Chriss???

[AzStevenCal]

It's a popular excuse for why neither of them have succeeded but I don't buy it. I've been watching them for two seasons and I still have no clue what position either of them play. If we sabotaged them in any way it's by gifting them minutes without them earning it.

 

[JCSunsfan]

It's a popular excuse for why neither of them have succeeded but I don't buy it. I've been watching them for two seasons and I still have no clue what position either of them play. If we sabotaged them in any way it's by gifting them minutes without them earning it.

That is fair. I truly like Bender, and want to continue to like him, but I am so sick of watching him stand there in the corner with his hands out hoping for a pass like a dog hoping for crumbs to fall off the table. Just about the time I think I am completely over with Chriss, he does something amazing on the court. I hope Igor resolves this problem fairly quickly.

 

[Hoop Head]

Bender and Chriss both initially being labelled as "Power Forwards" is not why neither of them has succeeded. Both of them looked like they could play multiple positions upon entering the league, with Chriss as a possible tweener forward initially to now being more of a PF/C. Bender was initially a big who could also play on the wing but since then has been projected as a SF, PF, or C. If both of them showed enough talent, they could be played together, somewhat easily, but that hasn't been the case. Neither has seemed to earn more playing time based on what they've shown on the court, during games.

Maybe they look better in practice going against each other? That's a possibility but it's clear during games that neither has the skill to warrant more than 20 minutes of playing time and they only get that much in hopes of developing them. So maybe playing against each in practice has hurt them a little but not because they're competing for playing time so much as they're practicing against someone who isn't quite at a starting NBA level. That's the only thing that may be hurting them but I doubt they always pair off in practice so I can't see that being much of an issue.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

OK. I have a gripe against McD. When you draft two players who play the same position in the draft, you create a situation where one or the other, or both in this case, are second-guessed and pitted against one another constantly. It has not helped either Chriss or Bender to have been drafted in the draft an on the same team.

Bah if that’s the case those kids are mental midgets. It’s called competition. Hope they harden under it instead of wilt.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Bah if that’s the case those kids are mental midgets. It’s called competition. Hope they harden under it instead of wilt.

Yeah. I think you are right. They both are mental midgets, each in his own way.

 

[Mainstreet]

Bender and Chriss both initially being labelled as "Power Forwards" is not why neither of them has succeeded. Both of them looked like they could play multiple positions upon entering the league, with Chriss as a possible tweener forward initially to now being more of a PF/C. Bender was initially a big who could also play on the wing but since then has been projected as a SF, PF, or C. If both of them showed enough talent, they could be played together, somewhat easily, but that hasn't been the case. Neither has seemed to earn more playing time based on what they've shown on the court, during games.

Maybe they look better in practice going against each other? That's a possibility but it's clear during games that neither has the skill to warrant more than 20 minutes of playing time and they only get that much in hopes of developing them. So maybe playing against each in practice has hurt them a little but not because they're competing for playing time so much as they're practicing against someone who isn't quite at a starting NBA level. That's the only thing that may be hurting them but I doubt they always pair off in practice so I can't see that being much of an issue.

I do not think position has anything to do with it either. My guess is the Suns are setting the stage to let one go. They are probably looking for a trade partner like a number of other NBA teams but can't find one.

 

[Hoop Head]

I do not think position has anything to do with it either. My guess is the Suns are setting the stage to let one go. They are probably looking for a trade partner like a number of other NBA teams but can't find one.

If they can't package one of them in a larger trade then I could see one of them being sent out around the trade deadline to free up more cap room for next summer. Declining their options would only lower their value, not that it's high to begin with. It would be similar to the Sixers declining Jahlil Okafor's deal before last season, no one wanted to offer them anything worthwhile because having guys like that tied into cheap rookie contracts is the only appeal to them. With the option being declined another team wouldn't have as long to decide what to do with them. Half a season isn't a lot to determine if a player is worth paying either, not when they're that young and haven't shown much already.

 

[Mainstreet]

If they can't package one of them in a larger trade then I could see one of them being sent out around the trade deadline to free up more cap room for next summer. Declining their options would only lower their value, not that it's high to begin with. It would be similar to the Sixers declining Jahlil Okafor's deal before last season, no one wanted to offer them anything worthwhile because having guys like that tied into cheap rookie contracts is the only appeal to them. With the option being declined another team wouldn't have as long to decide what to do with them. Half a season isn't a lot to determine if a player is worth paying either, not when they're that young and haven't shown much already.

Let's stick one in a trade package sooner rather than later.

 

[BC867]

OK. I have a gripe against McD. When you draft two players who play the same position in the draft, you create a situation where one or the other, or both in this case, are second-guessed and pitted against one another constantly. It has not helped either Chriss or Bender to have been drafted in the draft an on the same team.

As I've posted, I agree with you, even though some of our co-posters don't. I'll introduce a word that has not been mentioned. Confidence! It is up to the coaching staff to instill it in each young player.

Going against each other in practice is one thing. But not knowing, from game to game, which will be the starting Power Forward or for how long (which is the way it played out, not using one as a Center and one as a Forward) does not build the same confidence as "Here is your role (whatever it is) and we're going to help you achieve it."

Another word has not been mentioned in describing the coaching staff in this situation. Indecision!

It reminds me of the season when the hapless (which they were at that time) Chicago Cubs did not name a Manager. The coaching staff members alternated in the position. It was a failure! This is not a direct comparison, but the philosophy is the same. Make a damn decision (who is the starter and who is the backup), give it full support and monitor how it's working. Confidence!

When ballplayers play out of fear of making a mistake, it does not have good results. This experiment is just another example of the gimmicks the Suns have come up with during this decade. Hopefully, that will be behind them with one claim to fame on the horizon -- making the playoffs.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Going against each other in practice is one thing. But not knowing, from game to game, which will be the starting Power Forward or for how long (which is the way it played out, not using one as a Center and one as a Forward) does not build the same confidence as "Here is your role (whatever it is) and we're going to help you achieve it."

Another word has not been mentioned in describing the coaching staff in this situation. Indecision!

I'm not sure where you're coming from here? The coach didn't play games with the minutes nor did he play "who's the starter". Chriss was the starting power forward, period, until he was benched for poor conditioning during his second season. Bender went out with an injury his first season otherwise he'd have played more but even still, when both were healthy, Marquese had the starter position to himself. In their second year, Chriss was out of shape and eventually benched allowing Bender to start 37 games (his only career starts). Chriss started 75 games the season before and 49 games during his fat season.

 

[BC867]

I'm not sure where you're coming from here? The coach didn't play games with the minutes nor did he play "who's the starter". Chriss was the starting power forward, period, until he was benched for poor conditioning during his second season. Bender went out with an injury his first season otherwise he'd have played more but even still, when both were healthy, Marquese had the starter position to himself. In their second year, Chriss was out of shape and eventually benched allowing Bender to start 37 games (his only career starts). Chriss started 75 games the season before and 49 games during his fat season.

You remember it better than I, then. I thought I remembered periods where, from week to week, it changed.

One question, though. Did it make sense to have both the starting and backup players at one position young inexperienced players? If so, what did it accomplish? Over the decades, I don't recall any team not backing up a vet with a young player or vice versa vs. two competing draftees.

 

[SirStefan32]

Some people are not happy unless they are complaining and criticizing. This is simple- McD was high on Bender and Chriss. He found a way to get both. He took a gamble trading for Chriss. It appears that was a mistake, though it's too early to be 100% certain. The point is that he took a gamble drafting two players he liked.

 

[AzStevenCal]

You remember it better than I, then. I thought I remembered periods where, from week to week, it changed.

One question, though. Did it make sense to have both the starting and backup players at one position young inexperienced players? If so, what did it accomplish? Over the decades, I don't recall any team not backing up a vet with a young player or vice versa vs. two competing draftees.

I really can't answer that. I've always thought that the young players should develop BEFORE they get to play major minutes but the thinking on this seems to have changed. Now, it seems to be accepted that you have to play these guys so that they can develop. I think the team would have been better served to have a veteran in front of both of them but we went with projects for a reason. Once the TV deal removed Sarver's urgency, we opted for a more methodical rebuild and were no longer in search of wins.

 

[Matt L]

Some people are not happy unless they are complaining and criticizing. This is simple- McD was high on Bender and Chriss. He found a way to get both. He took a gamble trading for Chriss. It appears that was a mistake, though it's too early to be 100% certain. The point is that he took a gamble drafting two players he liked.

This should be a make or break season for both of them...and they both look pretty bad.

 

[AzStevenCal]

This should be a make or break season for both of them...and they both look pretty bad.

Maybe but Bender is younger than Okobo and Chriss is younger than Mikal Bridges. Do we apply the "make or break" to them too? Sure, the rookies are new to the NBA but it's a safe bet that Bridges (and probably Okobo) has had much better coaching. We're going to have to make a financial decision regarding them sooner than we'd like but it makes little sense to draft the two biggest "projects" and then give up on them before they turn 22.

 

[Chaplin]

Let's not forget we on this board were really excited when we traded for Chriss. We thought it was a great draft at the time.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Let's not forget we on this board were really excited when we traded for Chriss. We thought it was a great draft at the time.

I wanted to believe they knew more about Chriss than I did but I was never in love with that draft. I had no opinion about Bender but I had singled Chriss out a few times as the player I'd not want us to draft. But I do remember a lot of posters being happy with Ryan for being aggressive and landing a second top 10 pick.

 

[Chaplin]

I wanted to believe they knew more about Chriss than I did but I was never in love with that draft. I had no opinion about Bender but I had singled Chriss out a few times as the player I'd not want us to draft. But I do remember a lot of posters being happy with Ryan for being aggressive and landing a second top 10 pick.

Of course you did...

 

[AzStevenCal]

Of course you did...

It wouldn't be that hard to find. IIRC I got into several arguments with slin over Chriss (prior to the draft). And I know it was on this forum because I drew attention to the fact that Marquese would stand around and glare when things went wrong rather than actually playing and Russ offered some background information on him in response.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Let's not forget we on this board were really excited when we traded for Chriss. We thought it was a great draft at the time.

Guilty as charged.

 

[SirStefan32]

I can't remember the draft well. I remember being high on Sabonis, and someone else being REALLY high on Sabonis. I honestly can't remember how I felt about Bender and Chriss, but I DO remember that I was excited that McD moved up, even though I really liked Bogdanovic.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I can't remember the draft well. I remember being high on Sabonis, and someone else being REALLY high on Sabonis. I honestly can't remember how I felt about Bender and Chriss, but I DO remember that I was excited that McD moved up, even though I really liked Bogdanovic.

I was really high on Sabonis. I was not a big Chriss fan but thought it was a great draft after the fact since we had gotten both Chriss and Bender.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I can't remember the draft well. I remember being high on Sabonis, and someone else being REALLY high on Sabonis. I honestly can't remember how I felt about Bender and Chriss, but I DO remember that I was excited that McD moved up, even though I really liked Bogdanovic.

I liked Sabonis too but I'd say JC was probably the biggest proponent for the guy.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I liked Sabonis too but I'd say JC was probably the biggest proponent for the guy.

11.6 ppg, 7.7 rpg, 24 mpg, 51% shooting, 35% from 3, and a pretty solid defender. Motor, smarts, skills, size. Quality role player last year.

 

[Sun Devil Mania]

Here's some video from a Pro-Am game that he played in Seattle. He looks pudgy in the middle. Hope he comes to camp in bettewr shape if he's still on the roster.

https://www.brightsideofthesun.com/...hops-and-pops-at-the-crawsover-seattle-pro-am