The 2019-2020 Around the NBA thread

[Chaplin]

When I say best player, I include results which is the end goal.
There are many great players, but empty stats mean little at the end of the day.

Just because someone doesn’t have a title doesn’t mean they aren’t the best player.

 

[Finito]

Uh Lebron played 67/71 games (night after night) vs Leonard 57/71 games (load management).
Lebron is on a different level as far as being a leader and knows how to get the most out of teammates. Leonard is a great player but pales in comparison as a leader. Leaders lead by example by playing, not load managing.
As they always say, you’re best ability is your availability. Lebron is still the best player in the league hands down.

And last year in a full 82 game season he played 55.

so I guess Tim Duncan wasn’t a leader either huh

 

[swagron]

Just because someone doesn’t have a title doesn’t mean they aren’t the best player.

Who is the currently the best player in the league?

 

[swagron]

And last year in a full 82 game season he played 55.

so I guess Tim Duncan wasn’t a leader either huh

What were Duncan’s stats last year lol.
Current events- not a historical discussion.

Lebron was injured last year- not load managed. Big difference. Even Leonard’s teammates were pissed about all the load management- see how that turned out.

 

[hcsilla]

Morey had a analytics based philosophy and a master at maximizing assets... until the last couple seasons. In their desperation to get over the hump they made some moves that went against the methodology that got them to the brink. Stuff like signing Carmelo and trading for Westbrook, players that did not fit the analytics that the team had been built around. They have used up virtually all their trade capital in order to build a roster that seems significantly worse than it was a couple seasons ago.

They really over extended themselves. Virtually all their draft picks for the next SIX years are owed to other teams, they have no cap space for years, James Harden is probably their only asset that would give them a good haul in a trade.

Morey got out while before the ship sank. If the new GM isn't a miracle worker that franchise is about to go down the drain.

Totally agreed.

 

[GatorAZ]

The Rockets were probably a CP3 hammy tear away from knocking off the most stacked team in history. A lot of legacies were impacted from it.

The Westbrook trade was a franchise crippler and Morey has to wear that but literally 25 teams would be nuts not to want him.

 

[Finito]

What were Duncan’s stats last year lol.
Current events- not a historical discussion.

Lebron was injured last year- not load managed. Big difference. Even Leonard’s teammates were pissed about all the load management- see how that turned out.

my point was that Pop pretty much invented load management for his veteran players.

I’m not going to question Greg Popovich. I don’t see anything wrong with resting guys on back to backs or taking them out when it’s a blowout.

 

[Finito]

The Rockets were probably a CP3 hammy tear away from knocking off the most stacked team in history. A lot of legacies were impacted from it.

The Westbrook trade was a franchise crippler and Morey has to wear that but literally 25 teams would be nuts not to want him.

it’s crazy how so much of this comes down to a single moment and how those moments change history.

 

[GatorAZ]

it’s crazy how so much of this comes down to a single moment and how those moments change history.

That’s what makes sports amazing and awful lol

 

[Phrazbit]

The Rockets were probably a CP3 hammy tear away from knocking off the most stacked team in history. A lot of legacies were impacted from it.

The Westbrook trade was a franchise crippler and Morey has to wear that but literally 25 teams would be nuts not to want him.

I agree. The Rockets future is very bleak but they had a long run of high caliber play and he swung a lot of impressive deals but out of desperation things turned into a real mess.

I'd be thrilled to have him run my team though, assuming he approaches his next job with the patience he showed early in his run in Houston.

 

[Phrazbit]

it’s crazy how so much of this comes down to a single moment and how those moments change history.

Horry shoving Nash.

Joe Johnson breaking his face.

Danny Manning tearing his ACL.

Yep...

 

[Mainstreet]

The Rockets were probably a CP3 hammy tear away from knocking off the most stacked team in history. A lot of legacies were impacted from it.

The Westbrook trade was a franchise crippler and Morey has to wear that but literally 25 teams would be nuts not to want him.

I agree. The Rockets future is very bleak but they had a long run of high caliber play and he swung a lot of impressive deals but out of desperation things turned into a real mess.

I'd be thrilled to have him run my team though, assuming he approaches his next job with the patience he showed early in his run in Houston.

Morey reached for it at the end but that's what a good GM does before the window closes... pull out all the stops and go for it.

I'd gladly take Morey as the Suns GM.

 

[Finito]

Morey reached for it at the end but that's what a good GM does before the window closes... pull out all the stops and go for it.

I'd gladly take Morey as the Suns GM.

I agree they had gone as far as they could and they made a big move. I’ll take him all day as long as Sarver lets him do his job

 

[Phrazbit]

Morey reached for it at the end but that's what a good GM does before the window closes... pull out all the stops and go for it.

I'd gladly take Morey as the Suns GM.

If Paul and Harden hated each other as much as it was reported then things were somewhat out of Morey's hands but even so, he sacrificed a lot of depth, all their size and half a decade of picks and in the end made the team worse. I get that they were trying to get over the hump but he really overplayed his hand.

I'd take him as our GM but he botched things at the end there. Their window could have stayed open a while longer, those moves slammed it shut.

 

[Mainstreet]

If Paul and Harden hated each other as much as it was reported then things were somewhat out of Morey's hands but even so, he sacrificed a lot of depth, all their size and half a decade of picks and in the end made the team worse. I get that they were trying to get over the hump but he really overplayed his hand.

I'd take him as our GM but he botched things at the end there. Their window could have stayed open a while longer, those moves slammed it shut.

The Chris Paul and Clint Capela trades were signs the end was near but I thought Morey was desperately trying to make one more run at a championship.

Maybe Morey was too loyal to trade James Harden to start a rebuild. If not, I think he could have quickly laid the foundation for a new team.

 

[Hoop Head]

Both trades, the Paul and the Capela trades were bad also. OKC got the better player out of the Paul/Westbrook swap and they got a boatload of picks to go with him. Of course at the time everyone thought Paul would be dealt again but he made the Thunder overachievers all year and helped Shai's development as well.

The Capela trade was to appease D'Antoni, I believe, and give him his dream of a Center-less roster. When it worked, it worked well but it was far from fool proof and was bound to crash and burn in a 7 game series so it was pretty bad overall. That trade made their roster unappealing for most big name coaches though. Serious work will need to be done to rebuild things there. They'll probably need to sell low on someone like Covington to get a roster that resembles a normal NBA team again.

 

[Cheesebeef]

And last year in a full 82 game season he played 55.

Last year he wasn’t out for load management. He was out INJURED. LeBron missed 17 straight games because he got INJURED on Xmas day when he popped his groin against GS and then came back, played every game until he got beat up again and reinjured the same groin injury, but they only shut him down at the end of the year when the Lakers were officially eliminated from the playoffs.

and the three seasons before that he played in 82/82 games, 76/82 games and 74/82.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Just because someone doesn’t have a title doesn’t mean they aren’t the best player.

who do you think is the best player in the league right now?

 

[swagron]

Last year he wasn’t out for load management. He was out INJURED. LeBron missed 17 straight games because he got INJURED on Xmas day when he popped his groin against GS and then came back, played every game until he got beat up again and reinjured the same groin injury, but they only shut him down at the end of the year when the Lakers were officially eliminated from the playoffs.

and the three seasons before that he played in 82/82 games, 76/82 games and 74/82.

Exactly correct. But Lebron haters don’t care about the details. They just look for a way to put the man down.

 

[Yuma]

who do you think is the best player in the league right now?

Arguably when we had Barkley the best player in the league was Jordan. But really not by a whole lot. You look at the numbers Barkley has put up in play off games and the guy is probably in the top ten all time of guys who did not win a title. I look back at that stats and timely buckets where he literally willed the Suns to victories on teams with less talent than opposing squads. Whether you liked his antics off the court or not, he could ball!

So arguably everyone is on Lebron's bandwagon because of the title win. But guys like Kawhi Leonard and Giannis Antetokounmpo, even Luka Doncic may be better players right now because of their youth and athleticism. They just weren't on a stacked Lakers team. Sometimes coaching comes into play too. Those Bulls, and San Antonio teams that won titles, how can you not say coaching was a major factor?

 

[Mainstreet]

Daryl Morey takes out full page ad to thank James Harden and the Rockets.

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[Cheesebeef]

Arguably when we had Barkley the best player in the league was Jordan. But really not by a whole lot. You look at the numbers Barkley has put up in play off games and the guy is probably in the top ten all time of guys who did not win a title. I look back at that stats and timely buckets where he literally willed the Suns to victories on teams with less talent than opposing squads. Whether you liked his antics off the court or not, he could ball!

So arguably everyone is on Lebron's bandwagon because of the title win. But guys like Kawhi Leonard and Giannis Antetokounmpo, even Luka Doncic may be better players right now because of their youth and athleticism. They just weren't on a stacked Lakers team. Sometimes coaching comes into play too. Those Bulls, and San Antonio teams that won titles, how can you not say coaching was a major factor?

Leonard wasn’t on a stacked team? Come on. That’s a laugh. That was one of the most talented teams I’ve seen in years. And this season Leonard crapped the bed when the pressure was on. Leonard also had Doc who’s a well respected coach by e everyone. So, for at least this season, I have a hard time saying Kawhi was better than LeBron.

also, the idea that this was a stacked Lakers team doesn’t hold much water for me. It was a team of two GREAT stars than a collection of cast offs and knuckleheads who fell off a cliff players 3-8.

As far as Giannis v. LeBron... well, Giannis has led his team to crap the bed the last two seasons, losing as heavy favorites and as great as he is on both sides of the court, can’t make a crunch time play on offense to save his life. Before people start elevating him over LeBron, doesn’t he need to elevate his own team into the finals at least once especially considering he’s in the East and they’ve been favored? He’s also getting coached by a two-time Coach Of The Year.

with Luka... Luka is an offensive force to be reckoned with but is sieve defensively. LeBron matches Luka’s offense but blows away his D.

 

[Mainstreet]

Here is a clue.

It takes two top players playing for the same team to win it all. It's not just which one player is the best.

Anthony Davis and Lebron were ranked 7th and 8th as offensive leaders in postseason stats.

https://www.espn.com/nba/stats/player/_/table/offensive/sort/avgPoints/dir/desc

 

[swagron]

Arguably when we had Barkley the best player in the league was Jordan. But really not by a whole lot. You look at the numbers Barkley has put up in play off games and the guy is probably in the top ten all time of guys who did not win a title. I look back at that stats and timely buckets where he literally willed the Suns to victories on teams with less talent than opposing squads. Whether you liked his antics off the court or not, he could ball!

So arguably everyone is on Lebron's bandwagon because of the title win. But guys like Kawhi Leonard and Giannis Antetokounmpo, even Luka Doncic may be better players right now because of their youth and athleticism. They just weren't on a stacked Lakers team. Sometimes coaching comes into play too. Those Bulls, and San Antonio teams that won titles, how can you not say coaching was a major factor?

Rondo, Morris, Howard, Caruso and Pope are now considered a stacked team? Lol that’s a huge reach. Need to watch more basketball buddy.

 

[Yuma]

Rondo, Morris, Howard, Caruso and Pope are now considered a stacked team? Lol that’s a huge reach. Need to watch more basketball buddy.

I watched it. They have some great role players.