Peter King: Arizona Owns 2024

MadCardDisease

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Next year needs to be about the now, not the future. I'm not looking for a 3-5 year plan to get good. If we aren't planning to compete in 2024, what the heck are we doing?
LOL. Stout as rigid as possible as always. Never thinking outside the box. "If the Cardinals add a bunch of future first rounders they have failed the now!"

Just because the Cardinals move back 6-10 spots doesn't mean that they still can't land a quality impact player. Oh and just because the Cardinals own future first round picks doesn't mean that they are not valuable now. One only has to look at what Miami did with the Trey Lance trade. They moved back from #3 to #12 overall and added 2 extra first rounders and a third rounder. They didn't use any of those 1st rounders to make a pick. They traded those picks for moving up to select Jaylen Waddle, and trading for Tyreek Hill and Bradley Chubb. Not a bad haul!

The Cards need to take advantage of the opportunity of drafting early and other teams desperation at the QB position. Assuming a bad team moves up for a QB the Cards could land another very high pick in 2025 and 2026 to add to their own first round picks. Shoot they could move back twice if they end up owning the #1 and #2 overall picks next year. I'd take 4 extra firsts and a handful of extra day 2 picks to move back a few spots.
 

kerouac9

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Next year needs to be about the now, not the future. I'm not looking for a 3-5 year plan to get good. If we aren't planning to compete in 2024, what the heck are we doing?
I think you can do both. Armchair GMs believe that someone is always willing to give up the #11 pick and a first-rounder the next year to move up into the top 5. That's often the case, but Monti's trade was the first draft day trade in the top 5 picks in like nine years or something.

The pro argument is that you can eventually use that banked capital to make a big move for a quarterback or just grab two really good prospects. You do that when you think you're on the cusp of transitioning from a team who competes for a playoff spot to competing for a Super Bowl.

I'm guessing that the plan is position the Arizona Cardinals to compete for a playoff spot in 2024.
 

Chopper0080

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I think you can do both. Armchair GMs believe that someone is always willing to give up the #11 pick and a first-rounder the next year to move up into the top 5. That's often the case, but Monti's trade was the first draft day trade in the top 5 picks in like nine years or something.

The pro argument is that you can eventually use that banked capital to make a big move for a quarterback or just grab two really good prospects. You do that when you think you're on the cusp of transitioning from a team who competes for a playoff spot to competing for a Super Bowl.

I'm guessing that the plan is position the Arizona Cardinals to compete for a playoff spot in 2024.
I agree that us the plan for now. I also believe that plan could change if they are in a position to grab a top QB next year that they believe is better than having Murray.
 

Stout

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LOL. Stout as rigid as possible as always. Never thinking outside the box. "If the Cardinals add a bunch of future first rounders they have failed the now!"

Just because the Cardinals move back 6-10 spots doesn't mean that they still can't land a quality impact player. Oh and just because the Cardinals own future first round picks doesn't mean that they are not valuable now. One only has to look at what Miami did with the Trey Lance trade. They moved back from #3 to #12 overall and added 2 extra first rounders and a third rounder. They didn't use any of those 1st rounders to make a pick. They traded those picks for moving up to select Jaylen Waddle, and trading for Tyreek Hill and Bradley Chubb. Not a bad haul!

The Cards need to take advantage of the opportunity of drafting early and other teams desperation at the QB position. Assuming a bad team moves up for a QB the Cards could land another very high pick in 2025 and 2026 to add to their own first round picks. Shoot they could move back twice if they end up owning the #1 and #2 overall picks next year. I'd take 4 extra firsts and a handful of extra day 2 picks to move back a few spots.
Ah, backtracking on what you said and I quoted: "...would go a long way to setting this team up in the future." When do we plan to stop trading blue chippers for lesser-thans? When do we go ahead and take the premium players instead of hoping the lesser talents are better than the higher-rated players? Or are we going to continue with the "luxury players" idea that the Cards "can't afford to select them?" Sure, let's pass up on, say, a Marvin Harrison Jr. to pick like the 3rd best edge rusher. I know the reply: "But we have two!" My reply? How about we get two blue chippers? Crazy enough to work.

It's a nice fantasy that we're going to constantly trade down and accumulate extra first round picks from teams while still getting players as good as we could have gotten had we stood pat, but that's what it is: a fantasy. I mean, unless Monti is somehow the second coming and all the other GMs just decide to be dumb forever. I'm not saying we shouldn't trade down, or that there's not a situation where I'd want us to trade down. I'd like to approach it with situational flexibility, rather than saying what we should absolutely do right now. I was specifically replying to your "setting the team up for the future." I makes me feel like getting a jersey made with "Future" or "Cap Space" on it. If we tried to play this yearly shell game, some folks--maybe you, maybe not--would want to keep doing it "for the future" every single year.

So, let's nail down your opinion, as I believe I've stated mine pretty well. Would you like us to draft next year as if we're winning that year, or to set us up more for 2025? Do you think we're doing just as well to win next year by trading back next year? Do you subscribe to the idea we can't afford luxury players like some on the board have propagated?
 

Redrage

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Although happy about all of the trades. It may have sealed my decision to not get sunday ticket.

I'll let the summer play out a little more though before I fully decide.
Yeah, I'm going to watch highlights the next day and catch them when they're the national game in the 4:00 ET slot.
 

Cbus cardsfan

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Drafts always look that way a year out.

Egbuka is in this draft too. That Illinois DT Newton who can rush the passer, who I like more than Carter. The Ohio State edges. Michael Penix Jr.
JT Tuimola the edge from OSU is the one you want.
I saw mocks with Osu having 7-9 1st rounders next year. I don’t see that but they have some high level talent entering next years draft.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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I think his ceiling is higher than Hump's ceiling ever was. Humphries was a fringe 1st round pick.

Joe Alt looks like a perennial All Pro though. He is massive (bigger than Paris) and plays at a school that produces outstanding OL (Notre Dame). But you know what? He could have a career ending injury tomorrow, so you can't really plan for next year's draft class.
Never said anything about planning for next years draft class. Just lamenting the fact that the highest rated tackle in the draft we did decide to draft the first one didn’t have that projection.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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I heard probably 5-6 talent evaluators say that this was a relatively weak class. I've heard that most teams only had 15 first round grades, and there are some classes that have 40 first round grades.
I thought it had a shortage of first round talent but a wealthy of 2nd round talent. But even the first statement doesn’t speak to the relative level of talent of those 15 first rounders. Hadn’t heard anything in regard to that.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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But I think Hump hit his ceiling or got 80%+ of the way there. PJJ’s ceiling is Hump or Laremy Tunsil.

There’s not much to suggest that PJJ has Joe Thomas ability which I think you’d hope the ceiling would be with the #6 pick in an average draft.
That’s my point.
 

Krangodnzr

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JT Tuimola the edge from OSU is the one you want.
I saw mocks with Osu having 7-9 1st rounders next year. I don’t see that but they have some high level talent entering next years draft.
I remember that game he had against Penn State. Best game I think I've ever seen ANY edge ever have.
 

Krangodnzr

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I thought it had a shortage of first round talent but a wealthy of 2nd round talent. But even the first statement doesn’t speak to the relative level of talent of those 15 first rounders. Hadn’t heard anything in regard to that.
Yeah but look at hit rates between first and second round picks and you'll see the difference in hit rate is pretty damn significant.

PJJ is a really good prospect. I want looking at him much before the draft because I didn't think tackle was a need, but it's not a hard argument to make.
 

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I remember that game he had against Penn State. Best game I think I've ever seen ANY edge ever have.

That was a CHandler Jones vs Titans game though. He had 2 sacks, 2 INT's and 3 TFL's in that game.

In the other 12 games he had 1.5 sacks and 7.5 TFL's.

He needs a much better 2023 to go in round 1.
 

Krangodnzr

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That was a CHandler Jones vs Titans game though. He had 2 sacks, 2 INT's and 3 TFL's in that game.

In the other 12 games he had 1.5 sacks and 7.5 TFL's.

He needs a much better 2023 to go in round 1.
And a pick six too.

I want Jared Verse though. He has a 25% pass rush win rate last year. I think he can be an elite pass rusher and still has untapped potential.
 

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