Should Ayton be Traded?

[RON_IN_OC]

Ayton has to go - because he disappears during crunch time - and crunch time is where you win championships - it really is that simple

You can really say that about the entire roster, to some extent. Crunch time, elimination games, etc...the entire team fades and disappears. Can't trade everybody, though.

 

[AzStevenCal]

You can really say that about the entire roster, to some extent. Crunch time, elimination games, etc...the entire team fades and disappears. Can't trade everybody, though.

Yeah, Ayton might disappear when it matters more than most of the team but it's not just him. And we better hope it's mostly a Monty thing because once CP3 lost the ability to bail us out in crunch time we've failed miserably in big games and big moments.

 

[overseascardfan]

I do not agree. Ayton should carry a ball everyone goes. I agree position and blocking out are critical. His big rebounding games you’ll notice no one else is near the basket and even then he fumbles the ball. His hands suck period. He will never be a good rebounder.

C'mon, obviously you're not an Ayton fan but he has been Top 15 in rebounding every year in his NBA career and averages over 10 a game for his career. He's a good rebounder now, he needs to become an elite rebounder and that is with motor, positioning and blocking out.

Exactly, you never see him go after a rebound. it almost always has to deflect towards him. Otherwise he just stands and watches

The correct term is rebounding outside of area. Again, will he develop the motor to go after every rebound is the question.

 

[BirdGangThing]

Yeah, Ayton might disappear when it matters more than most of the team but it's not just him. And we better hope it's mostly a Monty thing because once CP3 lost the ability to bail us out in crunch time we've failed miserably in big games and big moments.

Nobody else literally hides off the court while the actual game is going. Nobody else goes mute, refuses to high five teammates and nobody else leaves to go sit at the end of the bench all by himself during time outs in crucial playoff games

Sorry - but when it comes to disappearing - - nobody is on Ayton's level

 

[Covert Rain]

To say we should trade Ayton because a bunch of talking heads think that's his market value means absolutely nothing until or unless it happens. It was from those same idiots that we kept hearing "pay the man his money" and constantly ripping us for dragging our feet. And there are posters here who repeatedly say things such as "trade him for a pair of dirty socks" which is what generates the "don't trade him for a bunch of scrubs" comments.

100% this. Why would talking heads talk about trading Ayton for scrubs? Who is exactly saying we will only get scrubs? Besides, those talking heads don't get clicks and views that way either. These are the same knuckleheads throwing out these outrageous Chris Paul trades without offering up how that could actually get done under the CBA. What a barn burner of a story that would be?!?!

There are talking head scenarios then there are realistic scenarios. I think the Suns could get two decent players back in return. There is nothing written it has to be center. With that contract you likely will get a throw in player (hence my Jock comment). Depends on what the Suns prioritize. I think the Suns need at PG/PF is greater than the center position not to mention easier to get in terms of impact players. If we could somehow fill gaps at the PG & PF positions and have to live Center by committee? I would be OK with that. Just my two cents.

 

[Proximo]

Gambo just tweeted this

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[ASUCHRIS]

Gambo just tweeted this

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Bummer - they seemed like a legit option to reload. Would have loved a deal that worked around a re-signed Jerami Grant/young talent.

 

[BirdGangThing]

Gambo just tweeted this

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Because even Portland ain't that desperate

 

[Folster]

Gambo just tweeted this

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Hopefully this will stop these nonsense trade speculations about the #3

 

[elindholm]

Hopefully this will stop these nonsense trade speculations about the #3

Including the notion that a player drafted there would have an immediate impact.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Because even Portland ain't that desperate

Portland is a mess...they're the island of misfit toys with a disgruntled leader. They would appear to be the type of team to target.

 

[BirdGangThing]

Portland is a mess...they're the island of misfit toys with a disgruntled leader. They would appear to be the type of team to target.

If the Trailblazers acquired Ayton I could see Dame demanding a trade that same day

DeAndre Ayton's Ben Simmons impersonations are well documented - nobody wants that mess, distraction and lack of testosterone in a big

 

[Folster]

Including the notion that a player drafted there would have an immediate impact.

I don't think it's unreasonable to think a player drafted at #3 could have an immediate impact on a championship contender. It obviously would not be wise to bank on such an outcome.

I don't imagine there are many historic examples of a top 5 drafted player even being drafted by a preseason contender.

But the #3 for Ayton talk was absurd. And the Lillard talk made me embarrassed to be a Suns fan. I felt obligated to tell Portland fans that we aren't all that stupid.

 

[95pro]

Nobody else literally hides off the court while the actual game is going. Nobody else goes mute, refuses to high five teammates and nobody else leaves to go sit at the end of the bench all by himself during time outs in crucial playoff games

Sorry - but when it comes to disappearing - - nobody is on Ayton's level

Ayton was so good in the finals run and has regressed since. Who do I blame, top 3:

1 - Ayton, be a professional and do your job regardless
2 - Monty, his history of beef with his players
3 - CP3, also seems to rile teammates up in the wrong way
4 - JJ/Crowder/CP3 for not getting some sort of usable forward to play alongside Ayton this past season

Monty gone, then cp3 goes, i think that's enough to save our relationship with Ayton. I think the fans want to get behind him, we get excited anytime his does something big.

 

[BirdGangThing]

Ayton was so good in the finals run and has regressed since. Who do I blame, top 3:

1 - Ayton, be a professional and do your job regardless
2 - Monty, his history of beef with his players
3 - CP3, also seems to rile teammates up in the wrong way
4 - JJ/Crowder/CP3 for not getting some sort of usable forward to play alongside Ayton this past season

Monty gone, then cp3 goes, i think that's enough to save our relationship with Ayton. I think the fans want to get behind him, we get excited anytime his does something big.

Or maybe Ayton just never matured and is now afraid of the moment

 

[itlnsunsfan]

This part I agree with. The idea that if Ayton is traded means we are automatically getting someone back at his position that isn't soft is hardly guaranteed. The Suns could decide for example getting a Guard and/or PF back is a higher priority then getting back a Center. IMO, the Suns need to make a play for multiple players which means even if you get a center back it's likely to be someone of Jock's caliber in return.

The Suns, at least defensively, likely will be worse without him. The numbers the past several seasons don't lie. When he is off the court our paint defense becomes the welcome wagon. If we could afford to have an OK center that occasionally shows up and he had a comparable salary to boot? I have no issue keeping him. The fact he was drafted to be the future of our franchise, drafted #1 overall and has the salary he does? I think that's why we should move him. That and I don't think this team can get the depth they need without moving him unless someone comes through at the last minute in a CP3 trade.

Trading Ayton for a bunch of scrubs just because you want him off the team would be monumentally stupid and only compound our problems.

The numbers from this past season say that we were better defensively with Ayton off the court. We held teams to 112.7 points per 100 possessions with him off court and 116.6 on. We were better on offense too. We scored 117.6 points per 100 possessions with him off court and 115.3 on. Our net points per 100 possessions was +4.9 with him off court and -1.3 on.

Deandre Ayton of the Phoenix Suns, NBA player stats

Deandre Ayton of the Phoenix Suns, NBA player stats including plus/minus data

www.82games.com

 

[Covert Rain]

The numbers from this past season say that we were better defensively with Ayton off the court. We held teams to 112.7 points per 100 possessions with him off court and 116.6 on. We were better on offense too. We scored 117.6 points per 100 possessions with him off court and 115.3 on. Our net points per 100 possessions was +4.9 with him off court and -1.3 on.

Deandre Ayton of the Phoenix Suns, NBA player stats

Deandre Ayton of the Phoenix Suns, NBA player stats including plus/minus data

www.82games.com

I said the past few seasons. Last season he went off the rails in terms of regression. Last season was the first year Ayton didn’t show improvement in most areas from the season before. To add salt to the wound was all the off-season talk by Ayton about this was the year he would take a bigger role and dominate.

 

[Hoop Head]

I said the past few seasons. Last season he went off the rails in terms of regression. Last season was the first year Ayton didn’t show improvement in most areas from the season before. To add salt to the wound was all the off-season talk by Ayton about this was the year he would take a bigger role and dominate.

To be fair, Ayton says that nonsense every year. This time there was no silver lining to point to in order to claim he improved in a certain area though.

 

[BirdGangThing]

I wouldn't be completely shocked if we ended up waiving DeAndre Ayton

Sure, getting someone in return would be nice but it would probably be someone some team just wants to get rid of

But if some other team (hopefully a division rival) wants to pick up the bill - leaving us with a ton of room to explore free agency...

What Centers are hitting free agency?

 

[Folster]

I wouldn't be completely shocked if we ended up waiving DeAndre Ayton

Sure, getting someone in return would be nice but it would probably be someone some team just wants to get rid of

But if some other team (hopefully a division rival) wants to pick up the bill - leaving us with a ton of room to explore free agency...

What Centers are hitting free agency?

Not a chance. He hasn't even started his 4 year max contact yet. If there are no possible trades this offseason, then you hope he can rehab some value under Vogel.

Edit: he's one year into his 4 year contract. 3 years remaining.

 

[BirdGangThing]

Not a chance. He hasn't even started his 4 year max contact yet. If there are no possible trades this offseason, then you hope he can rehab some value under Vogel.

I wouldn't rule it out

If Ayton isn't traded before the draft it likely means nobody is feeling him - and at 13 boards and 9pts per playoff game (avg of 32 minutes) I can understand why they aren't - especially at $33 million a year

 

[BirdGangThing]

And this whole Vogel fixing Ayton thing...

I'm the one who loved Monty, I'm the one who vowed to blaspheme which ever coach we replaced him with, but even I won't hold it against Vogel when Ayton ultimately checks out on his team (again)

What's the logic here? Ayton shys away in some important game, won't respond to teammates, vibe goes in the toilet, and Vogel is going to.... ??

Vogel will likely try to do what Monty tried to do, what everybody's tried to do, and plea to Ayton, live in front of national audience, to no avail

 

[Hoop Head]

I wouldn't be completely shocked if we ended up waiving DeAndre Ayton

Sure, getting someone in return would be nice but it would probably be someone some team just wants to get rid of

But if some other team (hopefully a division rival) wants to pick up the bill - leaving us with a ton of room to explore free agency...

What Centers are hitting free agency?

Absolutely not happening. This isn't the NFL. We're not paying him $35m a year for the next 3 years to do nothing and no one would pick up that deal on the waiver wire as no one has space to eat that much money. Just not happening. It would be unprecedented.

He's a lazy clown that is scared of contact but we'll find a taker. This idea there's a deadline on moving him is also wrong. If he's not dealt at the draft then I expect it to happen early in free agency, early July. He'd be a nice consolation prize for a team who strikes out trying to add some free agent big. Then he's their problem.

 

[Hoop Head]

Not a chance. He hasn't even started his 4 year max contact yet. If there are no possible trades this offseason, then you hope he can rehab some value under Vogel.

This was year 1 of his deal, there's 3 years remaining.

 

[AzStevenCal]

And this whole Vogel fixing Ayton thing...

I'm the one who loved Monty, I'm the one who vowed to blaspheme which ever coach we replaced him with, but even I won't hold it against him when Ayton ultimately checks out on his team (again)

What's the logic here? Ayton shys away in some important game, won't respond to teammates, vibe goes in the toilet, and Vogel is going to.... ??

Vogel will likely try to do what Monty tried to do, what everybody's tried to do, and plea to Ayton, live in front of national audience, to no avail

I don't think there's too many here that actually believe Vogel is going to come in and fix DA. But many of us believe that his trade value is so minimal and our needs so great that our best chance to win it all it is if Vogel is the big man whisperer. It's almost guaranteed to fail but still has slightly better odds (IMO) than finding some stupid GM willing to give us real value for a guy who is so well overpaid. As a rule, most GMs don't do anything that foolish unless they're very desperate.