Hypothetical For The Tank

[GeorgiaCard88]

Disagree.

What is your defintion of tanking?

So, you think that a team with potentially 2 of the top draft picks in 2024 is trying to win this year? With this roster?
- That would be such a Cardinal thing to do

You are making some solid points even if I have a slightly different opinion.

I don’t love kyler- mostly because I don’t love the handicap most short QBs. I just think we may be able to see success with him still.

Let me ask you this- let’s say he balls out and really comes close to his 2021 peak. Would you still want to roll with Williams and dump kyler for picks?

 

[daves]

His salary once traded would be very cap friendly since all of the guaranteed money accelerates against the cap.

I guess it depends on how you define "cap friendly". In 2024 Murray's salary will be $37M + $1M workout bonus + $850K/game roster bonus = $52.45 million. In 2025 it totals $46.2M. the 2026 total is $54.3M.

 

[Stout]

No I'm not "thick". I was beginning to think you were because you didn't seem to grasp what I was talking about.

MO took over a crap situation, carefully curated by Keim. It's going to take a few years to fix things around here.

Well, when I agree with you several times yet you keep trying to "explain" it, it does make me wonder.

 

[BritCard]

No I'm not "thick". I was beginning to think you were because you didn't seem to grasp what I was talking about.

MO took over a crap situation, carefully curated by Keim. It's going to take a few years to fix things around here.

Keim was the absolute worse GM they say, but also it could be turned around in a year.

Not even a year in fact, immediately.

 

[TheCardFan]

Let me ask you this- let’s say he balls out and really comes close to his 2021 peak. Would you still want to roll with Williams and dump kyler for picks?

It's a great question.

This is why our situation is so challenging. Let's say Kyler does do that (I think it's highly unlikely at this point but would love to see it).

Has there ever been a team with a top 5 paid QB and a roster like ours that was able to build a championship team? I haven't found one.

I think his contract and this roster prohibit that from happening. We can be good/competitive but I don't think we can rebuild this this team the way it needs to be with a top 5 paid QB. I also don't think Kyler is that guy - a tier 1 QB. I think he could have been but he isn't.

The more likely scenario - Kyler plays well enough to blow our top draft picks and we are stuck in medicocrity again.

Worst case scenario - he get's injured again and we are really stuck.

Botttom line - I don't think we have a choice. We have to blow it up and start over.

 

[BritCard]

It's a great question.

This is why our situation is so challenging. Let's say Kyler does do that (I think it's highly unlikely at this point but would love to see it).

Has there ever been a team with a top 5 paid QB and a roster like ours that was able to build a championship team? I haven't found one.

I think his contract and this roster prohibit that from happening. We can be good/competitive but I don't think we can rebuild this this team the way it needs to be with a top 5 paid QB. I also don't think Kyler is that guy - a tier 1 QB. I think he could have been but he isn't.

The more likely scenario - Kyler plays well enough to blow our top draft picks and we are stuck in medicocrity again.

Worst case scenario - he get's injured again and we are really stuck.

Botttom line - I don't think we have a choice. We have to blow it up and start over.

The worse case scenario is you eat $52m in dead cap trading Kyler, don't trade a high pick for multiple 1sts and draft a QB (Williams/Maye/Penix) who's no better than Kyler and takes 2-3 years to get there.

 

[TheCardFan]

The worse case scenario is you eat $52m in dead cap trading Kyler, don't trade a high pick for multiple 1sts and draft a QB (Williams/Maye/Penix) who's no better than Kyler and takes 2-3 years to get there. And Kyler goes on to win the Super Bowl with another team.

As long as we are talking worst case scenario...I FTFY above.

 

[BritCard]

As long as we are talking worst case scenario...I FTFY above.

Or is just very good.

 

[BritCard]

Kay knows ball

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[kerouac9]

The worse case scenario is you eat $52m in dead cap trading Kyler, don't trade a high pick for multiple 1sts and draft a QB (Williams/Maye/Penix) who's no better than Kyler and takes 2-3 years to get there.

You could draft a QB who ends up
being Zach Wilson

 

[TheCardFan]

Or is just very good.

That really doesn't bother me as much...unless we draft a QB bust.

If we draft the right QB - "very good" should be the minimum expectation. Plus we get a draft haul and a new rookie QB contract, which resets the clock and helps us build around him.

 

[Stout]

Keim was the absolute worse GM they say, but also it could be turned around in a year.

Not even a year in fact, immediately.

Making things up out of thin air again, I see.

1 year wash. 2024 should be a year we could compete. Now I think it's 2025. Only 1 person is saying we could compete sooner/immediately. You have "them" wrong.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Well, when I agree with you several times yet you keep trying to "explain" it, it does make me wonder.

Cool it.

 

[CardNots]

Cool it.

The first game results are not even on the books yet, but I suspect you have a long year of moderation coming…

 

[dreamcastrocks]

The first game results are not even on the books yet, but I suspect you have a long year of moderation coming…

You are not wrong.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Making things up out of thin air again, I see.

1 year wash. 2024 should be a year we could compete. Now I think it's 2025. Only 1 person is saying we could compete sooner/immediately. You have "them" wrong.

That's assuming that Murray is actually the guy. If he's not the guy, then you are still not competing.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Kay knows ball

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Nice to see someone from the National media that gets it. I miss Kay on GMF.

 

[TheCardFan]

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[CardNots]

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Two bottom 5 teams duke it out Sunday!

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Bird in hand.

The absolute best case scenario for the Cardinals would be for Murray to come back and play well down the stretch but for the team to end up with #1 and #2. Team at #3 now has to think that they will get jumped by other teams in the top 5 and miss out on BOTH QBs so they trade #3 and two additional first round picks and probably two second round picks as well. Once the #2 pick is on the clock, the Cardinals could conceivably have the exact same scenario.

The team at #4 is scared that they will miss out on QB #2 and they trade up offering #4 and two additional first round picks and likely two second round picks.

The Cardinals then take MHJ at #3 and the next best player (Alt? Fashanu? Verse?) at #4, while sitting in a position that they will have a plethora of picks of the next two seasons to build a team around. This could also include trades for young stars on their rookie contract as well.

Never in a million years coukd I ever even hope for things to fall this right for the cards

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Idk. There's something about Kyler playing well and us sitting with two top picks that doesnt sit right with me. It was excusable for a team likethe Bears with Fields trying to find his way.

If Kyler plays well then he needs to win as well.

So I'd hope the Cards get the #1 pick with the Texans pick. However, I'd hold firm on not dropping past 3 in terms of trading that pick. MHJ could be a slower Calvin Johnson. Cant drop too far from that.

Ideally Cards w/ Kyler playing well/new staff doing well picking around 9 to 12.

There have been very good QBs on terribke teams and make no mistake about it, this is a talent-void cardinals team.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

7-10 Panthers
6-9 Bears

The nfl has taken away two games from the bears?

 

[DVontel]

The nfl has taken away two games from the bears?

6-11*

 

[RON_IN_OC]

The nfl has taken away two games from the bears?

Would anyone outside of Chicago really notice or care?

 

[slanidrac16]

I watched 4 videos on youtube about us tanking yesterday. 2 of them had the same obvious question, whether you think they're tanking or not what else would you have them do? What better option is there, the roster had to be overhauled.

I thought it was an interesting angle we weren't close enough where a few moves would get it back on track so with Kyler hurt the obvious response is total gut of the roster.

They all agree the coaches and players don't want to lose, it's simply management making moves to create room for the future and the picks to fill them.

Yes. And this falls on the previous regime that continued to believe we were 1or 2 or 3 aging veterans, all with the hope of a bounce back year to put us over the top.
Let’s face it. Bidwill is bleeding money with the amount of money he’s paying ex-coaching staffs and general manager.
When MO laid out his plan about stripping the roster and salary probably won him the job.
MO was left with a crap roster. Instead of piling more insignificant piles of crap he is cleaning up the crap. We can argue and debate the way he is going about it but we have to wait and see how this thing unfolds.