Ossenfort is Kicking the Hornets’ Nest in this Draft.

Stout

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Whose second season? The 27th overall pick? That’s a long time to be patient. Gannon could be fired by then.
Exactly. It's the same judgment against criticizing a trade as it was against criticizing KM. It's disingenuous. You can't judge it/them for 2, 3, 4, 5 years. Yeah, no. That's not how it works. You criticize or praise based on the data in front of you. Right now, it wasn't a good trade. Later? Maybe it becomes a better trade, or a good one.
 

Stout

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you obviously value pressures more than i do. The all caps prove it.

but even with all the pressures, his defensive stats relative to the rest of the NFL pass rushers were ....... middle of the pack. Better than average.

People are making him out to be the next great pass rusher or something. I think that is really premature. Maybe he will be.
No, people are making him out to be better than PJJ at his respective position. Are you saying PJJ is better?

This is the heart of why a lot of people don't want to trade down again. That trade down netted us more draft capital but a definite lesser talent at the top of the draft. Taking lesser talents at the top of the draft is how you stay a bad franchise.
 
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Harry

Harry

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idk - but other than paris (top 10 pick) our rookies didn't do jack
Sorry, but I disagree. Some were projects drafted knowing they needed development. Ojalari fit that description. Williams and Wilson were both recovering from injury. I think they show promise. I think Gaines & Pappoe will fail. Tune and Clark struggled but I wouldn’t write them off. Stills was a flat out steal. We’ll be better able to judge after another year.
 

BirdGangThing

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Sorry, but I disagree. Some were projects drafted knowing they needed development. Ojalari fit that description. Williams and Wilson were both recovering from injury. I think they show promise. I think Gaines & Pappoe will fail. Tune and Clark struggled but I wouldn’t write them off. Stills was a flat out steal. We’ll be better able to judge after another year.
i agree a few of them may do jack in the future - but they didn't last year - ill give you stills tho
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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It’s nowhere near saying anything like that.

I agree with you here, but others don’t see it as this way.
At what juncture do you think it’s fair to grade or compare players? What’s considered statistically significant to you (I assume that’s why you’re criticizing doing so after a single season)? 2 seasons? 4? 1 1/2?
 

DVontel

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At what juncture do you think it’s fair to grade or compare players? What’s considered statistically significant to you (I assume that’s why you’re criticizing doing so after a single season)? 2 seasons? 4? 1 1/2?
2. I just think 1 is way too small of a sample size.

At 2, you start to see the true gap.

At 3, it becomes obvious.
 

football karma

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No, people are making him out to be better than PJJ at his respective position. Are you saying PJJ is better?
we dont know yet

OTs generally take a season or so -- guys like Andrew Thomas, Christian Darrisaw, Penei Sewell all had pretty mediocre rookie seasons, but are very well regarded today. Pass rusher is one of the easier transitions to the NFL, so you can get quick contributions.
 

oaken1

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No, people are making him out to be better than PJJ at his respective position. Are you saying PJJ is better?

This is the heart of why a lot of people don't want to trade down again. That trade down netted us more draft capital but a definite lesser talent at the top of the draft. Taking lesser talents at the top of the draft is how you stay a bad franchise.
I don't think we got a lesser talent..or marginally so...
A quality OT is more beneficial than a quality pass rusher and usually has a longer window of production.
To wit... I think we got a B to B+ OT who should be productive for 12 to 15 years...and we passed on an A to A- pass rusher who will probably be productive for 9 to 12 years.
It's a close match in value...I just happen to value quality linemen.... if we get an B rated DT or pass rusher with pick 27 we clearly came out ahead
 

GimmedaBall

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especially after just getting screwed on the texas trade
The expectation going into 2023 was for the Texans to be a really bad team with a rookie HC, rookie QB, a team with a poor record in 2022. A lot of Card fans were anticipating that the Texans 1st rounder was going to be Top 5 at least---some were anticipating a #1 pick. We also knew that we were going to be bad with KM on the mend for most of the year. Visions of two picks in the top 5 were the anticipated reward for us this draft.

Like a lot of Card fans, I watched with disappointment that the Texans just kept winning and each week their 1st round pick (our future pick) spiraled down-down-down the board. We are guilty of counting our chickens before they hatched and, in that regard, we were screwed on the Texas trade by vitue of our miscalculation. We expected the Texans to be worse than they were. We still got a 1st round pick but it was toward the bottom of the round instead of the very top of the round.
 

BirdGangThing

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The expectation going into 2023 was for the Texans to be a really bad team with a rookie HC, rookie QB, a team with a poor record in 2022. A lot of Card fans were anticipating that the Texans 1st rounder was going to be Top 5 at least---some were anticipating a #1 pick. We also knew that we were going to be bad with KM on the mend for most of the year. Visions of two picks in the top 5 were the anticipated reward for us this draft.

Like a lot of Card fans, I watched with disappointment that the Texans just kept winning and each week their 1st round pick (our future pick) spiraled down-down-down the board. We are guilty of counting our chickens before they hatched and, in that regard, we were screwed on the Texas trade by vitue of our miscalculation. We expected the Texans to be worse than they were. We still got a 1st round pick but it was toward the bottom of the round instead of the very top of the round.
texans received two top 5 picks and we did not - top 5 picks are worth a whole helluva lot especially if you're not looking for a qb - while all was not lost there was some screwage afoot - monti doesn't do it hindsight 20/20
 

GimmedaBall

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texans received two top 5 picks and we did not - top 5 picks are worth a whole helluva lot especially if you're not looking for a qb - while all was not lost there was some screwage afoot - monti doesn't do it hindsight 20/20
To be fair to Monti, at the time of the trade I thought we really scored big time. I fully expected the Texans to stumble the first year with a new QB and new coaching staff. I was expecting us to compete with the Bears as to who was going to get the #1 pick. Man, I could not have been more wrong. Stroud put up one of the best rookie QB showings ever as did their coaching staff.

Count your eggs before they hatch and they may just fall out of the basket and crack at your feet.
 

Garthshort

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I don't think we got a lesser talent..or marginally so...
A quality OT is more beneficial than a quality pass rusher and usually has a longer window of production.
To wit... I think we got a B to B+ OT who should be productive for 12 to 15 years...and we passed on an A to A- pass rusher who will probably be productive for 9 to 12 years.
It's a close match in value...I just happen to value quality linemen.... if we get an B rated DT or pass rusher with pick 27 we clearly came out ahead
Something to consider. A pass rusher gets involved and is usually asked to make a play (passing downs) a few times for every opponent possession. An OT has to make a play on every down. Both are important.
 

juza76

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Maxx was actually good in college so I’m not making that projection yet.
Troy Nicklas was drafted in the second with a lot of hype despite poor production and injuries concern
The new guy Is much more Athletic and healthy, not involved much in the passing game but there Is potential , although don't know if It was enough to merit the third round pick
 

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