and 3FG% numbers.

Not easily. If I have time I will export the stats into a spreadsheet. Will take some time to manually sort the data by Ayton in and out. I am curious as well.

 

[Phrazbit]

If we traded Ayton, while our record is 41-10 and come up anywhere short of winning the title, it will go down as one of the stupidest trades in NBA history.

A title favorite cutting their nose off to spite their face.

 

[Sparky16]

If I’m Ayton, I’m praying for a trade if not actively asking for one (though that’s not his MO). However, it wouldn’t surprise me if he’s asked Jones to not match a RFA offer from another team

WTF would JJ not match. If the soft "injury prone" DA said that, then he should be traded. Sabonis is such a huge upgrade over this grifter. DA is open to a trade because he is more likely to get a max deal from someone else who does not share the obvious opinion of Suns Mgt that DA is easily replaced for pennies on the $ w/o a drop in sucess. Cam Johnson is far more important to resign than Mr 11 & 8 who was invisible in the loss to the ATL

 

[Sparky16]

A Sabonis trade won't happen unless it includes a rotation player and I don't want to see that, as much as I like Sabonis.

They'd have zero interest in Crowder and I think that would hurt chemistry.

Cam Johnson for Sabonis might interest Indiana but I wouldn't do that.

Ayton for Sabonis? Maybe with 2 1sts coming from Indiana as well.

Of course Saric, Stix, and Nader would be filler in any trades. No loss if they're sent out.

I would take less than Sabonis + this years 1 for DA. But if they did offer its a steal for Suns. DA with the loss of Sabonis would only make that pick more valuable as DA - Sabonis = high lottery pick. it would have to have no protections as the Pacer would crater to end this season

 

[Sparky16]

The team everyone keeps saying is Detroit.

I don’t hold it against anyone for chasing money especially if you think you deserve it and if someone is willing to pay you it then you deserve it.

I don’t think it will happen but if it does I get it.

I think we lose Cam we can’t afford to pay him. So say you pay Ayton the max and lose Cam or you trade for Sabonis who only makes 20 million and keep Cam

1: Ayton
or
2: Sabonis+Cam Johnson

Which would you rather have moving forward?

No brainer....

 

[Sparky16]

I think I understand why the Front office didn't give DA the bag. Maybe trying to light a fire under his ass. Welp I think its safe to say it didn't work.
Now what?
No trade I can think of would be much of an upgrade, most would be The Suns taking it in the rear.
Sabonis is a lateral AT BEST.
If they trade Cam Johnston now I swear to god I'm giving up and moving to California and riding Steph or LeBrons dik from now on.

Lateral... thats funny. A 2 X All-Star vs Mr Aloof who is perfectly happy riding the pine in crunch time.... OK

 

[Cheesebeef]

If we traded Ayton, while our record is 41-10 and come up anywhere short of winning the title, it will go down as one of the stupidest trades in NBA history.

A title favorite cutting their nose off to spite their face.

this is true.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think he means purely from a basketball perspective. In terms of contract, because of market, it is a slam dunk.

this. both of what looked like sure-fire superstars still have so many damn questions surrounding them.

 

[Finito]

Lateral... thats funny. A 2 X All-Star vs Mr Aloof who is perfectly happy riding the pine in crunch time.... OK

Yeah Ayton hasn’t showed up in crunch time or big games at all huh

 

[Finito]

I think he means purely from a basketball perspective. In terms of contract, because of market, it is a slam dunk.


Not easily. If I have time I will export the stats into a spreadsheet. Will take some time to manually sort the data by Ayton in and out. I am curious as well.

When the the new deal comes into play these max contracts are going to look like a steal

 

[Hoop Head]

Yeah Ayton hasn’t showed up in crunch time or big games at all huh

It's hard to show up in crunch time when you don't even suit up.

 

[TJ]

WTF would JJ not match. If the soft "injury prone" DA said that, then he should be traded. Sabonis is such a huge upgrade over this grifter. DA is open to a trade because he is more likely to get a max deal from someone else who does not share the obvious opinion of Suns Mgt that DA is easily replaced for pennies on the $ w/o a drop in sucess. Cam Johnson is far more important to resign than Mr 11 & 8 who was invisible in the loss to the ATL

That’s a little harsh. Sabonis is not better than Ayton when you factor in that Sanonis is dreadful on defense. this is a “be careful what you wish for” situation. Phoenix would get bounced in the 2nd round without Ayton

 

[AzStevenCal]

When the the new deal comes into play these max contracts are going to look like a steal

Don't the supermax deals (and maybe the max deals?) go up when the salary cap goes up? The supermax players continue to earn 30% of the cap even when the cap rises but I'm not sure how that works for the max players set at 25%.

 

[Rab]

The Ayton hate just never ceases to amaze me here.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The Ayton hate just never ceases to amaze me here.

So does the hyperbole from his biggest supporters.

 

[Finito]

Don't the supermax deals (and maybe the max deals?) go up when the salary cap goes up? The supermax players continue to earn 30% of the cap even when the cap rises but I'm not sure how that works for the max players set at 25%.

Yes

But if you sign a max now I’m pretty sure the money doesn’t change it stays at what you signed for right

 

[AzStevenCal]

Yes

But if you sign a max now I’m pretty sure the money doesn’t change it stays at what you signed for right

I'm really not sure, maybe one of the posters who's more familiar with it can ring in on this.

 

[Rab]

So does the hyperbole from his biggest supporters.

What hyperbole bothers you so much? I’m curious.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

The Ayton hate just never ceases to amaze me here.

There is a non zero chance that the only #1 pick the franchise has ever had is traded this week.

That's fault on all sides. Ayton doesn't have the fire that Booker and CP3 have. The Suns have made it an issue when maybe it didn't need to be

 

[Chris_Sanders]

And before anyone asks how do the Sun's make it an issue, he didn't get an extension. Also there have been multiple stories about how hard CP3 is on him.

If the Sun's expect him to continue to not always fit with the Alphas around him, then Sabonis is a really good 3rd banana.

 

[GatorAZ]

Simmons on his pod talked about Smith for Schroeder again. Maybe it’s because he wants Smith on his team but he said if he and CP are still tight from their OKC days the Suns should do it. I’d still prefer Gordon big time.

 

[Muggz]

Lateral... thats funny. A 2 X All-Star vs Mr Aloof who is perfectly happy riding the pine in crunch time.... OK

I'd rather have Ayton over that 2 time "All Star" all day every day and for many reasons.
I'm not saying we should trade him, I'm just saying I get it.

 

[Mainstreet]

Simmons on his pod talked about Smith for Schroeder again. Maybe it’s because he wants Smith on his team but he said if he and CP are still tight from their OKC days the Suns should do it. I’d still prefer Gordon big time.

The Suns need to add someone. Watching Payton was really painful tonight. I'd waive him if I had too to add a player.