2021-22 Around the NBA Thread

[Hoop Head]

Meanwhile, if Devin isn’t vaxxed, that will hurt us a lot. We’ve got 6 games in Cali that he’d have to miss, all against division opponents. That can’t happen if we want that 1 seed, which I think is still very important for a team as young as ours

I'm pretty sure Booker is vaxxed. I'm not positive but I remember a lot of talk when CP3 was put into Covid protocols during the WCF and I remember talk of others being vaxxed, with Booker being one of the first Suns to get vaxxed.

 

[Phrazbit]

I’m super curious to see what shakes out with Wiggins and Kyrie. I can see Wiggins eventually caving and getting the vax, but Kyrie is a guy who’s pretty off his rocker. If he won’t get it and can’t play home games, what the hell does that do to the Nets? Do they trade him to a team that plays in a state he can play in? Does NY give him a one person exemption that will piss the holy hell out of vax and non-vaxxers alike?

Also, if Wiggins balks, and Klay now is looking like he might not be back until January, that GS team is in big trouble.

Meanwhile, if Devin isn’t vaxxed, that will hurt us a lot. We’ve got 6 games in Cali that he’d have to miss, all against division opponents. That can’t happen if we want that 1 seed, which I think is still very important for a team as young as ours.

I cannot imagine someone trading for Kyrie, unless it's just a contract dump. He supposedly was excited for Brooklyn and still seemed to hardly give a crap for long stretches last year. Any team that trades for him would have very little assurance that he'd actually try, he likely wouldn't even show up.

As for Devin, I'm pretty sure he is vaccinated, if he hadn't been wouldn't he have been put in protocols during the playoffs because of exposure to Paul when he got sick?

 

[Phrazbit]

There isn't a snowball's chance in Phoenix in June of getting the 1 seed, or frankly even of getting a top 4 seed, as long as the hole at power forward remains unaddressed, anyway...

And there you have it. Any of you gamblers out there, the Suns are now a virtual lock for the 1 seed.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm pretty sure Booker is vaxxed. I'm not positive but I remember a lot of talk when CP3 was put into Covid protocols during the WCF and I remember talk of others being vaxxed, with Booker being one of the first Suns to get vaxxed.

Could be. But he also wouldn’t answer if he was vaxxed or not recently when he got Covid.

 

[Phrazbit]

Could be. But he also wouldn’t answer if he was vaxxed or not recently when he got Covid.

He was on his twitch stream I believe... maybe he was trying to avoid the political nonsense that comes up whenever it gets brought up on the internet. Twitch chat rooms are a cesspool.

Regardless, we'll find out in November when we travel to New York.

 

[Phrazbit]

More tea reading on Booker's vaccine status...

Didn't he just hop around Europe with his girlfriend? Much of Europe requires proof of vaccine to travel.

 

[TJ]

h

More tea reading on Booker's vaccine status...

Didn't he just hop around Europe with his girlfriend? Much of Europe requires proof of vaccine to travel.

Hes vaccinated

 

[Mainstreet]

I think DA gets it after next season once he proves it full for a full season. Mikal doesn’t have much upside beyond what we’ve seen but his market is still north of $20m a year. I expect his to get done.

I think Bridges gets paid somewhere around the 4 year/ $90 million mark. IMO, Bridges has more upside than he has shown. If the Suns were to wait on a player it might be him but I think they will want to wrap him up especially if he accepts less.

After the Michael Porter Jr. signing I think Ayton gets the max now.

 

[Chaplin]

I think Bridges gets paid somewhere around the 4 year/ $90 million mark. IMO, Bridges has more upside than he has shown. If the Suns were to wait on a player it might be him but I think they will want to wrap him up especially if he accepts less.

After the Michael Porter Jr. signing I think Ayton gets the max now.

Ayton was always going to get the max, regardless of the MPJ contract. Luka and Trey Young saw to that.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'm pretty sure Booker is vaxxed. I'm not positive but I remember a lot of talk when CP3 was put into Covid protocols during the WCF and I remember talk of others being vaxxed, with Booker being one of the first Suns to get vaxxed.

I've read that Booker was vaccinated and the rest of the current Suns players as well.

 

[Mainstreet]

I’m super curious to see what shakes out with Wiggins and Kyrie. I can see Wiggins eventually caving and getting the vax, but Kyrie is a guy who’s pretty off his rocker. If he won’t get it and can’t play home games, what the hell does that do to the Nets? Do they trade him to a team that plays in a state he can play in? Does NY give him a one person exemption that will piss the holy hell out of vax and non-vaxxers alike?

Also, if Wiggins balks, and Klay now is looking like he might not be back until January, that GS team is in big trouble.

Meanwhile, if Devin isn’t vaxxed, that will hurt us a lot. We’ve got 6 games in Cali that he’d have to miss, all against division opponents. That can’t happen if we want that 1 seed, which I think is still very important for a team as young as ours.

Yeah. I'm sure not going to lose any sleep about those players who don't get vaccinated.

Devin Booker is all about the team. I have no doubt he is vaccinated.

 

[Russ Smith]

I’m super curious to see what shakes out with Wiggins and Kyrie. I can see Wiggins eventually caving and getting the vax, but Kyrie is a guy who’s pretty off his rocker. If he won’t get it and can’t play home games, what the hell does that do to the Nets? Do they trade him to a team that plays in a state he can play in? Does NY give him a one person exemption that will piss the holy hell out of vax and non-vaxxers alike?

Also, if Wiggins balks, and Klay now is looking like he might not be back until January, that GS team is in big trouble.

Meanwhile, if Devin isn’t vaxxed, that will hurt us a lot. We’ve got 6 games in Cali that he’d have to miss, all against division opponents. That can’t happen if we want that 1 seed, which I think is still very important for a team as young as ours.

Warriors also will likely start the year without Wiseman who had his knee done and isn't ready yet. There's some speculation he might only miss the first 4-5 games but nobody really knows.

This is of course why the Wiggins situation is so maddening, if he can't play in home games and they can't trade him because who wants an unvaccinated player making that much money, screwed.

Aside from the health risks etc he's on a team with Steph and Klay and Draymond where he knew if he did his part they'd have a chance to be a playoff team this year and depending on Klay's healthy maybe a chance to make a playoff run. Now he's basically put all that in peril because he won't get vaccinated when they will desperately need him to take up slack until Klay can play.

Just infuriating.

 

[Hoop Head]

Warriors also will likely start the year without Wiseman who had his knee done and isn't ready yet. There's some speculation he might only miss the first 4-5 games but nobody really knows.

This is of course why the Wiggins situation is so maddening, if he can't play in home games and they can't trade him because who wants an unvaccinated player making that much money, screwed.

Aside from the health risks etc he's on a team with Steph and Klay and Draymond where he knew if he did his part they'd have a chance to be a playoff team this year and depending on Klay's healthy maybe a chance to make a playoff run. Now he's basically put all that in peril because he won't get vaccinated when they will desperately need him to take up slack until Klay can play.

Just infuriating.

What are you all expecting from Klay this year? Clearly he'll help compared to the G Leaguers that have been there but he hasn't played in 2 full seasons and won't be ready until January at the soonest? I'm curious because when he was penciled in to returning at the beginning the new season it seemed a lot of pundits had them taking the division and winning 55 games or so. Is that viewed as realistic anymore?

 

[Mainstreet]

Caris LeVert reportedly has a stress fracture in back.

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[Mainstreet]

Warriors also will likely start the year without Wiseman who had his knee done and isn't ready yet. There's some speculation he might only miss the first 4-5 games but nobody really knows.

This is of course why the Wiggins situation is so maddening, if he can't play in home games and they can't trade him because who wants an unvaccinated player making that much money, screwed.

Aside from the health risks etc he's on a team with Steph and Klay and Draymond where he knew if he did his part they'd have a chance to be a playoff team this year and depending on Klay's healthy maybe a chance to make a playoff run. Now he's basically put all that in peril because he won't get vaccinated when they will desperately need him to take up slack until Klay can play.

Just infuriating.

It's hard to believe Wiggins will give up about $350,000 dollars per game on games missed in the two cities where he is required to be vaccinated. Ultimately I think money will talk the loudest.

 

[Russ Smith]

What are you all expecting from Klay this year? Clearly he'll help compared to the G Leaguers that have been there but he hasn't played in 2 full seasons and won't be ready until January at the soonest? I'm curious because when he was penciled in to returning at the beginning the new season it seemed a lot of pundits had them taking the division and winning 55 games or so. Is that viewed as realistic anymore?

Well all the videos showed him just raining jumpers in workouts so if he were healthy I thought it was reasonable that he could hit 3's and be good offensively, not Klay in his prime good coming off 2 full years off but good. It's really defense I've been worried about he's a VERY good defender but after 2 years seems unlikely that will be the same this year.

With him out for awhile now I think it dramatically changes things. they went from a team that might be a top 4 seed in the West to a team that has to finish well enough to make the playoffs and then make a run IMO.

The Wiggins thing is infuriating to me there's a limited window here with Klay and Steph and Draymond and Wiggins is potentially taking one year out of that window.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Ayton was always going to get the max, regardless of the MPJ contract. Luka and Trey Young saw to that.

Agreed

 

[Proximo]

James Jones has to be punching air today. Maybe he felt he could have Ayton back on less than max. Not that that was the likely conclusion, but that ship has now sailed with the MPJ contract.

Just give Ayton the max and move on

They have already offered the max weeks ago. The issue is how much of a pay hike he can get through reaching the milestones. Ayton is asking for like 30% Suns are at like 25% or something like that.

It is going to be a done deal pretty soon.

The Mikal deal just got a lot harder with this Porter signing though I bet.

 

[Hoop Head]

Well all the videos showed him just raining jumpers in workouts so if he were healthy I thought it was reasonable that he could hit 3's and be good offensively, not Klay in his prime good coming off 2 full years off but good. It's really defense I've been worried about he's a VERY good defender but after 2 years seems unlikely that will be the same this year.

With him out for awhile now I think it dramatically changes things. they went from a team that might be a top 4 seed in the West to a team that has to finish well enough to make the playoffs and then make a run IMO.

The Wiggins thing is infuriating to me there's a limited window here with Klay and Steph and Draymond and Wiggins is potentially taking one year out of that window.

Do you think Wiggins could be forcing his way out or he is really anti-vaxx? Just seems odd he's so against it. He also went from being option 1A or 1B in Minnesota to being almost an afterthought in Golden State. He's riding a max deal now with virtually no chance of getting another, not that he deserves it, but if he stayed on a small market team then he'd have a shot at keeping his salary upwards of $20-25 million a year.

 

[Hoop Head]

They have already offered the max weeks ago. The issue is how much of a pay hike he can get through reaching the milestones. Ayton is asking for like 30% Suns are at like 25% or something like that.

It is going to be a done deal pretty soon.

The Mikal deal just got a lot harder with this Porter signing though I bet.

He can't get more than 25% of the cap. He doesn't meet the criteria for the Derrick Rose Rule, which would pay him 30% of the cap, unless he wins MVP this year. Not sure where you're getting that info but it isn't legal under CBA rules so it doesn't make sense.

 

[Mainstreet]

He can't get more than 25% of the cap. He doesn't meet the criteria for the Derrick Rose Rule, which would pay him 30% of the cap, unless he wins MVP this year. Not sure where you're getting that info but it isn't legal under CBA rules so it doesn't make sense.

I think Deandre Ayton qualifies for the supermax with incentives. Maybe this is the confusion. He does not qualify for 30%.

Dave King of Bright Side of the Suns has a couple of thoughts on how the Michael Porter Jr. contract could effect the Suns.



By Dave King, Sep 28, 2021, 11:00am MST:


A supermax would be at minimum at 5 years, $172 million (25% of cap with max raises) with a potential for $207 over those same years (30% of cap to start) if he makes All-NBA or wins an award this coming season.

--------------------------------------------------------

We shall see how the contract extension discussions play out from here, but there are two ways I believe the Porter extension impacts the Suns discussions with Ayton and Bridges:

1. Ayton will almost certainly never accept less than the supermax already given to Luka, Trae, MPJ and SGA from his draft class. What that means is 25% of the cap guaranteed (about $30 million next year) with 8% raises and a chance to increase that base number to 30% if he makes All-NBA or wins some other award like Defensive Player of the Year.
2. Bridges might no longer accept a four year contract for less than $100 million.

Ayton should accept nothing less than the supermax now

With Michael Porter Jr. getting the supermax to match three other 2018 draftees, Ayton must now join them.

www.brightsideofthesun.com

 

[Hoop Head]

I think Deandre Ayton qualifies for the supermax with incentives. Maybe this is the confusion. He does not qualify for 30%.

Dave King of Bright Side of the Suns has a couple of thoughts on how the Michael Porter Jr. contract could effect the Suns.



By Dave King, Sep 28, 2021, 11:00am MST:


A supermax would be at minimum at 5 years, $172 million (25% of cap with max raises) with a potential for $207 over those same years (30% of cap to start) if he makes All-NBA or wins an award this coming season.

--------------------------------------------------------

We shall see how the contract extension discussions play out from here, but there are two ways I believe the Porter extension impacts the Suns discussions with Ayton and Bridges:

1. Ayton will almost certainly never accept less than the supermax already given to Luka, Trae, MPJ and SGA from his draft class. What that means is 25% of the cap guaranteed (about $30 million next year) with 8% raises and a chance to increase that base number to 30% if he makes All-NBA or wins some other award like Defensive Player of the Year.
2. Bridges might no longer accept a four year contract for less than $100 million.

Ayton should accept nothing less than the supermax now

With Michael Porter Jr. getting the supermax to match three other 2018 draftees, Ayton must now join them.

www.brightsideofthesun.com

Im not sure if Young, and SGA all signed max deals with super max language, although they could have. Doncic got the supermax because he qualified for it already, no need to ask for it because he might achieve All NBA status this year.

If Ayton really wants to gamble and hold out for the supermax language that's his choice but there were questions he was worth the max almost his entire career. So he'd surely be betting a ton on something that may not play out. We'll see, I would be surprised if that was the real hold up though.

I was reading MPJ likely got the supermax option in his deal because year 5 is only partially guaranteed. So its a give and take situation there. I still think he was overpaid without that but I don't think there's a chance MPJ qualifies for it. I mean, he's got 1 year to do so.

 

[Mainstreet]

Im not sure if Young, and SGA all signed max deals with super max language, although they could have. Doncic got the supermax because he qualified for it already, no need to ask for it because he might achieve All NBA status this year.

If Ayton really wants to gamble and hold out for the supermax language that's his choice but there were questions he was worth the max almost his entire career. So he'd surely be betting a ton on something that may not play out. We'll see, I would be surprised if that was the real hold up though.

I was reading MPJ likely got the supermax option in his deal because year 5 is only partially guaranteed. So its a give and take situation there. I still think he was overpaid without that but I don't think there's a chance MPJ qualifies for it. I mean, he's got 1 year to do so.

I've read elsewhere that Deandre Ayton would get the $172 million rookie extension without the options. This sounds more realistic but we will see soon enough.

 

[Russ Smith]

Do you think Wiggins could be forcing his way out or he is really anti-vaxx? Just seems odd he's so against it. He also went from being option 1A or 1B in Minnesota to being almost an afterthought in Golden State. He's riding a max deal now with virtually no chance of getting another, not that he deserves it, but if he stayed on a small market team then he'd have a shot at keeping his salary upwards of $20-25 million a year.

Wiggins has always been an interesting guy. Early in his career he just seemed to have no killer instinct he was just too passive at times, but at the same time a fairly selfish player. He played MUCH better with the Warriors I was impressed with his defense and he played as part of the team. But the vaccine thing really bugs me he's untradeable wtih the contract and unvaccinated so they're stuck trying to get him to get vaccinated or it hurts the team.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Wiggins has always been an interesting guy. Early in his career he just seemed to have no killer instinct he was just too passive at times, but at the same time a fairly selfish player. He played MUCH better with the Warriors I was impressed with his defense and he played as part of the team. But the vaccine thing really bugs me he's untradeable wtih the contract and unvaccinated so they're stuck trying to get him to get vaccinated or it hurts the team.

I’m betting he caves and so does Kyrie. Wiggins isn’t going to retire and he’s not just going to blow off all that money. As for Kyrie, I think of some of this he’s doing is just trying to get attention he craves more than anything else.

He caves in the end too.