The sign of real problems

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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It dawned on me as I read the merry-go-round of posters posting the same thing over and over again in thread after thread how much a truly organization-wide issue exists with this team. It’s called Problems Everywhere.

We have vocal GROUPS of posters blaming our ills on:

Keim
Kliff
Vance
Bill Davis
Kyler
Our receivers
Our oline (and can’t even agree on who are the problems there)
Our d line
Our linebackers (and our coaches’ use or lack thereof of them)
Our cornerbacks
Injuries

And there are literally reasonable-to-very-good arguments being made about each and every one of these elements. And none of them are being made by just one poster diatribes. In other words, the Cardinals have effectively baffled an entire board of pretty knowledgeable, observant, interested fans if we can’t come close to at least a couple of consensus regarding the central issues.

Know what that tells me? Institutionwide issues. It’s likely a confluence of ALL of them to a degree that compound one and other. So the scary thing to me is that this likely isn’t just a matter of fixing one or two issues. Yes, doing so will improve the situation, but we’ll still be mired down by the gravity of those issues left unsolved. And yes, I know that the buck stops at Michael. But nothing is going to change there.

It’s a little maddening coming to this realization.
 

slanidrac16

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We are in a state of limbo. We are not Bad enough to blow it all up” but not good enough to go for the gold.
In reality we really won’t be competing for the Lombardi trophy next year. There are to many holes to fix.

No cap space. So we will be forced once again to signing one year prove it deals to injured or older players.
Even if we have an outstanding draft it will not come to fruition in 2022.

Keim is the problem and Bidwill is the enabler. That ain’t gonna change. We will be fed the same old lines as the new year begins.

Just imagine next season if instead of starting 7-0 we stumble out of the gate 2-5.

Next season is going to be ugly.
 

Crimson Warrior

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It dawned on me as I read the merry-go-round of posters posting the same thing over and over again in thread after thread how much a truly organization-wide issue exists with this team. It’s called Problems Everywhere.

We have vocal GROUPS of posters blaming our ills on:

Keim
Kliff
Vance
Bill Davis
Kyler
Our receivers
Our oline (and can’t even agree on who are the problems there)
Our d line
Our linebackers (and our coaches’ use or lack thereof of them)
Our cornerbacks
Injuries

And there are literally reasonable-to-very-good arguments being made about each and every one of these elements. And none of them are being made by just one poster diatribes. In other words, the Cardinals have effectively baffled an entire board of pretty knowledgeable, observant, interested fans if we can’t come close to at least a couple of consensus regarding the central issues.

Know what that tells me? Institutionwide issues. It’s likely a confluence of ALL of them to a degree that compound one and other. So the scary thing to me is that this likely isn’t just a matter of fixing one or two issues. Yes, doing so will improve the situation, but we’ll still be mired down by the gravity of those issues left unsolved. And yes, I know that the buck stops at Michael. But nothing is going to change there.

It’s a little maddening coming to this realization.

I think you're on to something that the 1-5 crash-and-burn was more than the failing of just one specific part of the organization (i.e. one player, one coach, or one group of players like the WRs, etc.).

I guess usually in a situation like this, where's there's a system-wide failure, the first thing that happens is one person gets singled out and sacrificed as the proverbial scapegoat.
 

Mainstreet

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A team can't change owners but they can change GMs.

I think that's where everything begins: from the draft, to the coaches and the player personnel.

Changes elsewhere are symptoms of the problem.
 

Chris_Sanders

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This is the issue.

Michael's strength is that he doesn't want to be his father but it's also his weakness. He frames everything in a historical sense rather than a current sense. Not having a losing reputation like his father is tantamount

Which means he values marginal success over the prior mean. So much so that he will dismiss or excuse deficiencies in his right hand man that he won't in his players.

Being good enough is an organizational issue. We have gotten his vision
 

Cheesebeef

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We’re going into the off-season with literally every starting skill position on offense a FA except for Nuk.

And that predicament is staring us in the face... while having next to no cap space.

That is ludicrous. Like next level atrocious team building, especially around a young QB.
 
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Solar7

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We’re going into the off-season with literally every starting skill position on offense a FA except for Nuk.

And that’s staring us in the face... while having next to no cap space.

That is ludicrous. Like next level atrocious team building, especially around a young QB.
Pure insanity. I mean, I saw it coming, but pure insanity.

It's going to make it impossible to "build" on this season. It's a reboot every year.
 

Brian in Mesa

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It dawned on me as I read the merry-go-round of posters posting the same thing over and over again in thread after thread how much a truly organization-wide issue exists with this team. It’s called Problems Everywhere.

We have vocal GROUPS of posters blaming our ills on:

Keim
Kliff
Vance
Bill Davis
Kyler
Our receivers
Our oline (and can’t even agree on who are the problems there)
Our d line
Our linebackers (and our coaches’ use or lack thereof of them)
Our cornerbacks
Injuries

And there are literally reasonable-to-very-good arguments being made about each and every one of these elements. And none of them are being made by just one poster diatribes. In other words, the Cardinals have effectively baffled an entire board of pretty knowledgeable, observant, interested fans if we can’t come close to at least a couple of consensus regarding the central issues.

Know what that tells me? Institutionwide issues. It’s likely a confluence of ALL of them to a degree that compound one and other. So the scary thing to me is that this likely isn’t just a matter of fixing one or two issues. Yes, doing so will improve the situation, but we’ll still be mired down by the gravity of those issues left unsolved. And yes, I know that the buck stops at Michael. But nothing is going to change there.

It’s a little maddening coming to this realization.
Don't forget how many times Zane Gonzalez was the real reason we lost games. :rolleyes:
 
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Ouchie-Z-Clown

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So it's Bidwill. Is that what your are saying?
Well I think that’s what most of us are saying. No. What I’m really saying is that if we are this split across ASFN it’s likely we are all a little bit right and the issues are likely just incredibly pervasive across all areas of the team (gm, coaches, players of almost all positions), but the issues may not be as insidious in any one of those areas.

It’s like difference between being stabbed with a big knife or with 30 small knives. Maybe same threshold of overall pain, but with the big knife you remove it and the healing starts more quickly. With the 30 small knives remove one and you’ve still got 29 knives in you.
 
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Ouchie-Z-Clown

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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I think you're on to something that the 1-5 crash-and-burn was more than the failing of just one specific part of the organization (i.e. one player, one coach, or one group of players like the WRs, etc.).

I guess usually in a situation like this, where's there's a system-wide failure, the first thing that happens is one person gets singled out and sacrificed as the proverbial scapegoat.
True. But seems not even that’s gonna happen this offseason. Which is amazing.
 

Cardsfaninlouky

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Don't forget how many times Zane Gonzalez was the real reason we lost games. :rolleyes:
Having him make a few more kicks in 2020 & we would've been in the playoffs. The kicking situation was only one of the problems though. I agree with everyone else on here, the problem is top to bottom with our roster. Keim did a good job building this year's roster, I'll give him props for that but his drafting track record has put the roster in bad shape. He keeps signing old players on prove it deals cause his drafts for years have pretty much sucked. Plus he's buddies with an owner that keeps buying his b.s. ideas on how to build this team year after year with no consequences. Until that changes everything will stay the same. At this point it's either blow the whole thing up & start over fresh with a new GM or keep everything the same. doubt Bidwill is willing to start over. I don't think we need to totally reconstruct the roster but there's too many holes from bad drafts. Both the OL & DL need better players, Pugh isn't physical enough imo, Lawrence & Fotu are pretty much depth & not really starters. We need a #1 CB & a #2 WR & our DC can't get 2 first round LB's to learn his defense for whatever reason? Jones is a FA & seems to be slowing down & then there's salary cap issues. All this ain't getting fixed in the off season. What will happen imo is Keim will just figure out a way to put a band aide on the roster with older players, miss in the draft once again & Bidwill will buy his vision for 2022. But hey, I'll be rooting right along with everyone else when the season starts. I've said this time & time again, I really think Louis Riddick from ESPN would make a great GM for us. Bidwill & Keim being buddies is gonna keep him as our GM, KK will get the Axe before anyone else imo.
 

Stout

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It dawned on me as I read the merry-go-round of posters posting the same thing over and over again in thread after thread how much a truly organization-wide issue exists with this team. It’s called Problems Everywhere.

We have vocal GROUPS of posters blaming our ills on:

Keim
Kliff
Vance
Bill Davis
Kyler
Our receivers
Our oline (and can’t even agree on who are the problems there)
Our d line
Our linebackers (and our coaches’ use or lack thereof of them)
Our cornerbacks
Injuries

And there are literally reasonable-to-very-good arguments being made about each and every one of these elements. And none of them are being made by just one poster diatribes. In other words, the Cardinals have effectively baffled an entire board of pretty knowledgeable, observant, interested fans if we can’t come close to at least a couple of consensus regarding the central issues.

Know what that tells me? Institutionwide issues. It’s likely a confluence of ALL of them to a degree that compound one and other. So the scary thing to me is that this likely isn’t just a matter of fixing one or two issues. Yes, doing so will improve the situation, but we’ll still be mired down by the gravity of those issues left unsolved. And yes, I know that the buck stops at Michael. But nothing is going to change there.

It’s a little maddening coming to this realization.
Well put.
 

cardpa

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It all starts with Bidwill and Keim. They are at the top of the organization, #1 and #2. All their decisions affect everything below from hiring the HC to who they sign as FA and who they draft. I still scratch my head at the Watt signing. Yeah I know a lot of posters here liked it and still do, but my take is you spent a sizeable amount of money on a player who had the odds stacked against him in completing a full season without injury. Yes, I understand part of the reason he was brought in was to provide leadership. The need to do this was because they hire a HC who doesn't seem to provide that essential element. So now they needed to make a hire to cover the shortcomings of their HC hire. Now you used a roster spot on a player who could only give you half a season when maybe the better decision would have been to find another player who could actually give you 15-17 games and also provide some level of leadership.

This is just one example of how decisions at the top affects everything underneath. We all know you can't change one head of the two headed monster at the top but one could be replaced with a better head that can guide the other head to make better decisions. I think changing the GM head with a experienced team builder can eventually resolve many of the problems we see now. It won't be done in a year or two but it can be accomplished given time. The only clinker in this scenario is the remaining head is hiring the new GM.
 

dreamcastrocks

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We’re going into the off-season with literally every starting skill position on offense a FA except for Nuk.

And that predicament is staring us in the face... while having next to no cap space.

That is ludicrous. Like next level atrocious team building, especially around a young QB.
Yep, that alone is enough to get Keim fired. The fact that he is worse at drafting than mock drafts is even worse though. If any of us used mock drafts to draft the top 3 rounds, we would have done a better job than Keim.
 

football karma

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our ills:

it comes down to Keim way more than Kliff

I think Keim builds rosters that lack depth -- which is an attribute fans like us have a hard time evaluating. That is a function (partly) of sub par drafting.

Example: when Hop and Rondale Moore went out --- its Antoine Wesley and Greg Dortch that came in, not the 2nd round pick from three years ago.

Example 2: The offensive line is often a place where mid to late round picks can come in and get the job done. The Cards had one of their five as a drafted player -- with the rest as: RG (high priced FA), C (traded for, and higher priced), LG (FA) and RT (FA).
 

MrYeahBut

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The fact that 5 premium picks have been wasted on ILBs under Keim is the highest degree of insanity. There’s teams that have used 2 at the most during this timespan.

Bidwill is a joke

Matt Millen drafted WR 3 years in a row for the Lions, Keim is fast approaching this level of madness.
 

cardpa

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our ills:

it comes down to Keim way more than Kliff

I think Keim builds rosters that lack depth -- which is an attribute fans like us have a hard time evaluating. That is a function (partly) of sub par drafting.

Example: when Hop and Rondale Moore went out --- its Antoine Wesley and Greg Dortch that came in, not the 2nd round pick from three years ago.

Example 2: The offensive line is often a place where mid to late round picks can come in and get the job done. The Cards had one of their five as a drafted player -- with the rest as: RG (high priced FA), C (traded for, and higher priced), LG (FA) and RT (FA).
This is so sad, Isabella's stats for 2021, one catch for 13 yds. Inactive for 7 games and did not play in two others. That catch cost $1.26MM It's no mystery why the team is where it's at.
 

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