Am I the only one a bit concerned that a DE has to "bulk" up to get to 257 lbs.?

Lomax to Green 84

Hall of Famer
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
1,410
Reaction score
596
Location
Illinois
I really could care less about the 40 time Terrell Suggs put up last week. The game tape shows that he is exceptionally quick, but the weight issue may be a bit of a concern. Suggs talked after the workout about having to get used to the extra weight. That statement didn't particularly bother me, because he will eventually get used to the weight, but the fact that he had to "bulk up" just to get to 257 is a bit concerning. I know that heights and weights are constantly inflated in the NFL, but if Terrell Suggs were to start on opening day at 257 lbs, according to my 2002 Peterson's Preview book he would be the lightest defensvie end in the league.

I have never claimed to be an expert on anything, but I do pride myself on my memory, and let me take a moment to help revive a nightmarish memory: the 1999 and 2000 Cardinals and those pathetic 5 man defensive fronts we played to help mask our undersized speed rushers (Rice and Wadsworth). Anybody else still have nightmares over those pathetic, worthless 5 man fronts who still got steamrolled even with 5 linemen? I know I don't dare want to relive those times and I fear that as good as Suggs is at rushing the passer, he is going to get absolulely killed in the running game at a bulked up 257 lbs. Realistically, Suggs is probably a 245-250 pound defensive end who took the advice of his agent and got up to the 255-260 pound range for his workouts. The 40 time and the less than stellar drill workouts may not have much bearing on his on the field play, but they may indicate that he is better served to play at his natural weight (245-250 lbs) instead of a weight trained inflated pre-draft weight.

I am starting to be swayed into believing that Suggs would be the best fit, but we need to come to the realization that the Cards may have to be very creative in masking his deficiencies. Even take a look at his college game tapes and you will see that the Sun Devils defensive staff had to do some creative things with Suggs. Rarely did they ever just leave him at right end. Instead they moved him all over the place and although that sounds great, it isn't as realistic in the NFL. Bouncing him back and forth from right end to left end, to outside backer is eerily reminiscent to the way the Cards used Rice. Sure it was designed to create pressure on the quarterback, but it was also used to help mask Rice's obvious run stopping deficiencies. Terrell Suggs may have a totally different attitude than Rice when it comes to stopping the run, but reality is that he is a very small end who will need help.

Criticize away. I am getting used to it by now.
 

Krangodnzr

Captain of Team Murray
Joined
Jul 21, 2002
Posts
35,278
Reaction score
31,867
Location
Orange County, CA
Leonard Little is not 260. Simeon Rice is 265 soaking wet....my point is: Does it really matter that much? No it doesn't.

KGB is listed at 255, but I totally doubt that he is even that much.

Suggs, if available is our best pick.
 

JeffGollin

ASFN Icon
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
20,472
Reaction score
3,056
Location
Holmdel, NJ
All I have to do is LOOK at a pizza to gain 10 pounds. I'm not worried about Suggs adding bulk. In fact I'd caution him not to gain weight just for the sake of gaining it. (If he goes about it wrong, all it will do is slow him down)

If he can add 10 pounds of muscle (which I'm pretty sure he can do), he'll be OK. But the weight gain should be the outgrowth of a good weight and conditioning program and not a numerical goal unto itself
 

40yearfan

DEFENSE!!!!
Supporting Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2003
Posts
35,007
Reaction score
432
Location
Phoenix, AZ.
Originally posted by JeffGollin
All I have to do is LOOK at a pizza to gain 10 pounds.
<p>Same here Jeff---the biggest problem is that it all goes to the waist. If I could just get it to go a little bit lower and expand something below the waist, the additional weight would not be a problem.:thumbup:
 

RonF

Per Ardua Ad Astra
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
2,090
Reaction score
4
Location
Sun City, AZ
Holian, I couldn't agree with you more. Why would anyone use their first pick on an undersize DE. What's the first thing a rookie says when he plays NFL ball "the players are much faster and stronger than what I played against in college." All I'm asking for is that we draft a true starter in this league, not just because we need help at a certain position. History has shown us that we tend to struggle with our first round picks, let's pray that we have our act together this year.
 

azdeftone

Veteran
BANNED BY MODERATORS
Joined
Oct 27, 2002
Posts
106
Reaction score
0
Location
az
Ron F and Holian are you guys serious.....

If Suggs is there at 6 (which he won't be) we would be freaking nuts not to take the guy!!! Pass rushers like him don't come along very often!! 40 times and weight don't mean **** when your a specialist and he is the best DE coming out BY FAR and that is our biggest area of need. ENOUGH SAID
 

Shane

Current STAR
Super Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
66,278
Reaction score
32,525
Location
Las Vegas
Originally posted by azdeftone
Ron F and Holian are you guys serious.....

If Suggs is there at 6 (which he won't be) we would be freaking nuts not to take the guy!!! Pass rushers like him don't come along very often!! 40 times and weight don't mean **** when your a specialist and he is the best DE coming out BY FAR and that is our biggest area of need. ENOUGH SAID

Ummmm What he said and Krang too!

GO GET THIS GUY!
 

RonF

Per Ardua Ad Astra
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
2,090
Reaction score
4
Location
Sun City, AZ
I don't want a specialist as my first choice I want a guy who can play each down and only gets better as the game progresses.
 

Shane

Current STAR
Super Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
66,278
Reaction score
32,525
Location
Las Vegas
Originally posted by RonF
I don't want a specialist as my first choice I want a guy who can play each down and only gets better as the game progresses.

In other words you want Terrell Suggs!

I dont know why everyone is so concerned about this guys weight? Have any of you truly watched him play?
 

azdeftone

Veteran
BANNED BY MODERATORS
Joined
Oct 27, 2002
Posts
106
Reaction score
0
Location
az
To all the people who seem to question Suggs I have three words!

WATCH SOME FILM!!!!!!

This guy may be the best DE coming out in the Draft in many years if he were there it would be a CRIME not to take him! Suggs has a non stop motor and is not that bad against the run he will be an ALL PRO mark my words. I dont care about his 40 time or his bench press hes young and will gain muscle he is just flat out a spectacular football player. I think those of you who have seen him play would agree.
 

Second Deck

Registered
Joined
Jul 1, 2002
Posts
938
Reaction score
0
All I have to do is look at Jason Taylor and I see what I think Suggs will play like. If he is there at 6 take him. We missed Rice more than I ever thought we would. You have to get pressure on the QB.
 

ajcardfan

I see you.
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
36,985
Reaction score
21,572
I can't believe we're having this conversation AGAIN. Suggs' weight is the TREND of top DE's coming out the last few years. He's rated head and shoulders above every other DE in the draft. I don't think any other player is such a clear number 1 at his position. Passing on Suggs because of his weight would be so stupid it'd make the Boston move look Einsteinian by comparison.

Once again, not only did he have 24 sacks, he had 32!!!!!!!! tackles for loss. That'd be running plays! He's a motherfrickin' DE not a pass rush specialist!!! :trout:
 

Shane

Current STAR
Super Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
66,278
Reaction score
32,525
Location
Las Vegas
Originally posted by ajcardfan
I can't believe we're having this conversation AGAIN. Suggs' weight is the TREND of top DE's coming out the last few years. He's rated head and shoulders above every other DE in the draft. I don't think any other player is such a clear number 1 at his position. Passing on Suggs because of his weight would be so stupid it'd make the Boston move look Einsteinian by comparison.

Once again, not only did he have 24 sacks, he had 32!!!!!!!! tackles for loss. That'd be running plays! He's a motherfrickin' DE not a pass rush specialist!!! :trout:

Well said AJ!
 

PortlandCardFan

Registered User
Joined
Oct 1, 2002
Posts
10,206
Reaction score
4
Location
Portland, OR
Okay my internet has been down all weekend. I am trying to catch up on all of the posts.

One thing that no one has mentioned (in this thread) is that Suggs is what 20 years old.

Come'on By the time he is 24 he could easily weigh 275.

I guess my point is that he is still a growing kid.
 

seesred

Registered User
Joined
Jul 15, 2002
Posts
5,364
Reaction score
28
Location
section 8 row 10
We need Suggs. There is nobody in this draft who has his ability to change a game. If he is there he is ours. I believe it is in our interest to make a move in the draft to make sure we get him/.

GBR
 

Krangodnzr

Captain of Team Murray
Joined
Jul 21, 2002
Posts
35,278
Reaction score
31,867
Location
Orange County, CA
Originally posted by PortlandCardFan
Okay my internet has been down all weekend. I am trying to catch up on all of the posts.

One thing that no one has mentioned (in this thread) is that Suggs is what 20 years old.

Come'on By the time he is 24 he could easily weigh 275.

I guess my point is that he is still a growing kid.

He doesn't even need to gain that much weight! :D
 

coyotecard

Newbie
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
49
Reaction score
0
Location
St Michael Minnesota
Suggs

Normally I would take my usual position that 257 pound DE's are too small. Maybe not in this case. I just read a report about a scuffle that Terrell was in where he took an iron bar to the back of his head. Some jerk was attacking his brother or cousin---dont remember--- but Suggs stopped the attack and disarmed the attacker AFTER HE HAD BEEN HIT with the iron bar. What I am thinking is, try the same thing on the 260+ DE's in the draft and see how they stand up to the test. Suggs gets major points from me for his actions and stamina. I say he can play for me SOMEWHERE anytime he wants to.
PS: He isnt likely to "grow" much more than he is but solid weight work out and a good diet could probably get him to 265 which in his case might be enough--------maybe even without a helmet!!!!!
 
Top