Rapoport: Cardinals trading out of #3 very very likely

BritCard

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Defending the history of this organization is like saying General Custard thought the Indians were friendly.
I really don’t care what happened the previous 100 years. However, this club has a reputation of getting a seat in the back of the NFL bus, like it or not.

Who defended it?

How is saying it's irrelevant and nonsense to keep invoking it as some kind of excuse for being completely freaking miserable ALL OF THE TIME defending it? It happened, it's over.

When something happens in politics do you bring up something that happened in 1930? "I can't vote for a party that introduced the Smoot-Hawley Act".
 

ASUCHRIS

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Who defended it?

How is saying it's irrelevant and nonsense to keep invoking it as some kind of excuse for being completely freaking miserable ALL OF THE TIME defending it? It happened, it's over.

When something happens in politics do you bring up something that happened in 1930? "I can't vote for a party that introduced the Smoot-Hawley Act".
You're trying to make the argument that the past doesn't have an impact on the present. It's incredibly stupid.
 

RON_IN_OC

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Yeah I'm for real. Only the truly hardened whingers use "100 years of losing" nonsense. It's a phrase without meaning (or accuracy) used to justify their overly negative BS.

"I can't help being a fountain of misery. It's the 100 years of losings fault. I wasn't alive for over 60% of it and don't remember another 15% but it happened and I have absorbed it and made it a key tenet of my personality and now you all must suffer it as I dismiss every more and crap on everyone in the org and if you're not with me you're just a homer who doesn't understand".

Jog on man. You can tell who they are made for by the people liking these types of comments.

That doesn't mean nobody can disagree with anything but people who pull out "It's the 100 years fault, man" when someone says anything to counter the narrative are the worst.
Speaking only for myself, I don't always "like" a comment because I like the point of view or agree with it. Lots of times I like them, because I can actually tell there was thought or passion put into making the argument and I want to acknowledge that, without creating an argument. I've probably "liked" a lot of your posts, but rarely agree or fully agree with your takes. That's just me, though.
 

slanidrac16

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Who defended it?

How is saying it's irrelevant and nonsense to keep invoking it as some kind of excuse for being completely freaking miserable ALL OF THE TIME defending it? It happened, it's over.

When something happens in politics do you bring up something that happened in 1930? "I can't vote for a party that introduced the Smoot-Hawley Act".
Read my second paragraph. I agree that beating a dead horse over the last 100 years is dumb.
However, defending the legacy of this franchise is, well. Just as dumb. And saying the last 10 years of this franchise is the best in their history is like a sad love song.
 

BritCard

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Just to be clear. How much do we have to win before the bitters stop bringing up ancient history?

I hate to break this but as the oldest team in the NFL and one with a long history of not being good the franchise would probably have to win 75% of it's game for the next 50 years to get close to .500 all time.
 

BritCard

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Read my second paragraph. I agree that beating a dead horse over the last 100 years is dumb.
However, defending the legacy of this franchise is, well. Just as dumb. And saying the last 10 years of this franchise is the best in their history is like a sad love song.

I did read the 2nd. I was commenting on the 1st and wondering who defended it as it seemed to intimate it was me.
 

kerouac9

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Just to be clear. How much do we have to win before the bitters stop bringing up ancient history?

I hate to break this but as the oldest team in the NFL and one with a long history of not being good the franchise would probably have to win 75% of it's game for the next 50 years to get close to .500 all time.
Maybe we can start by not losing 75 percent of our games next season?
 

PJ1

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Yeah I'm for real. Only the truly hardened whingers use "100 years of losing" nonsense. It's a phrase without meaning (or accuracy) used to justify their overly negative BS.

"I can't help being a fountain of misery. It's the 100 years of losings fault. I wasn't alive for over 60% of it and don't remember another 15% but it happened and I have absorbed it and made it a key tenet of my personality and now you all must suffer it as I dismiss every more and crap on everyone in the org and if you're not with me you're just a homer who doesn't understand".

Jog on man. You can tell who they are made for by the people liking these types of comments.

That doesn't mean nobody can disagree with anything but people who pull out "It's the 100 years fault, man" when someone says anything to counter the narrative are the worst.
Well I have been a fan since 1967 so I have seen plenty of it. One common thread for this franchise has been the ownership. I will go back just one year. The man that hired the new GM just a year ago extended a failed GM and coach for five years. Also approved a massive contract for a QB before it was necessary. So we are negative if we question what he is doing now? We are negative if not sold on his new hires? No you don’t need to go back 100 years or even two years to see the gross incompetence of this organization. And who the hell are you to call anyone negative? You have hundreds of posts bashing one player over and over again and fighting with everyone about it.
 

QuebecCard

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You're trying to make the argument that the past doesn't have an impact on the present. It's incredibly stupid.

Taking in the lessons, not wallowing in the past, is the path to success in the future.

You may understand this; if so, you are deliberately distorting what BritCard is conveying.
 

dreamcastrocks

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And cost the Raiders $20 million in money!! He just signed an extension.
Jalen Ramsey is costing the Rams money. D-Hop the same with us if we actually trade him. Stranger things have happened, but I don't see it.
 

slanidrac16

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I did read the 2nd. I was commenting on the 1st and wondering who defended it as it seemed to intimate it was me.
It wasn’t meant to point you out. I’m sick of the rhetoric about the past. I’m already tired of every move made or not made are defined by “The Cardinal Way”.
I’m not happy with the way this year is shaping up. It’s going to be ugly. But to blast MO as dumb and comparing him to Keim is ridiculous.
You have not seen any of my post debating with anybody about who we’ve signed or who we didn’t sign. I’ve accepted and am happy with the decision to move on from the last regime and I realize the new regime to mold this team with their vision. I also realize it’s not going to happen in 1 year.
My only gripe is I want to see us bring in a QB that can at least cause a little distress on defenses, be available the whole year should Kyler not be ready until we are 2-10 AND create a little competition for Kyler. A guy like Brissett or Minshew would have fit that role. Now my guess is it might be Marriota.
 

BritCard

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Maybe we can start by not losing 75 percent of our games next season?

As most people already predicted we would back in the "Way too early predictions" thread.

I know as a "none optimist" you wasn't expecting a winning season with Kyler hurt and missing time, and a new GM and HC that are going to turn the roster over.

So what's the complaint exactly? We might only win 3 instead of 5? Or 4 instead of 6?

We all asked for Mike to "Burn it down". Did people think in the ashes of Keim's corpse we were going to instantly find a winning team?
 

BritCard

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It wasn’t meant to point you out. I’m sick of the rhetoric about the past. I’m already tired of every move made or not made are defined by “The Cardinal Way”.
I’m not happy with the way this year is shaping up. It’s going to be ugly. But to blast MO as dumb and comparing him to Keim is ridiculous.
You have not seen any of my post debating with anybody about who we’ve signed or who we didn’t sign. I’ve accepted and am happy with the decision to move on from the last regime and I realize the new regime to mold this team with their vision. I also realize it’s not going to happen in 1 year.
My only gripe is I want to see us bring in a QB that can at least cause a little distress on defenses, be available the whole year should Kyler not be ready until we are 2-10 AND create a little competition for Kyler. A guy like Brissett or Minshew would have fit that role. Now my guess is it might be Marriota.

I'm not sure they bring anyone in at QB and if they do it's likely a cheap incentive laden contract.

Looks to me like they want to role as much cap space and draft capital into 2024 as possible.

I wouldn't be surprised if most of the trade back compensation came in 2024 picks either.

Seems to me the FO know next year is a write off with Kyler hurt, and to be fair it's hard to argue that if that's the case why not lose properly?

Who knows? It's early days yet. That's what it looks like so far but things may well change.
 

Shane

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I'm not sure they bring anyone in at QB and if they do it's likely a cheap incentive laden contract.

Looks to me like they want to role as much cap space and draft capital into 2024 as possible.

I wouldn't be surprised if most of the trade back compensation came in 2024 picks either.

Seems to me the FO know next year is a write off with Kyler hurt, and to be fair it's hard to argue that if that's the case why not lose properly?

Who knows? It's early days yet. That's what it looks like so far but things may well change.
Yesterdays report said they were very much interested in Bringing in Brisset. But he chose Washington due to a much easier chance to a starting role moving Forward. Into the future??? If that’s true then the team is clearly in the market for a QB.
 
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bankybruce

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Jalen Ramsey is costing the Rams money. D-Hop the same with us if we actually trade him. Stranger things have happened, but I don't see it.
The difference is though that neither team just extended either of those players. They extended him 369 days ago, is coming off his best season and had never missed a game in 4 years. While stranger things have happened, getting Crosby would probably probably actually cost us.

Something like this.

Raiders get
#3
#66

Cardinals get
#7
#109
Maxx Crosby
 

slanidrac16

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I'm not sure they bring anyone in at QB and if they do it's likely a cheap incentive laden contract.

Looks to me like they want to role as much cap space and draft capital into 2024 as possible.

I wouldn't be surprised if most of the trade back compensation came in 2024 picks either.

Seems to me the FO know next year is a write off with Kyler hurt, and to be fair it's hard to argue that if that's the case why not lose properly?

Who knows? It's early days yet. That's what it looks like so far but things may well change.
We have to spend a little money. Living in Chicago I got to see a lot of the Bears this year. They won 3 games this year and I can live with that.
But Fields actually created entertainment. We are now the Arizona Bears without that entertainment value. If we are relegate to Mc Sorely the stadium will be lucky to have 20,000 cardinal fans and this site will see the lowest activity in years.
Hell I’ll be happy if we draft a guy like Bennett and start him.
 

kerouac9

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As most people already predicted we would back in the "Way too early predictions" thread.

I know as a "none optimist" you wasn't expecting a winning season with Kyler hurt and missing time, and a new GM and HC that are going to turn the roster over.

So what's the complaint exactly? We might only win 3 instead of 5? Or 4 instead of 6?

We all asked for Mike to "Burn it down". Did people think in the ashes of Keim's corpse we were going to instantly find a winning team?

Yes. I would rather the Cards be more competitive and win more games than not. That's because I am an Arizona Cardinals fan.

I was not asking for Mike to "Burn it Down." There are signs that we're not working to burn it down, anyway. If we were doing a controlled burn on this roster we'd be getting rid of James Conner and Zach Ertz along with Deandre Hopkins.

Instead we're following the Houston Texans model of multi-year, aimless rebuild, only we have a $250 million franchise quarterback entering his prime seasons.

There's a false choice on offer from you and others: either sign a bunch of expensive aging veterans in free agency or accept Kyzir White as a "big time free agent" (a term taken directly from last night's Big Red Rage and legitimately hilarious).

I've outlined what should be the goal multiple times: load your roster with players who should be peaking with Kyler Murray and the players you're drafting this year. Losing Allen and Murphy puts us further behind that goal.
 

BritCard

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Yesterdays report said they were very much interested in Bringing in Brisset. But he chose Washington due to a much easier chance to a starting role moving. Forward I to the future??? If that’s true then the team is clearly in the market for a QB.

It's the worst situation for a new GM to be in. To make big moves you need to be sure what your situation at QB is. Kyler injury and surgery are still relatively new and it's too early to know when he might be back.

Do they spend $10m on a better backup only for Kyler to be ready earlier? Would a better backup like Brissett want to sign here not know themselves when Kyler might be back?

Keim would have bet it all on Kyler being back fairly soon and spent accordingly.

The safest plan is to assume next year is a write off already. Use it to get new systems in place. Keep the money to role over and build up what draft capital you can. Blood whatever rookies you draft and get ready for a push in 2024.
 

ASUCHRIS

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Taking in the lessons, not wallowing in the past, is the path to success in the future.
Yes- the lesson is that the Bidwill family has a proven track history of failure. It's absurd that teams/fanbases are held hostage by the most prodigal of sons.

The most recent players poll nicely illustrates the fact that Michael has learned nothing from the failures of his father.

I see no evidence of anything learned - just more punching in the dark and hope.
 

QuebecCard

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As most people already predicted we would back in the "Way too early predictions" thread.

I know as a "none optimist" you wasn't expecting a winning season with Kyler hurt and missing time, and a new GM and HC that are going to turn the roster over.

So what's the complaint exactly? We might only win 3 instead of 5? Or 4 instead of 6?

We all asked for Mike to "Burn it down". Did people think in the ashes of Keim's corpse we were going to instantly find a winning team?

We're finding that some of the 'burn it down' crowd have suddenly become home remodelers. A bit of work on the porch, touching up the patio, etc.

(When I said 'tear it down,' I actually meant remodel, and anyone who doesn't understand this is stupid.) ;)
 

QuebecCard

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Yes- the lesson is that the Bidwill family has a proven track history of failure. It's absurd that teams/fanbases are held hostage by the most prodigal of sons.

The most recent players poll nicely illustrates the fact that Michael has learned nothing from the failures of his father.

I see no evidence of anything learned - just more punching in the dark and hope.

You've certainly made a strong case for closing your account.

Twenty-plus years of torture... Why?
 

ASUCHRIS

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You've certainly made a strong case for closing your account.
Thanks for the advice - I was here long before you, and will be here long after you're gone.
Why torture yourself?
Suffering fools that ask the same silly questions every year? "dur, if you don't support everything the team does, you're not a real fan". That kind of derp?

This board isn't just for kool-aiders, much as it might offend your sensibilities. Keep fighting Mikey B's battles though, I'm sure he appreciates your efforts!
31 sites await your support. ;)
Cute.

There used to be more of an effort by mods to cut down on the "love it or leave it" crew, but apparently questioning fandom isn't an offence anymore.
 

BritCard

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Yes. I would rather the Cards be more competitive and win more games than not. That's because I am an Arizona Cardinals fan.

I was not asking for Mike to "Burn it Down." There are signs that we're not working to burn it down, anyway. If we were doing a controlled burn on this roster we'd be getting rid of James Conner and Zach Ertz along with Deandre Hopkins.

Instead we're following the Houston Texans model of multi-year, aimless rebuild, only we have a $250 million franchise quarterback entering his prime seasons.

There's a false choice on offer from you and others: either sign a bunch of expensive aging veterans in free agency or accept Kyzir White as a "big time free agent" (a term taken directly from last night's Big Red Rage and legitimately hilarious).

I've outlined what should be the goal multiple times: load your roster with players who should be peaking with Kyler Murray and the players you're drafting this year. Losing Allen and Murphy puts us further behind that goal.

The players you want us to sign don't exist. You want 25 to 27 year old's hitting free agency who are talented, but not talented enough to get paid too much or get re-signed, who don't mind wasting a year of their premium years losing while waiting for Kyler to be ready for 2024. Who are these players specifically?

What primo free agent's are signing here knowing Kyler is going to miss a bunch of the season? We are the only team in the league that KNOW we are starting the year with a backup QB and that will continue for what is likely 4-6 games minimum. And even then he's likely nowhere near himself. He was spooked by contact before, I don't see that improving.

You will recall I said way back before we fired Kliff that we should keep him around for one more season precisely for this reason. To let him take the hit instead of a new HC. With Kyler's injury 2023 was always a write off.

There is no false choice on offer from me. I don't think we should sign a bunch of aging expensive veterans and neither do I consider Kyzir White big time free agent. He's a solid player, which is why he got paid what he did.

The only thing I believe we can do in the situation we are in is look for value and improve the roster depth ready for a push in 2024 with a bunch of cap space and draft capital.
 

QuebecCard

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Thanks for the advice - I was here long before you, and will be here long after you're gone.

Suffering fools that ask the same silly questions every year? "dur, if you don't support everything the team does, you're not a real fan". That kind of derp?

This board isn't just for kool-aiders, much as it might offend your sensibilities. Keep fighting Mikey B's battles though, I'm sure he appreciates your efforts!

Cute.

There used to be more of an effort by mods to cut down on the "love it or leave it" crew, but apparently questioning fandom isn't an offence anymore.

But what exactly are you a fan of? :shrug:

We 'fools' are more than curious.
 
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