Suns Off-season Thread

[taz02]

Three pounds of weed? WTF

Is he selling it?

hopefully, you don't want a player that needs 3 pounds for personal use...

 

[somethingshesaid]

Because any one comment is buried by dozens of new comments every day and I thought too late that I could have bookmarked it, I already forgot who explained that Ayton is the linchpin of the Suns' entire defense. (The unspoken conclusion is that there wouldn't be a notably good defense without Ayton.) That being the case, there needs to be more discussion of whether Ayton should be traded in the first place or whether the Suns should just give him his money (and bite the bullet on the tax until Chris Paul retires.) "I don't want Kevin Durant," which has been said often enough, is not the same as "I don't want to trade DeAndre Ayton," which isn't being said much.

Only a few times in their history have the Phoenix Suns been notably good on defense. (And when it was said that they were, they nevertheless didn't get near a championship, probably because they weren't very good in other ways.) I'm not very interested in losing that. Kevin Durant wouldn't help.

 

[Chaplin]

Because any one comment is buried by dozens of new comments every day and I thought too late that I could have bookmarked it, I already forgot who explained that Ayton is the linchpin of the Suns' entire defense. (The unspoken conclusion is that there wouldn't be a notably good defense without Ayton.) That being the case, there needs to be more discussion of whether Ayton should be traded in the first place or whether the Suns should just give him his money (and bite the bullet on the tax until Chris Paul retires.) "I don't want Kevin Durant," which has been said often enough, is not the same as "I don't want to trade DeAndre Ayton," which isn't being said much.

Only a few times in their history have the Phoenix Suns been notably good on defense. I'm not very interested in losing that. Kevin Durant wouldn't help.

Seems to me your missing most of the point of trading for Kevin Durant.

Since you have admitted you haven't been a fan of the Suns for a pretty long time, the assumption is that you have missed a majority of the games over the past 4 years.

There are a lot of people that would be ok with keeping Ayton, in fact I'd venture most of us would. But his great play on defense does not make up for his shortcomings on offense, especially in context of him demanding a max contract. Mikal is in the same boat, but his contract makes him a much more desirable piece. Both guys have the ability to improve on offense, but Mikal isn't as crucial as Ayton is. He should have improved more on offense, and that's the main reason a lot of us are ok with trading him IF WE GET BACK VALUE. Kevin Durant is VALUE.

 

[Mainstreet]

The Okogie and Lee signings are for the minimum. It's unclear about Biyombo.

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[somethingshesaid]

Seems to me your missing most of the point of trading for Kevin Durant.

Since you have admitted you haven't been a fan of the Suns for a pretty long time, the assumption is that you have missed a majority of the games over the past 4 years.

There are a lot of people that would be ok with keeping Ayton, in fact I'd venture most of us would. But his great play on defense does not make up for his shortcomings on offense, especially in context of him demanding a max contract. Mikal is in the same boat, but his contract makes him a much more desirable piece. Both guys have the ability to improve on offense, but Mikal isn't as crucial as Ayton is. He should have improved more on offense, and that's the main reason a lot of us are ok with trading him IF WE GET BACK VALUE. Kevin Durant is VALUE.

Enhancing an offense is easier than rebuilding a defense after you lose your best defender. The Suns have souped up their offense alone many, many times, and where did it get them.

And yes, everyone else knows better than I do that the Suns franchise actually paid an enormous cost for the mere chance to draft DeAndre Ayton and have a very good center. It sold its dignity for years--of course I mean the deliberate losing. I wouldn't have done it in the first place; but now that it's done and can't be taken back, I would rather continue to give it a chance. The Suns tanked for a number one, and then found out that he's the good defensive center they hadn't had for fifty years; but that he's not so great offensively yet, and also immature. You made your bed, Suns; sleep in it.

 

[Chaplin]

Enhancing an offense is easier than rebuilding a defense after you lose your best defender. The Suns have souped up their offense alone many, many times, and where did it get them.

And yes, everyone else knows better than I do that the Suns franchise actually paid an enormous cost for the mere chance to draft DeAndre Ayton and have a very good center. It sold its dignity for years--of course I mean the deliberate losing. I wouldn't have done it in the first place; but now that it's done and can't be taken back, I would rather continue to give it a chance. The Suns tanked for a number one, and then found out that he's the good defensive center they hadn't had for fifty years; but that he's not so great offensively yet, and also immature. You made your bed, Suns; sleep in it.

The suns didn’t have to tank. They were that bad. You give Sarver and McD too much credit if you say they deliberately tanked. Because they didn’t.

 

[Yuma]

Seems to me your missing most of the point of trading for Kevin Durant.

Since you have admitted you haven't been a fan of the Suns for a pretty long time, the assumption is that you have missed a majority of the games over the past 4 years.

There are a lot of people that would be ok with keeping Ayton, in fact I'd venture most of us would. But his great play on defense does not make up for his shortcomings on offense, especially in context of him demanding a max contract. Mikal is in the same boat, but his contract makes him a much more desirable piece. Both guys have the ability to improve on offense, but Mikal isn't as crucial as Ayton is. He should have improved more on offense, and that's the main reason a lot of us are ok with trading him IF WE GET BACK VALUE. Kevin Durant is VALUE.

KD is one of my all time favorite players to watch. He is sneaky good on defense. He doesn't bring it all out on every play, but if an opposing player is driving to the hoop in the fourth quarter with the game on the line, 9 times out of ten Durant is going to block that shot. KD is a veteran and usually brings the D in the fourth when it matters. He's not a liabilitty on D, he just raises it a notch or two in clutch time.

I know we have been using Ayton, in my opinion, wrong. He has great range on defense and the Suns have been stretching him out to guard the three point line on switch outs, and our rebounding and shot blocking suffer as a result. Again, in my opinion. Byombo doesn't have that range. I don't know this traded from SA Aussie's play. I am hoping our centers now spend more time by the lane and our rebounding as a team gets better.

This trade is like getting a Bird, Magic Johnson, etc. at their peak. You don't get shots like this as a franchise very often. As the most recent Suns in the draft, you also very rarely draft a guy like this.

Also, we all knew CP3 was going to help our centers. Imagine the things that Book can learn form KD by playing in game situations. KD is a level above Book right now. Most of that is mental, regimen, and philosophy. I think this will help Book raise his level of play to that next tier of NBA player.

 

[AzStevenCal]

The suns didn’t have to tank. They were that bad. You give Sarver and McD too much credit if you say they deliberately tanked. Because they didn’t.

Most of the losing was the result of poor scouting, horrible draft decisons, almost non-existent player development and weak management overall. But we also tanked. Not every year that we were bad, but at least twice.

 

[Yuma]

Most of the losing was the result of poor scouting, horrible draft decisons, almost non-existent player development and weak management overall. But we also tanked. Not every year that we were bad, but at least twice.

I thought we had players who were "hurt" at the end of that season, too.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I thought we had players who were "hurt" at the end of that season, too.

We had players that were hurt but we also had players that could have played and didn't due to management decisions. We didn't tank to the extent that Philadelphia did but we put Chandler, Booker and others on the bench when it became clear we couldn't make the playoffs.

 

[Yuma]

We had players that were hurt but we also had players that could have played and didn't due to management decisions. We didn't tank to the extent that Philadelphia did but we put Chandler, Booker and others on the bench when it became clear we couldn't make the playoffs.

The not playing by management decisions, I thought we actually had to declare they were "hurt." We all knew it was the tank...

 

[AzStevenCal]

The not playing by management decisions, I thought we actually had to declare they were "hurt." We all knew it was the tank...

Yeah, I get what you're saying now. Yes, we had players that were magically hurt. But most of the time, we just stunk because of mistakes the organization made.

 

[Folster]

The Okogie and Lee signings are for the minimum. It's unclear about Biyombo.

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I'd hope he got a little more for how he came in and played and for his loyalty, but that would cut into our MLE if so.

 

[Yuma]

I'd hope he got a little more for how he came in and played and for his loyalty.

He wants to play for a contender. That's why he chose us last season. I think he's taking a swing at KD landing here. Should KD make it here, we would be at the top with GS on the preseason power rankings, and betting odds.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'd hope he got a little more for how he came in and played and for his loyalty, but that would cut into our MLE if so.

I'm not sure how that would work but Biz deserves more as he donated last season's salary to build a hospital.

 

[Yuma]

So really, we only need to look at the top 7-8 roster spots on our roster for if we are contenders, because that's ALL the guys who will play for us in the playoffs under Monty anyway.....

 

[Yuma]

I'm not sure what that would work but Biz deserves more as he donated last season's salary to build a hospital.

I thought the Suns did donate?

 

[Mainstreet]

I thought the Suns did donate?

The Suns might have donated as well. I'd have to look it up.

 

[Mainstreet]

Go Ish Wainright!

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[Proximo]

Go Ish Wainright!

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You realize he is a free agent now right?

I would like him resigned before he goes off.

 

[Mainstreet]

You realize he is a free agent now right?

I would like him resigned before he goes off.

I thought the Suns still had his right based on a qualifying offer they have made or can still make.

 

[Hoop Head]

I'd hope he got a little more for how he came in and played and for his loyalty, but that would cut into our MLE if so.

Don't we have the Bi-Annual Exception? It's like 2/5 of the MLE and 2x the league minimum. That could be what we use for Biz, it would need to be a 2 year deal but I'd be ok with that.

Money doesn't seem to be important for Biz. He's one of those rare selfless players who is playing for the opportunity and his salary is used to benefit others. He deserves a max deal since he's so philanthropic with it but obviously he's not getting that.

 

[Folster]

Don't we have the Bi-Annual Exception? It's like 2/5 of the MLE and 2x the league minimum. That could be what we use for Biz, it would need to be a 2 year deal but I'd be ok with that.

Money doesn't seem to be important for Biz. He's one of those rare selfless players who is playing for the opportunity and his salary is used to benefit others. He deserves a max deal since he's so philanthropic with it but obviously he's not getting that.

He also recently came off of a big overpay contract too so he's probably alright. But I believe tax paying teams don't have the bi-annual or the full MLE. I may be wrong.

 

[Mainstreet]

He also recently came off of a big overpay contract too so he's probably alright. But I believe tax paying teams don't have the bi-annual or the full MLE. I may be wrong.

Tax paying teams have the MLE ($6,149,000) but not the bi-annual exception as I understand it.

 

[Hoop Head]

Tax teams have access to the Bi-Annual Exception but it hard caps them, so I don't see that happening for us.

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