Suns @ Bucks Wednesday Finals game thread 7-14-2021 - Game 4

[Mainstreet]

Yeah I believe he has a dislocated finger on one hand and torn ligaments on the other but he's keeping it quiet for obvious reasons.

Yeah, whatever it is the Suns aren't going to say anything with the series winding down.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I ended up taking my wife to see Cruella. What happened?

Well, she starts off as a low level thief and con artist but eventually embraces her dark side and becomes the infamous Disney villain we all know so well. I'm surprised you didn't pick up on that?

 

[Absolute Zero]

I wondered what was missing last night. Hmm.

I take full responsibility for the loss. But Cruella was awesome!

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Last nights game is haunting. I can’t stop watching the end unfold in my head.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Last nights game is haunting. I can’t stop watching the end unfold in my head.

I was in the building..... DON'T REMIND ME!

 

[Covert Rain]

I couldn't sleep all night last night. I could have handled a blow out. The fact that the Suns had the lead most of the game, Giannis wasn't going for 40 means this was a prime opportunity the Suns let slip away. If we lose this series this is going to be the game we look back on. It was ours. Chris Paul is obviously not right and hurting this team and Monty for some reason kept putting the ball in his hands. It's just frustrating as hell because we should have won this game.

 

[Covert Rain]

He also has scored well all playoffs off the boards. He had one offensive rebound. One. Can’t do much offensively with one offensive rebound. Let’s not make excuses for him. And he shot 3-9. That’s putrid for him.

That not an excuse that's reality. It's no secret Ayton doesn't typically score off his own shots. We have known that throughout the playoffs. Even when Ayton gets offensive boards how often is he putting back verses resetting the offense? Sure we could use some easy buckets but gang rebounding has almost been a challenge with the team as a whole. Bucks have been fantastic at it.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I couldn't sleep all night last night. I could have handled a blow out. The fact that the Suns had the lead most of the game, Giannis wasn't going for 40 means this was a prime opportunity the Suns let slip away. If we lose this series this is going to be the game we look back on. It was ours. Chris Paul is obviously not right and hurting this team and Monty for some reason kept putting the ball in his hands. It's just frustrating as hell because we should have won this game.

yup.

Been a while since a gut punch like last night’s game. So much blame to go around too.

I’m trying to think about previous series and it seems more often than not in tight series, the team that wins a game they have no business winning, usually comes out on top. We flat out blew that game... and did so when we didn’t even play well.

That said, I think we come back and win a squeaker Saturday... which feels like it’s going to be an eternity from now.

 

[azsouthendzone]

hmm, maybe you should actually watch the games? Giannis repeatedly runs into people and they calls fouls on us for touching him, Booker Paul and others get knocked to the floor with no calls, does that seem legit to you? Maybe people complain because it stinks to high hell and looks like refs have been given marching orders to extend this series? You don’t see there superstars In foul trouble back to back games?

LOL. Suns went 14-4 in the postseason headed into game 3 and through every game, and after, there has been constant complaining and conspiracy theories about the refs. Give me a break. They get their fair share of calls every game, like the fact Booker should have been fouled out multiple times last night and wasn't. Maybe, just maybe, the NBA is a physical game and the Suns are soft? Giannis is a two-time MVP for a reason. It's like Suns fans expect to sweep every series and the red carpet should be rolled out by the opponent. It's so stale. Outrebounded 17-5 on the offensive end. That means the team is SOFT. It isn't the refs.

 

[Finito]

For those complaining about Ayton he had 17 rebounds and played Giannis great so what exactly more do you want?

the expectations are so unrealistic.

this is a domino effect from Paul being god awful

Paul is the engine that drives this team. If I’m not mistaken Paul to Ayton might be the #1 or #2 combo in the NBA if Paul isn’t feeding him then that’s a problem because so much of our offense is based on the pick and roll because there are so many options( hit Ayton, hit the corner, take the mid range jumper)




first ballot hall of famers don’t get there lunch money taken by guys like Jrue Holiday in the finals

 

[Cheesebeef]

For those complaining about Ayton he had 17 rebounds and played Giannis great so what exactly more do you want?

the expectations are so unrealistic.

this is a domino effect from Paul being god awful

Paul is the engine that drives this team. If I’m not mistaken Paul to Ayton might be the #1 or #2 combo in the NBA if Paul isn’t feeding him then that’s a problem because so much of our offense is based on the pick and roll because there are so many options( hit Ayton, hit the corner, take the mid range jumper)




first ballot hall of famers don’t get there lunch money taken by guys like Jrue Holiday in the finals

i don’t think Ayton is the first, second or third reason we lost. Tonight’s loss was overwhelmingly on Paul, Bridges and Monty’s coaching. That said, it’s not unrealistic to expect Ayton to score more than 6 points on a woeful 3-9 shooting. He’s the third best player on the team and they depend on him to get easy buckets for himself. He also faded considerably on D in the fourth where he only got 2 rebounds. That was disappointing.

And He made an impact on offense throughout the playoffs when CP3 sucked or wasn’t even playing so I don’t believe Paul sucking tonight gives Ayton the total out to suck on offense as well.

again, not saying he was even close to the main reason 1, 2 or 3 that we lost, but his lack of offense was a factor in the loss, despite his great game on D, the same way that on a night that Booker went nuts on O, his stupidity getting himself in foul trouble was a contributing factor to losing as well because he took himself out of the game when we needed him to push the lead.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

For those complaining about Ayton he had 17 rebounds and played Giannis great so what exactly more do you want?

the expectations are so unrealistic.

this is a domino effect from Paul being god awful

Paul is the engine that drives this team. If I’m not mistaken Paul to Ayton might be the #1 or #2 combo in the NBA if Paul isn’t feeding him then that’s a problem because so much of our offense is based on the pick and roll because there are so many options( hit Ayton, hit the corner, take the mid range jumper)




first ballot hall of famers don’t get there lunch money taken by guys like Jrue Holiday in the finals

Your hypocrisy in this post is hilarious. You want no expectations for Ayton, 3rd year player who was #1 pick in loaded draft and has shown his true ability throughout the playoffs. But simultaneously want to hold Paul to a standard completely ignoring he might be facing the top backcourt defender in the nba while playing injured.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

i don’t think Ayton is the first, second or third reason we lost. Tonight’s loss was overwhelmingly on Paul, Bridges and Monty’s coaching. That said, it’s not unrealistic to expect Ayton to score more than 6 points on a woeful 3-9 shooting. He’s the third best player on the team and they depend on him to get easy buckets for himself. He also faded considerably on D in the fourth where he only got 2 rebounds. That was disappointing.

And He made an impact on offense throughout the playoffs when CP3 sucked or wasn’t even playing so I don’t believe Paul sucking tonight gives Ayton the total out to suck on offense as well.

Cmon man, why throw facts into the mix?

 

[Finito]

i don’t think Ayton is the first, second or third reason we lost. Tonight’s loss was overwhelmingly on Paul, Bridges and Monty’s coaching. That said, it’s not unrealistic to expect Ayton to score more than 6 points on a woeful 3-9 shooting. He’s the third best player on the team and they depend on him to get easy buckets for himself. He also faded considerably on D in the fourth where he only got 2 rebounds. That was disappointing.

And He made an impact on offense throughout the playoffs when CP3 sucked or wasn’t even playing so I don’t believe Paul sucking tonight gives Ayton the total out to suck on offense as well.

hes dead tired at the end of the game you could tell the lift wasn’t there. Asking your 7 footer to pick up Giannis at the top of the key is asking a lot especially when he really has no one give him a relief.

I thought Bridges played well early then went back to standing around just watching. I think we are watching Cam Johnson take him job just like we watched Bridges make Oubre expendable.

Paul is the guy that gets everybody easy buckets that’s what great point guards do and he’s obviously doubting himself right now. Hopefully coming home is what this team needs because we gift wrapped that game for them

 

[Finito]

Your hypocrisy in this post is hilarious. You want no expectations for Ayton, 3rd year player who was #1 pick in loaded draft and has shown his true ability throughout the playoffs. But simultaneously want to hold Paul to a standard completely ignoring he might be facing the top backcourt defender in the nba while playing injured.

my 22 year old 7 footer who we are also asking to pick up the 2x MVP on defense vs my first ballot hall of famer all time great PG going up against a good role player

riiiiiight I see no difference.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Your hypocrisy in this post is hilarious. You want no expectations for Ayton, 3rd year player who was #1 pick in loaded draft and has shown his true ability throughout the playoffs. But simultaneously want to hold Paul to a standard completely ignoring he might be facing the top backcourt defender in the nba while playing injured.

I thought Ayton looked extremely tentative on offense. He wasn't good, but his defense and rebounding were mostly good. The Suns can win with a game like that from Ayton.

But Paul was just bad. He had a few turnovers that were absolute head scratchers. I think the Suns need to find away to get off the press better; I think Holiday constantly hounding him down the court is having a real impact on him.

Look at it this way: even with Paul's shooting woes, the Suns likely win this game by 6 if Paul doesn't have those DUMB turnovers.

 

[Finito]

I thought Ayton looked extremely tentative on offense. He wasn't good, but his defense and rebounding were mostly good. The Suns can win with a game like that from Ayton.

But Paul was just bad. He had a few turnovers that were absolute head scratchers. I think the Suns need to find away to get off the press better; I think Holiday constantly hounding him down the court is having a real impact on him.

Look at it this way: even with Paul's shooting woes, the Suns likely win this game by 6 if Paul doesn't have those DUMB turnovers.

no no no Ayton should have 20 points 25 rebounds and pick up Giannis at the top of the key all while staying out of foul trouble...totally realistic

I think the second Paul gets over mid we need to run a series of screens ASAP to get a match up we like. We need to do something to make it easier on Paul he’s clearly struggling with Holiday.

 

[Finito]

Your putting words in my mouth!!!

aaaargh

 

[DJ Tabooh]

yup.

Been a while since a gut punch like last night’s game. So much blame to go around too.

I’m trying to think about previous series and it seems more often than not in tight series, the team that wins a game they have no business winning, usually comes out on top. We flat out blew that game... and did so when we didn’t even play well.

That said, I think we come back and win a squeaker Saturday... which feels like it’s going to be an eternity from now.

Today sucks lol. Waiting until Saturday feels like the game is in November I really thought we could close that deal last night. We’ve been so good in late game situations. 17 turnovers to 5 for the Bucks. 17 offensive rebounds. That’s the game in a nutshell. Do I think we’re a better team? Yes. But we need everyone to contribute and come out swinging in game 5

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I thought Ayton looked extremely tentative on offense. He wasn't good, but his defense and rebounding were mostly good. The Suns can win with a game like that from Ayton.

But Paul was just bad. He had a few turnovers that were absolute head scratchers. I think the Suns need to find away to get off the press better; I think Holiday constantly hounding him down the court is having a real impact on him.

Look at it this way: even with Paul's shooting woes, the Suns likely win this game by 6 if Paul doesn't have those DUMB turnovers.

I don’t disagree. But I think it’s naive to think that all of sudden Chris Paul can’t pass bc he’s being guarded full court. We know he has a hand injury - maybe two. We’ve seen his passes and handles be off before with an injury to his upper extremity in the first round. To just say Paul played badly and ignore the potential of the injury is just being purposefully obtuse. It doesn’t mean that Paul’s play isn’t a primary culprit, but it may be because of injury not bc he’s suddenly been a bad pg.

And you’re right, we can win when Ayton plays poorly offensively if Paul is on his game. We have also shown that we can win when Paul is off his game if Ayton plays well offensively. We just can’t have both play poorly on the offensive end and that’s what happened last night.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Your putting words in my mouth!!!

aaaargh

Well you’re doing so with someone, aren’t you? Or that’s just a stupid straw man in an attempt to strengthen your already weak argument.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

my 22 year old 7 footer who we are also asking to pick up the 2x MVP on defense vs my first ballot hall of famer all time great PG going up against a good role player

riiiiiight I see no difference.

At what age/how many season can we start to have expectations of Ayton?

 

[82CardsGrad]

At what age/how many season can we start to have expectations of Ayton?

There are no expectations of Ayton at present? What am I missing??

Dude had 17 boards last night. The Connaughton rebound was bad... but, it's not like Ayton had 5 boards all night. He isn't perfect...so hammer for not being perfect I guess.
Offensively is where he has a TON of work to do. For now, if CP3 can't run the offense in ways that put Ayton in positions to score, Ayton will almost assuredly be kept under 10 points as he has virtually zero low-post game.
Additionally, Giannis was largely held in control last night (by his standards). That is solely due to Ayton's defense on Giannis...

 

[Covert Rain]

At what age/how many season can we start to have expectations of Ayton?

I can live with Ayton not scoring if he is playing on the other end. He was. He had some huge defensive plays and I don't care what anybody says he is battling down there. Not mistake free but he is battling. He has been this entire playoffs. In fact, offensively he is playin well above his station IMO considering he doesn't create his own shot. My only real expectation for him is to help us get some easy shots. I don't expect him to put up 20+ per game. We don't nee Ayton to do that to win if the rest of the team is pulling it's weight (mainly CP3).

17 turnovers, 17 given up offensive rebounds and they killed us in fast break points. Monty going to Chris after struggling. Yes it would have been a nice security blanket had Ayton put up 20 but he is not remotely the reason we lost that game.

 

[Finito]

There are no expectations of Ayton at present? What am I missing??

Dude had 17 boards last night. The Connaughton rebound was bad... but, it's not like Ayton had 5 boards all night. He isn't perfect...so hammer for not being perfect I guess.
Offensively is where he has a TON of work to do. For now, if CP3 can't run the offense in ways that put Ayton in positions to score, Ayton will almost assuredly be kept under 10 points as he has virtually zero low-post game.
Additionally, Giannis was largely held in control last night (by his standards). That is solely due to Ayton's defense on Giannis...

guys just have an obvious grudge at this point.

Ayton and Bridges can’t really create there own shot. They get points off rolling to the basket, cutting and flashing open and when you have a great point guard who can get them the ball and put them in position to win it makes our offense flow but when that point guard is giving it up as soon as he crosses half court then that puts handcuffs on our offense. It’s a domino effect we need to find a way to get holiday off Paul.

everybody who has any sense has expectations of Ayton but some have unrealistic expectations that are comical at this point. Name me all the 7 footers that can pick up Giannis at the top of the key on defense and pretty much gold him in check, grab 17 rebounds oh and make sure to stay out of foul trouble all night. We are asking this dude to do a ton with not a lot of help. Crowder and Craig have to hit those offensive boards especially if Ayton is on Giannis. Being on Giannis is going to take him out of the play because he’s the guy going with the ball. It’s damn near impossible to defend and contest the shot AND get the offensive rebound.

that’s basketball 101