5 Draft Thoughts

RugbyMuffin

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Mock drafts at this time of year are completely worthless. With the smoke screens and the last minute changes, at this point, find your mock from 3 weeks ago, and keep that next to you while watching the draft.

The NFL draft is starting to really be like horse racing. You get your program and all the information on the horses is right there at your finger tips. The odds have been out for a week or more, and are in print before you ever get to the track. Then right before the race starts, the odds start jumping all over the place, and everything goes out the window, and you have till the race starts to make your choice. You follow the program, or the odds that are now right in front of you. The clock is ticking and you gotta put your money down.

Thus there is not much to talk about, we have our program so to speak, just waiting for the draft (race) to start. So, I will copy cat Mitch and throw out some thoughts.


1. This draft is going to be over-hyped when it comes to that actual football talent that it will produce. Calling a draft "deep", and the overall opinion that no one really knows what is going to happen in this year's draft are great and all that. But, in general I think there are is lot of opinions out there that are using the fact there is confusion and that there is talent interchangeably. Yes, there is general confusion on where players are going to go in the draft, but because of that there are a lot more players getting in depth analysis, leading to a feeling there is more talent in the draft than normal. I think this is going to result in a lot of "bust" talk come mid-season and next offseason when it comes to this draft. Yes, there is depth, but in my opinion there are also positions where the talent falls off a cliff after the second round.


2. Haason Reddick. I just do not see it, not in the first round, and not at #13. Fair enough, the kid is a great athlete, but right now, he is not a great football player. I start looking at the draft, and he wasn't on my radar. I saw, an inexperienced, light weight linebacker that misses A LOT of tackles, and hasn't even played the position that so many THINK he could play, which is ILB. Now that being said, this is almost a carbon copy of my thoughts about D.J. Humphries a couple of years ago. Humphries started the draft season as a 3rd or 4th round pick, much like Reddick did. His pure athleticism drove him up the draft, board, and SURPRISE, the Cardinals then picked him. I was not happy to say the least. But fair enough, the Cardinals coached up Humphries, got him NFL ready, and now he is a pretty damn good tackle in the NFL. Do you take that risk here ? Are the Cardinals really going to take a inside linebacker at #13 that will be a bit of a reach, need to learn the position and develop over a quarterback who will be a bit of a reach, need to learn the position, and develop ? Doesn't make sense to me. But that is why I am not working in the NFL. LOL.


3. The other quarterback. I am a huge fan of Drew Stanton. Never understood the flack this guy gets, he is a great backup, and all he does is come into games and win. What more can you ask for ? Yet, he is 32 years old, and even said himself, that he knows he is going to see his replacement come through the doors sooner rather than later. Absolutely no reason to cut him, and there is absolutely no reason that if a QB prospect is drafted that he cannot be the "#3" QB on the roster, and "#2" on game day. NONE. Drew knows this offense inside and out, and is just a another coach that a prospect can talk to about this position. Yeah, Palmer can help out too, but anyone that has ever trained a new employee can tell you, it is a weight on your outside your normal work load. Stanton is a luxury. If the chips fall in a way that the Cardinals do not get a starting quarterback of the future, do not be surprised if a Brad Kaaya, Nate Peterman, or Joshua Dobbs is not drafted, and ends up a backup here in the desert for a long time. Personally, I think Kaaya is a great fit. He has his shortcomings like all NFL backups do, but he has the skills that he can get the job done in this offense.


4. Athletes vs. football players. I think that is what will doom me in this draft, at least in regards to "who I think the Cardinals should pick". Which of course amounts to absolutely NOTHING, because I am not a scout, and my butt is not on the line on draft day. Still with all the fun we have before the draft we all have our assumptions on what will happen, what needs to happen, etc., etc. You would think in the NFL draft that football players would be the most important thing that teams look for......yet, look at NFL team's actions. They draft top flight athletes FIRST, and the top 10 is usually freakish athletes that are ALSO proven football players. But, think about it. Tony Jefferson didn't get drafted at all, because he was "too slow". But, Jefferson proved everyone wrong, why ? Cause he was a hell of a football player. When looking at safeties and cornerbacks, that is the only thing I have looked at to try and sort them out. Who is the football players, and who are the "great athletes". Didn't help much but a player like **** Tebor, will be interesting. He is the Marcus Cooper of this draft, no the best athlete, not the best tackler, but his ball skills are great, and his ability to play at the line of scrimmage is great. When the Cardinals look for football players over athletes they have been pretty successful. They keep talking about Arians and the 3rd round......I think the Cardinals are going to make some good and effective picks in the 4th, and 5th.


5. At this point, is there really anything to do other than wait ? That is it. Is there ? Nothing but smoke and mirrors being talked about today. All kinds of "last minute news" that teams have known for months will be put out there to generate internet interest, and keep people watching draft shows, like there is every year. But, the table is set, and the 32 teams are ready to eat. Right now they are probably just getting their travel plans together for the week. Thus all we can do is wait.



Looking forward to Thursday, as I said this draft is receiving a lot of hype, I question if the declaration of depth of talent is valid, but that doesn't mean the NFL was not successful and getting my interest up enough that I am now looking forward to next weekend.

Bring on the draft!
 

football karma

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It's a good perspective RM

I have reached a place of draft agnosticism

I care, I'm interested and I have opinions -- but I also know that I have no idea if, for example, Foster or Reddick will turn out to be the better football player. I do know the media also has no idea. Heck -- I suspect NFL scouts and FO people barely know

So -- I just can't get worked up over who the Cards take or don't take.
 

gmabel830

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Whoever we take, I and most others on the board will convince ourselves is the perfect pick

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 

WildBB

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Good comments Rugby. It's a big draft for this franchise. Now and for the future. We need some bigger hits in this one; one being the QB. We need a starter at CB and possibly FS. ST's should get attention. It'll be interesting.
 

Mitch

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Mock drafts at this time of year are completely worthless. With the smoke screens and the last minute changes, at this point, find your mock from 3 weeks ago, and keep that next to you while watching the draft.

The NFL draft is starting to really be like horse racing. You get your program and all the information on the horses is right there at your finger tips. The odds have been out for a week or more, and are in print before you ever get to the track. Then right before the race starts, the odds start jumping all over the place, and everything goes out the window, and you have till the race starts to make your choice. You follow the program, or the odds that are now right in front of you. The clock is ticking and you gotta put your money down.

Thus there is not much to talk about, we have our program so to speak, just waiting for the draft (race) to start. So, I will copy cat Mitch and throw out some thoughts.


1. This draft is going to be over-hyped when it comes to that actual football talent that it will produce. Calling a draft "deep", and the overall opinion that no one really knows what is going to happen in this year's draft are great and all that. But, in general I think there are is lot of opinions out there that are using the fact there is confusion and that there is talent interchangeably. Yes, there is general confusion on where players are going to go in the draft, but because of that there are a lot more players getting in depth analysis, leading to a feeling there is more talent in the draft than normal. I think this is going to result in a lot of "bust" talk come mid-season and next offseason when it comes to this draft. Yes, there is depth, but in my opinion there are also positions where the talent falls off a cliff after the second round.


2. Haason Reddick. I just do not see it, not in the first round, and not at #13. Fair enough, the kid is a great athlete, but right now, he is not a great football player. I start looking at the draft, and he wasn't on my radar. I saw, an inexperienced, light weight linebacker that misses A LOT of tackles, and hasn't even played the position that so many THINK he could play, which is ILB. Now that being said, this is almost a carbon copy of my thoughts about D.J. Humphries a couple of years ago. Humphries started the draft season as a 3rd or 4th round pick, much like Reddick did. His pure athleticism drove him up the draft, board, and SURPRISE, the Cardinals then picked him. I was not happy to say the least. But fair enough, the Cardinals coached up Humphries, got him NFL ready, and now he is a pretty damn good tackle in the NFL. Do you take that risk here ? Are the Cardinals really going to take a inside linebacker at #13 that will be a bit of a reach, need to learn the position and develop over a quarterback who will be a bit of a reach, need to learn the position, and develop ? Doesn't make sense to me. But that is why I am not working in the NFL. LOL.


3. The other quarterback. I am a huge fan of Drew Stanton. Never understood the flack this guy gets, he is a great backup, and all he does is come into games and win. What more can you ask for ? Yet, he is 32 years old, and even said himself, that he knows he is going to see his replacement come through the doors sooner rather than later. Absolutely no reason to cut him, and there is absolutely no reason that if a QB prospect is drafted that he cannot be the "#3" QB on the roster, and "#2" on game day. NONE. Drew knows this offense inside and out, and is just a another coach that a prospect can talk to about this position. Yeah, Palmer can help out too, but anyone that has ever trained a new employee can tell you, it is a weight on your outside your normal work load. Stanton is a luxury. If the chips fall in a way that the Cardinals do not get a starting quarterback of the future, do not be surprised if a Brad Kaaya, Nate Peterman, or Joshua Dobbs is not drafted, and ends up a backup here in the desert for a long time. Personally, I think Kaaya is a great fit. He has his shortcomings like all NFL backups do, but he has the skills that he can get the job done in this offense.


4. Athletes vs. football players. I think that is what will doom me in this draft, at least in regards to "who I think the Cardinals should pick". Which of course amounts to absolutely NOTHING, because I am not a scout, and my butt is not on the line on draft day. Still with all the fun we have before the draft we all have our assumptions on what will happen, what needs to happen, etc., etc. You would think in the NFL draft that football players would be the most important thing that teams look for......yet, look at NFL team's actions. They draft top flight athletes FIRST, and the top 10 is usually freakish athletes that are ALSO proven football players. But, think about it. Tony Jefferson didn't get drafted at all, because he was "too slow". But, Jefferson proved everyone wrong, why ? Cause he was a hell of a football player. When looking at safeties and cornerbacks, that is the only thing I have looked at to try and sort them out. Who is the football players, and who are the "great athletes". Didn't help much but a player like **** Tebor, will be interesting. He is the Marcus Cooper of this draft, no the best athlete, not the best tackler, but his ball skills are great, and his ability to play at the line of scrimmage is great. When the Cardinals look for football players over athletes they have been pretty successful. They keep talking about Arians and the 3rd round......I think the Cardinals are going to make some good and effective picks in the 4th, and 5th.


5. At this point, is there really anything to do other than wait ? That is it. Is there ? Nothing but smoke and mirrors being talked about today. All kinds of "last minute news" that teams have known for months will be put out there to generate internet interest, and keep people watching draft shows, like there is every year. But, the table is set, and the 32 teams are ready to eat. Right now they are probably just getting their travel plans together for the week. Thus all we can do is wait.



Looking forward to Thursday, as I said this draft is receiving a lot of hype, I question if the declaration of depth of talent is valid, but that doesn't mean the NFL was not successful and getting my interest up enough that I am now looking forward to next weekend.

Bring on the draft!

Great post, as always, Rugby!

Some reactions:

* excellent horse racing analogy in your intro!

1. This draft does appear very deep in three areas the Cardinals need: CB, S, ILB.

2. Reddick, as you say, is a little difficult to project to the NFL in that he played DE most of the snaps at Temple. But when you look at how he maintains the edge and how he uses his quickness to force and finish plays, his skills are readily translatable to a number of different roles in the pros. If the Cardinals are looking for him to be the Mike ILB, I think that's a bit of a reach. I think he is exactly what we need as a 34OLB...we are too slow on the edges versus the run, screens, read options and reverses. I would love to see Reddick start at WOLB in the base 34, which would allow Chandler Jones to move down to Calais Campbell's 5 technique. The Pats did this at times with Jones and with good results. Then in sub packages, Jones can rush the edge and Reddick can shift to nickel LB, where he can be used as a cover LB vs. RBs & TEs, as an A, B, C gap blitzer and as a QB spy. OR---Reddick is faster than Tony Jefferson and imo would be nasty in Jefferson's SS role. I just love Reddick's versatility.

3. I am not as high on Stanton as you. I have very little confidence in him and it looks like the coaches feel the same because when he's in the game BA dials everything down 5 notches. He is 6-4 as a starter and that's, as you say, good. But how many of those wins were against teams with winning records? The Cardinals have paid him handsomely and thus he is not really a luxury. This year he counts over $4M on the cap. I would rather give that coin to Dwight Freeney, who, imo, was the guy who helped fuel the 9 game winning streak in 2015. He still wants to play and his unsigned.

4. Good point about athletes versus football players. Perfect case in point: DE/OLB Markus Golden. Didn't wow anyone at the Combine, but put him in uniform and line him up and he is a baller.

5. I want to do a final mock...with 3 plans A (stay), B (trade up), C (trade down). I know many have had enough of mocks by now, but with each mock I feel like I am getting a stronger handle on which way the draft is going to go. Like you said, all we can do is wait. But, in the interim I want to keep the wheels spinning.
 

TRW

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I think the Cards got the last good bit out of Freeney. Looks like he's pretty much done.

Stanton will be here as long as BA is if he wants to be it seems like. He isn't good, even as a backup IMO, but BA is loyal to his buds. BA said Stanton could lead them to a SB and did it with a straight face. Yeah, right Bruce, right. LOL
 
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Good read Rugby. I appreciate the time & effort put in to it. I agree with #3. Stanton is great in his role as back up & could definitely help a rookie to learn. Also agree about looking for football players not athletes. :thumbup:
 

Harry

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If you're not aware from some of my earlier posts I know for a fact that some scouts, players and even a few front office people read these types of forums & fan websites. Why? There are actually some good ideas, occasional tips on previously obscure players and to take the temperature of fans. So don't think this is purely an intellectual exercise.

1. Can't agree
2. Agree on Reddick, but I think Humphries was more a case of maturity though I'm sure coaching helped.
3. Mostly agree. I'm not as high on Stanton, but in today's NFL he's a decent backup
4. Food for thought. Certainly true of some teams.
5. Until the pick is made it's never too late to change your pick since you don't have to put a board together.
 

TheCardFan

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1) Completely disagree
2) Completely agree - He is a DE that is projected to LB. Too small for OLB and hasn't ever played ILB. That doesn't mean he won't be good but he is a bigger risk than normal (going as high as he will). Think Mike Mamula.
3) Complete disagree. I would agree he was decent in 2014 but the last 2 years (2015 and 2016)...he was just plain awful. I would rather have a rookie in there vs Stanton (no upside) the way he has played the last 2 years.
4) Agree - See Haason Reddick.
5) I would imagine it's more about strategy right now...going through possible scenarios on who they want and where they may be able to get them.

I am super pumped for Thursday!
 

Stout

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It's a good perspective RM

I have reached a place of draft agnosticism

I care, I'm interested and I have opinions -- but I also know that I have no idea if, for example, Foster or Reddick will turn out to be the better football player. I do know the media also has no idea. Heck -- I suspect NFL scouts and FO people barely know

So -- I just can't get worked up over who the Cards take or don't take.

I'm right there with you.
 

WisconsinCard

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The thing about horseracing is that they odds begin to change as bets are being made. In Las Vegas they do the same for any line for any sport. They want to keep the bets even on both sides and just collect their juice.
 

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