The Price for Orton

[Stout]

KFFL says the likely cost would be a 2nd rounder. I think we'd have to consider it.


Broncos | Kyle Orton likely to be traded
Tue, 04 Jan 2011 07:04:49 -0800

Denver Broncos QB Kyle Orton is likely to be traded in the offseason, according to Mike Klis, of The Denver Post. QB Tim Tebow will be the team's starting quarterback in 2011 and Orton is considered too good to be a backup. The Broncos will ask for a second-round pick in return for Orton.



Read more: http://www.kffl.com/hotw/nfl#ixzz1A58jG900

 

[Clif]

a couple of tackling dummies?

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I'd give them a 3rd... or take exchange 2nd and 4ths for Orton and their 3rd.

 

[Snakester]

That is fair value for him. I can see us making that trade if Whiz doesn't want to draft QB.

 

[Pariah]

I'd do it.

Orton is somewhere between a bandaid and a QBoF, with a slight lean to QBoF (note:I'm not saying he IS, just on the spectrum he's closer to it than a bandaid like Bulger would be). He could be decent for a long time for us, but I don't think he'll ever be great. As we know all too well, having a decent QB cannot be overlooked.

 

[Clif]

gosh Orton does nothing for me. No he doesn't suck Shane... I just don't think he is a difference maker.

 

[Pariah]

I just don't think he is a difference maker.

He's not a difference maker in the way Warner was, but he would have been a difference maker for the Cards this year. He would have made a few plays in the passing game, avoided a few of the mistakes that were made and opened up the playbook to include the run game, keeping the offense on the field (and the defense off of it) ... and as a result, probably would have won the division for us.

JMHO

 

[Clif]

Pariah, Bulger's not even a bandaid. He would be signing his own death wish if he came here.

 

[Pariah]

Pariah, Bulger's not even a bandaid. He would be signing his own death wish if he came here.

Fair enough. I'm not calling for him, just using him as an example. Plug in McNabb if you'd like...or Collins. Or Kitna. Or anyone else who might be seen as a bridge to the QBoF.

Point is, I think Orton would be worth a second because he could play out a reasonable contract and effectively run the offense.

 

[Clif]

He's not a difference maker in the way Warner was, but he would have been a difference maker for the Cards this year. He would have made a few plays in the passing game, avoided a few of the mistakes that were made and opened up the playbook to include the run game, keeping the offense on the field (and the defense off of it) ... and as a result, probably would have won the division for us.

JMHO

Sure and we would be perpetually between 7-9 and 9-7. We win the division and get blown out in the playoffs. No thanks. Fools gold. I want a long term solution that could at least give us hope of a home run.

 

[Mulli]

Sure and we would be perpetually between 7-9 and 9-7. We win the division and get blown out in the playoffs. No thanks. Fools gold. I want a long term solution that could at least give us hope of a home run.

Pariah just posted he wanted Orton as a bridge to the QBOF. I am fine with that. But not for anything higher than a 4th.

 

[Clif]

Fair enough. I'm not calling for him, just using him as an example. Plug in McNabb if you'd like...or Collins. Or Kitna. Or anyone else who might be seen as a bridge to the QBoF.

Point is, I think Orton would be worth a second because he could play out a reasonable contract and effectively run the offense.

I would go for those guys IF and ONLY IF they drafted a top notch QB. Not trade for one of those guys with the notion that the QB position is fixed, but I'm afraid that is exactly what they would do.

 

[Clif]

Pariah just posted he wanted Orton as a bridge to the QBOF. I am fine with that. But not for anything higher than a 4th.

You're right he did. I totally glossed over it. Hell I couldn't get past the name Orton. Yuck!

 

[Pariah]

We win the division and get blown out in the playoffs. No thanks. Fools gold.

At this point--with this team and the current makeup of the division--I'd rather have something that I know will work reasonably well for the next couple of years than roll the dice on a guy like Gabbert.

If we go with a high-priced rookie, the chances of him coming on like Matt Ryan in the first year or two are slim, and if he works out at all we're looking at the tail end of Fitz's career.

I say get a guy in here that can get us the division now, and worry about that long term guy as an undercurrent to the team's story.

JMHO

 

[ajcardfan]

Sure and we would be perpetually between 7-9 and 9-7. We win the division and get blown out in the playoffs. No thanks. Fools gold. I want a long term solution that could at least give us hope of a home run.

I think the idea of getting a veteran like Orton this year is that Skelton can be the long term solution if he is given another year or two of seasoning. These guys traded a player and two picks for Skelton. He's going to get more of a chance than just the four games he got this season.

 

[Mulli]

You're right he did. I totally glossed over it. Hell I couldn't get past the name Orton. Yuck!

All good.

 

[Pariah]

Pariah just posted he wanted Orton as a bridge to the QBOF. I am fine with that. But not for anything higher than a 4th.

Well, yes and no. I DO want the cards to have an eye on a bigger prize at the position, but I think Orton is a guy that could be there for the team as they ride the rapids of looking for the next big thing. You get a guy like Bulger (or the aforementioned QBs) an your window is REALLY small.

Plus, this team has so many needs--but because of the division is SO close to making the playoffs--I think it's important to hedge the bets at the QB position.

Orton is better than people give him credit for, and by all accounts he's good in the locker room, too.

 

[Clif]

I think the idea of getting a veteran like Orton this year is that Skelton can be the long term solution if he is given another year or two of seasoning. These guys traded a player and two picks for Skelton. He's going to get more of a chance than just the four games he got this season.

damn you! Don't scare me like that. again nothing against skelton... i just don't want to pass on top talent just to give him a shot. if we were drafting in the 20's then ok but not top 5.

 

[Pariah]

if we were drafting in the 20's then ok but not top 5.

See, I'm on the otherside of this coin. I think if we were to take a QB (other than Luck) in the top-5, we'd be passing on top-talent. The CBs and pass-rushers at the top of the draft are better values there than the QBs remaining after Luck, I think. If we were drafting in the 20's and we were looking at a QB like Gabbert there, then we'd get the value out of the pick.

But, while Newton is certainly exciting, he's not a sure thing. And the other QBs aren't top-10 guys, IMO.

It's an interesting offseason for personnel decisions, that's for sure.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Orton is destined to become a mediocre starter in this league--too good to be a backup, not good enough to lead a team anywhere special. So what's the point?

He looked horrible against us this year. If he can't beat out Tebow for the job permanently, why would we want him.

Pick up a cheaper vet backup. Draft the best qb we can get in the first round, and let the two young guys battle it out in training camp for the starting job.

Is this really that hard to figure out?

One of the things we have learned is that great teams have special qb's. We lucked out in getting Warner. We need to go out and get the best qb possible and build from there.

 

[john h]

gosh Orton does nothing for me. No he doesn't suck Shane... I just don't think he is a difference maker.

If we do not take a shot on a QB in the first round we are just not forward looking. We will never find the long term answer at QB by looking at other teams second stringers. Sure a QB with our #5 is a gamble but not taking a QB is a bigger gamble as is any player we take with our #1. We would need more than just a boat load of luck to compete next year. McNabb if the price is right is our best chance and has the added benefit of possible keeping Fitz here. I do not know that Fitz will look at Orton and say "now we can compete for a ring". I just do not want to be embarrassed next season and hopefully can win as many as we lose.

 

[Pariah]

He looked horrible against us this year. If he can't beat out Tebow for the job permanently, why would we want him.

No offense, but I think this is a really limiting way to evaluate a player. It's like saying "well, the Cardinals beat the Saints this year, so clearly the Cardinals are the better team." There's a lot more to it then that.

Yes, Orton had a bad game against the Cards this year. He's also had a bunch of really good ones against much better teams.

No, he's not going to beat Tebow out as the starter. Denver has a lot invested in Tebow and there's a regime change underway that believes in him ... not to mention the financial implications of his popularity (he sold the most jerseys, even while languishing on the bench).

 

[Shane]

Orton is destined to become a mediocre starter in this league--too good to be a backup, not good enough to lead a team anywhere special. So what's the point?

He looked horrible against us this year. If he can't beat out Tebow for the job permanently, why would we want him.

Pick up a cheaper vet backup. Draft the best qb we can get in the first round, and let the two young guys battle it out in training camp for the starting job.

Is this really that hard to figure out?

One of the things we have learned is that great teams have special qb's. We lucked out in getting Warner. We need to go out and get the best qb possible and build from there.

Denver gave up a ton to get Tebow and has a fanbase pining for him to start. That is no knock on Orton at all.

Orton is a GOOD QB. Probably the best veteran available. Yet you say you would rather get a worse veteran and a rookie?

 

[slanidrac16]

Sad part is ANYBODY looks decent compared to what we had this year.

I don't like the thought of putting next season on Skelton's shoulders. I don't like the thought of taking a QB with our first pick. I certainly don't like the thought of Bulger.

Orton just might be the best stop gap QB while Skwlton develops.

Orton is 29-19 WITH THE BRONCO'S!
This year in 13 games he threw for over 3600 yards with a 7.3 yards avg even though he was sacked 34 times. He threw 20 td's to 9 picks.
Over the last 2 years he has thrown for over 7000 yards with 41 td's and 21 picks and has a QB rating of around 87.0.

Those kind of numbers would have probably been good enough to win this division. He's a smart efficient QB . He's not small (6'4" and 225). He is not Warner. He is not flashy. He is more of a lunch pail kind of guy.

We could do worse.

 

[JCSunsfan]

No offense, but I think this is a really limiting way to evaluate a player. It's like saying "well, the Cardinals beat the Saints this year, so clearly the Cardinals are the better team." There's a lot more to it then that.

Yes, Orton had a bad game against the Cards this year. He's also had a bunch of really good ones against much better teams.

No, he's not going to beat Tebow out as the starter. Denver has a lot invested in Tebow and there's a regime change underway that believes in him ... not to mention the financial implications of his popularity (he sold the most jerseys, even while languishing on the bench).

No offense taken, it was just one observation. To me the bigger issue is why a team that desperately needs production from the qb would be willing to give him up over a highly questionable and untested rookie.

Again. This draft has a number of potentially great qb's. It would be absolutely disastrous not to grab one of them when we get the chance. Luck, Newton, Gabbert are all better long term prospects than Orton IMO.