Can we talk about Okogie?

ASUCHRIS

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His case for starting won't be about overall scoring numbers, but about defensive versatility and offensive efficiency. He is 6-4. Seems small for a sf. However, Durant is 7-0 some say. I read an article that said that KD is measured at 6-11 without shoes and over 7-0 in shoes and has a 7-5 wingspan.
He's surely big and strong enough to play 3 in the NBA - with Durant/Ayton, we should have enough length.
 

95pro

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he’s on a good little heater but let’s not get too ahead of ourselves here.

The starter has been and will be Craig. He’s the cleanup and the fall guy for fouls for the first unit. Besides he’s bigger strong and a better shooter. We don’t need him to dribble in that unit.
 

BirdGangThing

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he’s on a good little heater but let’s not get too ahead of ourselves here.

The starter has been and will be Craig. He’s the cleanup and the fall guy for fouls for the first unit. Besides he’s bigger strong and a better shooter. We don’t need him to dribble in that unit.
Pretty sure Monty said (just last night) both Okogie and Craig would start some games. I don't know if the decisions will be made due to match ups or whoever has the hot hand but I imagine it'll be a bit of both
 

CardsSunsDbacks

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His case for starting won't be about overall scoring numbers, but about defensive versatility and offensive efficiency. He is 6-4. Seems small for a sf. However, Durant is 7-0 some say. I read an article that said that KD is measured at 6-11 without shoes and over 7-0 in shoes and has a 7-5 wingspan.
I would argue that his ability to score probably means he should be the first guy off the bench instead of starting. Sure his defense would be nice in the starting lineup, but his ability score and create is probably better utilized off the bench.
 

SirStefan32

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I would argue that his ability to score probably means he should be the first guy off the bench instead of starting. Sure his defense would be nice in the starting lineup, but his ability score and create is probably better utilized off the bench.

Okogie is better on defense than he is on offense. In my mind, that makes him a better fit for the starting unit. Scoring in the starting lineup is not going to be a problem. Off the bench, Warren can score, Ross can score, Payne (upon his return) can score, D. Lee can score, plus I am fairly certain that Booker and KD will be staggered in a way that ensures one of them is always on the floor.
 

SirStefan32

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Meh....he is shooting 33% for the season though. If he can just contribute something on a regular basis though? Our bench is better for sure.

That's all he needs to shoot as a starter. He doesn't need to be a sniper. He just needs to shoot well enough for other teams to not leave him wide open.
 

CardsSunsDbacks

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Okogie is better on defense than he is on offense. In my mind, that makes him a better fit for the starting unit. Scoring in the starting lineup is not going to be a problem. Off the bench, Warren can score, Ross can score, Payne (upon his return) can score, D. Lee can score, plus I am fairly certain that Booker and KD will be staggered in a way that ensures one of them is always on the floor.
Yes Ross and TJ can put the ball in the basket, but they don't create their own shot or pressure the defense off the dribble the way that Okogie can. The starting lineup already has that is spades with Book, KD and CP.
 

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Yes Ross and TJ can put the ball in the basket, but they don't create their own shot or pressure the defense off the dribble the way that Okogie can. The starting lineup already has that is spades with Book, KD and CP.
Ummm... correct me if I'm wrong but creating his own shot is literally TJ Warren's best attribute
 

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That's all he needs to shoot as a starter. He doesn't need to be a sniper. He just needs to shoot well enough for other teams to not leave him wide open.

No, teams will dare Okogie to beat us.
 

CardsSunsDbacks

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Ummm... correct me if I'm wrong but creating his own shot is literally TJ Warren's best attribute
He can create mid range looks, but he still doesn't pressure a defense off the dribble nearly like Okogie can. At the same time we don't have anyone to stick to elite guards in the starting lineup with Okogie on the bench. One name getting lost is Payne who I suppose when healthy is going to create some of that pressure off the bench that I'm talking about anyways.
 

BirdGangThing

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He can create mid range looks, but he still doesn't pressure a defense off the dribble nearly like Okogie can. At the same time we don't have anyone to stick to elite guards in the starting lineup with Okogie on the bench. One name getting lost is Payne who I suppose when healthy is going to create some of that pressure off the bench that I'm talking about anyways.
All I was saying is TJ Warren, aka Tony Buckets, can absolutely create his own shot. He can drive, pull up, camp out at the 3, grab an offensive rebound and put it back in or even leak out for fast break. Offense is what he does (when not injured)
 

SirStefan32

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Yes Ross and TJ can put the ball in the basket, but they don't create their own shot or pressure the defense off the dribble the way that Okogie can. The starting lineup already has that is spades with Book, KD and CP.

TJ is literally the best shot creator on the team outside of Book and the two old men. That's like one thing he can do.
 

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Okogie also has tremendous length though. 7ft wingspan and 8'6" standing reach. For comparison Cam Johnson has a 6'10" wingspan and 8'7" reach despite being 4 inches taller.
If that was the qualification though (not saying it is), then why wasn’t Okogie starting over Cam?

I don’t mind the idea of Okogie starting and maybe the idea that they would both start at various times has merit. But you can’t ignore Torrey’s size and strength, especially if KD plays in a small forward role instead of PF.

I just think Okogie won’t last as an everyday starter because his body will inevitably break down because of all the energy he’s expending in a starting role that merits longer minutes.
 
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JCSunsfan

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Okogie also has tremendous length though. 7ft wingspan and 8'6" standing reach. For comparison Cam Johnson has a 6'10" wingspan and 8'7" reach despite being 4 inches taller.
Ah. That's it. That is a freaky differential. It makes it hard for an offensive player to judge. He thinks he can shoot over the guy, and then there is that hand. This is especially helpful if he has decent hops. Also a shorter player with the bigger wingspan has an advantage over a taller player in that his ability to reach side to side and high to low is greater. That is amazing. His standing reach is almost the same as CamJohnson--who was effectively playing pf.

That makes him kind of a defensive version of Charles Barkley.
 
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JCSunsfan

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Okogie also has tremendous length though. 7ft wingspan and 8'6" standing reach. For comparison Cam Johnson has a 6'10" wingspan and 8'7" reach despite being 4 inches taller.
To put it in perspective. Mikal has a standing reach of 8' 4" according to Draftexpress. That means that his go-go gadget arms are significantly more impressive than Mikal's. Standing reach and vertical jump are much more significant than actual top of the head height. In fact, all other things being equal, the shorter player that has the same standing reach as a taller player will have a defensive advantage.

https://www.sactownroyalty.com/2018...file-mikal-bridges-villanova-sacramento-kings
 

SunsTzu

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If that was the qualification though (not saying it is), then why wasn’t Okogie starting over Cam?

Because Cam is a better player, I don't even know how to take this question seriously.

I was merely rebutting the idea that Okogie is too small to play forward.
 
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JCSunsfan

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Because Cam is a better player, I don't even know how to take this question seriously.

I was merely rebutting the idea that Okogie is too small to play forward.
right. Cam played solid D and was an absolutely stellar shooter. Okogie is a great defender but his shooting is developing. He also had been doing it for longer. Okogie is just now developing into the player he is.
 
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JCSunsfan

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Ok. After all this discussion and watching a lot of his defense. I think Okogie should be the fifth starter on this team. Here is my reasoning. He can guard the other team's best player 1-3 and in some cases 4. That basically fills the Mikal role on defense. I am not saying he will be as good at it. He is a different kind of defender, but his defensive versatility is similar. That is important because it relieves Book and CP3 from that defensive assignment, helping to give them more energy on offense, and hopefully avoiding foul trouble.

On some nights, if the other team's best player is a 4 or 5, Torrey Craig or even Bazley might be the better choices, to keep some of the defensive pressure off of KD.

A bench that features CamPayne, Ross, TJ, Biz, Landale, and even Bazley, will be fun to watch.

As an aside. We now have a Biz and Baz on our team.
 

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