If this is the roster where do we stand?

Mainstreet

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It was cam payne, and cam johnson. After he came back from his injury he never really got it going again.

I agree Cam Johnson never got back on track but Cam Payne not returning to form was the demise of the Suns offense.

The Suns needed another shot creator.

His inability to get to the rim took a lot away from their offense.
 
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Ouchie-Z-Clown

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To be fair, Mavs did not beat the Suns this year. Suns beat themselves. Barring a meltdown like we say this year, Suns take that series 4-1 every time. Woods, McGee, and Hardaway do not change that, in my opinion.
Man I hate this type of reasoning. There have been pretty detailed videos showing the changes the mavs made during the series that completely stymied the suns offense and defensively we were awful. Give that mavs team credit, they beat us. We were certainly unraveling at years end heading into the playoffs, but the mavs pushed the right buttons to wax us 4-1 after going down 2-0.
 

Covert Rain

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I agree Cam Johnson never got back on track but Cam Payne not returning to form was the demise of the Suns offense.

The Suns needed another shot creator.

His inability to get to the rim took a lot away from the their offense.
That and when he did get to the rim he was completely out of control putting up wild shots. Monty ended up playing CP3 and Book more than he wanted. I put that on Monty though. Holiday could have contributed, and IMO would have given us what we needed from Payne.
 

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Dback Jon

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Man I hate this type of reasoning. There have been pretty detailed videos showing the changes the mavs made during the series that completely stymied the suns offense and defensively we were awful. Give that mavs team credit, they beat us. We were certainly unraveling at years end heading into the playoffs, but the mavs pushed the right buttons to wax us 4-1 after going down 2-0.
And Monty never made any adjustments.
 

Mainstreet

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That and when he did get to the rim he was completely out of control putting up wild shots. Monty ended up playing CP3 and Book more than he wanted. I put that on Monty though. Holiday could have contributed, and IMO would have given us what we needed from Payne.

Yeah, there is no use getting to the rim if a player can't finish. Payne would often put up wild shots when he was able to get there.

Ironically Payton could get to the rim almost at will but seemingly couldn't make a layup.
 

Joe Mama

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Even if he isn’t good enough to start he proved in abundance that with limited minutes he can be just as effective as Ayton in limited minutes. I think you are forgetting how bad it got when Ayton went to the bench the season before. The lane was a revolving door. How you can say this roster is only slightly worse when he was the most effective backup we have had in a long time is just surprising.
I think it definitely hurts as far as depth add center, but as long as DA and BB remain healthy I'm really not that worried about the quality of play dropping off. I only have my bad memory and no numbers in front of me to support this, but my recollection was that we continue to get strong production from the center position when both DA and javal McGee were out for several games during the regular season.

I'm also hopeful that Saric Will come back strong and provide that depth not only at center in a small ball situation but at Power forward more importantly. Don't forget we also have Jacques Cousteau and maybe we'll even get lucky and sign everybody's crush this year from summer league, Sarr.

We may not have as many wins as last year, but I'm optimistic right now that we'll get a strong return from CP 15, and continued growth from cam Johnson, bridges, DA, and even booker. I still believe this is a championship caliber team.

Joe
 

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Any interest in Avery Bradley? Part of the MLE?

Bradley isn't worth more than the minimum and even that would be generous. He's done. I was a big fan of his but he hasn't played worth a damn since the bubble, perhaps even before. There's good reason he's bounced around these last few years.
 

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I still maintain that 9 times out of 10, we win that series in 6 games or less. Of course, we had our own internal issues that led us to beat ourselves.
Furthermore, I am view this from the perspective of the standings at the end of the season.

We won the league by a mile. We’ve still got a deep team and a great starting lineup. We’re going to win a ton of games again.

The clippers and warriors have strong teams but both do a lot of “game management”. We probably should do more, especially with Paul, regardless, I don’t see anyone but Golden State and the Grizz fighting with us for the top seed.
 

SunsFanFirst

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Furthermore, I am view this from the perspective of the standings at the end of the season.

We won the league by a mile. We’ve still got a deep team and a great starting lineup. We’re going to win a ton of games again.

The clippers and warriors have strong teams but both do a lot of “game management”. We probably should do more, especially with Paul, regardless, I don’t see anyone but Golden State and the Grizz fighting with us for the top seed.
This is exactly why I think Suns fans overestimate the Suns. Regular season means nothing outside of qualifying for the playoffs. Winning it by a mile does mot mean what it did in the 90’s.
 

Phrazbit

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This is exactly why I think Suns fans overestimate the Suns. Regular season means nothing outside of qualifying for the playoffs. Winning it by a mile does mot mean what it did in the 90’s.

Great, yet that is the topic at hand.
 

Mainstreet

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This is exactly why I think Suns fans overestimate the Suns. Regular season means nothing outside of qualifying for the playoffs. Winning it by a mile does mot mean what it did in the 90’s.

Having a better regular season record against a playoff opponent insures home court advantage.
 

Covert Rain

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Having a better regular season record against a playoff opponent insures home court advantage.
You are right, he forgot that part. I get his overall point though. People that think just because we dominated the regular season that translates into best team in the playoffs. Not always. In this case we clearly were not the best team in the playoffs.
 

Mainstreet

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You are right, he forgot that part. I get his overall point though. People that think just because we dominated the regular season that translates into best team in the playoffs. Not always. In this case we clearly were not the best team in the playoffs.

Having court advantage in the playoffs is better than not having it but I agree, it guarantees nothing.
 

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Having a better regular season record against a playoff opponent insures home court advantage.

I know I care less about home court after that wretched game 7 against Dallas. What good is home court advantage if your team doesn't even show up? Home court should eliminate the possibility of outings like that.
 
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When Ayton went to the bench it was a revolving door that year. It’s the entire reason we got McGee and Biz. One of the reasons why this team cruised in the regular season this year is because we played defense. Plus, it’s a major IF in terms of Saric being healthy and returning to form. Second, if you are relying on Saric to anchor our bench offensively or defensively I am going to call it now. We won’t sniff the finals IMO. We MUST get better at the PF spot and back PG spot if we don’t get KD.
Rain, I wasn't following before the 2021 playoffs; and stripped of context, what you described in some of those comments makes the situation of 2021 sound odd compared to now. Dario Saric was the leader of the bench? And why did Ayton go to the bench? Was coach mad at him even back then?
 
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Covert Rain

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Rain, I wasn't following before the 2021 playoffs; and stripped of context, what you described in some of those comments makes the situation sound odd compared to now. Dario Saric was the leader of the bench? And why did Ayton go to the bench? Was coach mad at him even back then?
Ayton couldn't play every minute of the game. So, either when he went to the bench to rest or if he was in foul trouble, the lane became a revolving door. That's why after that offseason the Suns were determined to shore up the middle. So they went out and got McGee and Biz. It proved they were right. Our defense improved dramatically this last year.
 

Raindog

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This is exactly why I think Suns fans overestimate the Suns. Regular season means nothing outside of qualifying for the playoffs. Winning it by a mile does mot mean what it did in the 90’s.

I think that was Monty's assumption... best record means the playoffs are just a formality.
 

SunsFanFirst

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You are right, he forgot that part. I get his overall point though. People that think just because we dominated the regular season that translates into best team in the playoffs. Not always. In this case we clearly were not the best team in the playoffs.
I didnt forget it. Having home court now does not mean what it did in the 90’s. I just dont think its that important.
 

Dback Jon

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This is exactly why I think Suns fans overestimate the Suns. Regular season means nothing outside of qualifying for the playoffs. Winning it by a mile does mot mean what it did in the 90’s.
My hope is that Monty et Al Learned that lesson and won’t be so focused on winning games at any cost iand overextending playing time for the veterans

If you look at minigame threads that concern was raised by Eminem posters that it would backfire playoff time and it did
 

AzStevenCal

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My hope is that Monty et Al Learned that lesson and won’t be so focused on winning games at any cost iand overextending playing time for the veterans

If you look at minigame threads that concern was raised by Eminem posters that it would backfire playoff time and it did
I don't know what Eminem has to do with it but I think that's a very questionable conclusion you've drawn. No player on our team averaged 35 minutes or more and only Bridges (82), Javale (74) and Shamet (69) played more than 68 games last season.

I don't know what happened but the entire team looked lost out there, I don't think that was from being overworked. Undercoached, maybe. Over-confident possibly. Outworked, definitely. But overworked, I just don't see it.
 
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