Navarre starting next week

vince56

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Ouchie-Z-Clown said:
"reckless?!?" why? what's at stake? what has denny got to lose? we're not going to the playoffs this year. our other two qbs suck balls. 3 games is not enough time to evaluate (we saw that with mccown last year), so you don't want to wait too long to throw navarre in. why not see if we have something there? if he sucks too, then we KNOW we have to do something else in the offseason. i love this move.

It appears reckless because as bad as we are, we're only 2 games out of first place (1.5 from the wildcard) in our divison with 5 games left to play. I'm no expert, and I believe Green knows what he's doing, but on the surface, yes it definitely appears reckless because at the beginning of the season, McCown was THE Qb that could take us to the playoffs according to Green, and now, something has happened that changes all that.

Can the Cards make the playoffs? yes. Will they, probably not, but lets not give up before we're out of it. No need for defeatism when we still have a chance.

This is a very interesting decision and I can't wait until Sunday to see how this plays out on the field. It would be amazing if Navarre & Croom are inserted and all of a sudden our offense comes to life.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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vince56 said:
It appears reckless because as bad as we are, we're only 2 games out of first place (1.5 from the wildcard) in our divison with 5 games left to play. I'm no expert, and I believe Green knows what he's doing, but on the surface, yes it definitely appears reckless because at the beginning of the season, McCown was THE Qb that could take us to the playoffs according to Green, and now, something has happened that changes all that.

Can the Cards make the playoffs? yes. Will they, probably not, but lets not give up before we're out of it. No need for defeatism when we still have a chance.

This is a very interesting decision and I can't wait until Sunday to see how this plays out on the field. It would be amazing if Navarre & Croom are inserted and all of a sudden our offense comes to life.

but that's just it, is it really "reckless" to replace one dude who throws for 90 yards and another who is a turnover machine with a relatively unknown rookie? at least with navarre we don't yet know how much he sucks. the other two dudes, and i've been yelling this for weeks, suck big time arse. so just how reckless is it to replace crap with the unknown?

as for the playoffs, yes, i realize that mathmatically we have a chance. and yeah, we're only 1.5 behind the wild card. but the team you saw the last two weeks has NO CHANCE of making the playoffs. if you beleive that it does, you have a serious kool aid infection.
 

Renz

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Wow! This floors me, but in a good way. Like Ouchie says, the playoffs are a pipe dream at this point, so why not see what we've got.

I think it's great! Kudos to Green for doing it, not many NFL coaches would. I think this is Green's way of saying he was wrong about King, but he is too proud to just come right out and say it.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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clif said:
that's it!!! I knew there was some reason I didn't like King.

he just seemed to short for the position.. I honestly can say it bugged me


eh, it only bugged me when he trotted off the field after another 3 - and - out and josh would pat him on the top of his helmet.
 

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Russ Smith said:
The guy was under enormous pressure because Henson basically quit on Lloyd Carr when they had planned to redshirt Navarre. The backup QB started and bombed, so they started Navarre halfway through his freshman year. Fans had seen Griese, Brady and Henson, they weren't ready to accept losing games and watching this big lumbering kid miss guys and do all the things true Freshman QB"s do.
Navarre was redshirted, Russ.

And let me add that Lloyd Carr said, in Navarre's junior year, that he thought Navarre had the skill to become an NFL QB. Lloyd Carr does NOT just come out and say that about anyone.

This article will give some of you less familiar with Navarre some insight into his character:
http://www.michigandaily.com/vnews/display.v/ART/2003/11/24/3fc1a30badfb2
 
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Cheesebeef

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Is there actually some kind of HARMONY on this board about the QB situation? Say it ain't so - what the hell are we gonna talk about now?

I still can't get over how awful that King pick was thrown ten yrads short to Fitz. I still think it was the worst pass I've ever seen (considering he had a complete pocket and Fitz was wide open). Oye!
 

Russ Smith

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Wolverine said:
Navarre was redshirted, Russ.

Correct, I wasn't sure on that one and reread his bio. He was redshirted and then expected to be the backup his first year to Henson, Henson got hurt and Navarre started 4 games before Henson took over. Was supposed to be the backup his redshirt soph year but Henson left and he started every game.
 

Russ Smith

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cheesebeef said:
Is there actually some kind of HARMONY on this board about the QB situation? Say it ain't so - what the hell are we gonna talk about now?

I still can't get over how awful that King pick was thrown ten yrads short to Fitz. I still think it was the worst pass I've ever seen (considering he had a complete pocket and Fitz was wide open). Oye!

He was just trying to be pretty give him some slack. :)

That was a brutal throw, and how many sideline throws ended up out of bounds? What's the point if the guy has no chance to catch it in bounds, either throw it WAY out of bounds or give your WR a chance.
 

Cheesebeef

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Russ Smith said:
He was just trying to be pretty give him some slack. :)

That was a brutal throw, and how many sideline throws ended up out of bounds? What's the point if the guy has no chance to catch it in bounds, either throw it WAY out of bounds or give your WR a chance.

Russ - even I was joining into the "We want Josh" chant. Being there in person was so completely sad. Of course Josh came in and threw a horrible pick to David Barrett(his first pick of the season - of course) and then I felt ashamed. I like the Navarre move but King was sooo bad that I would have been happy seeing JOsh back out there.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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cheesebeef said:
Russ - even I was joining into the "We want Josh" chant. Being there in person was so completely sad. Of course Josh came in and threw a horrible pick to David Barrett(his first pick of the season - of course) and then I felt ashamed. I like the Navarre move but King was sooo bad that I would have been happy seeing JOsh back out there.

i, on the other hand, tried to get the "we want anyone else" chant going to no avail. guess all those josh chanters got what they wanted . . . a horrible pick in the end zone when we could have settled for a fg and still been in the game.

JOSH AND SHAWN SUCK DONKEY.
 

Billy Flynt

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NickelBack said:
The kid from Michigan getting the start in Detroit?!?

Could there be a method to this madness??

I'm thinking that the Lions have agreed to lose the game if we put in Navarre so they can sell more tickets. :)
 

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I like the move. Yes, we are technically still in the playoff hunt, but with the QB performances we have had recently, we have no chance to make them. Playing Navarre now is our only option left to make it. If he somehow sparks the offense enough, all is good. If not, we are getting a chance to evaluate Navarre, and see if he can be a workable QB solution.
 

Billy Flynt

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Well he can definitley throw the deep ball better than either McCown or King! Now we just need a receiver who is fast enough to get that deep.
 

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Russ Smith said:
That'll sure work wonders convincing the team you know what the hell you're doing!

Next week what will he activate Chris Lewis and start him?

Navarre should be the backup, Josh should get the start until we're mathematically eliminated.

Russ go to...!!! So far this year every young QB drafted this year has played an won. Well with the exception of Rivers. Why not start this young rookie. He has the best arm of any of our QB's, and Has played in more big games than either Josh or "Leon."

You live in San Fran Area, how do you know that this kid doesn't have what it takes. You have never seen him up close have you. Well I have. He is in the mold of Brady. Most of those QB's that have come out of Mich. Play that way. So please hold off on your comments until you see this kid play.

Heck if you were the Steelers coach Ben might be still sitting on the bench.

This forum looks up to you so please act as if you might know something.

Allan.

You hit a very sour note with me today, as have most of the members of this forum have. DG wants to see what he has in the offense, so let him coach.
 

Russ Smith

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Lex said:
Thanks for those links Russ-

Since you liked those, here's some blurbs from his dad about how fun it is having your son as QB at Michigan.





Larry Navarre has sat through enough Michigan football games to know it is better to walk around, watch the game on television monitors and listen to his portable radio.

In other words, tune out the rest of the world, because it can be tough in the stands -- home and away -- listening to criticism directed at your son.

Navarre's son, John, is the Wolverines' starting quarterback, a fifth-year senior who has taken his share of biting and, at times, venomous criticism throughout his career.

The kid is too slow. He locks in on receivers. He throws too high. He can't win the big game.

And that's the nice stuff.

Many parents of Michigan players stand out because they proudly wear their sons' jerseys, and many, mostly the mothers, wear buttons with pictures of their football-playing sons.

Larry Navarre wears neither. It is better, he finds, to be incognito when checking into hotel rooms during game weekends, when he looks for his stadium seat and when he is waiting for his son after a game.

"I remember two years ago, I was standing next to a post (at Michigan Stadium), smoking, and this man and his little 9-year-old were standing next to me, and he was saying, 'That Navarre stinks,' " Navarre said.

"I just walked to the next post. Well, he followed me over there. There were some other words he said, and I turned around, looked at him and said, 'How old is your son?' He said, 'Nine years old." And I said, 'Boy, I'm sure you kind of hope he can play for Michigan someday,' and he said that would be a dream come true. I told him, 'You may want to rethink that because some fans are really cruel when they start talking about your kid.' And he looked at me and said, 'You're not John's dad, are you?' I said, 'Yeah, I am.' He said he should probably leave, and I said, 'Yeah, that would be a good idea.' "



AND

Larry Navarre has seen and heard far too much to chalk up what he considers rude and nasty behavior to the college football environment.

Two years ago, he took his 75-year-old mother to a game to watch her grandson.

"There were some mid-20-ish guys there, and they started with the (obscenities) about John," Navarre said.

He leaned over and asked them to watch the language in front of his mother.

"And then 15 minutes later, they're doing it again," he said. "I said, 'Hey, that's enough, guys,' and one said, 'I paid and I can say whatever I want,' and I said, 'No, you can't. This is his grandma, I'm his dad, and I'm not going to tolerate it.' By halftime, they left."

Larry Navarre has taken several of his son's high school friends to games. They always wear Navarre's No. 16 jersey. Almost always, Larry said, he has to restrain his son's friends because they can't stand hearing their friend being ripped so vociferously.

After games, Larry Navarre always can be found outside Michigan's locker room waiting for his son. He walks with John from outside Crisler Arena all the way to the parking lot at Schembechler Hall, a fairly lengthy walk. Navarre admits he is there just in case.

"Win or lose, I'm going to be there," Navarre said. "Part of the reason I'm there is because walking with John through the parking lot can get kind of rough." Some fans shout obscenities even if his son is signing autographs for youngsters.

John Navarre has stopped going downtown after games like the rest of the student body because, his father said, he has been "challenged" too many times. Instead, father and son go back to the hotel, cook out, then call it a night early, and Navarre goes back to his apartment.

Larry Navarre said he has never regretted a day his son has been at Michigan. He has learned not to listen to his son's critics and has learned restraint. After all, what could be worse than reading about the quarterback's father arrested for hitting a fan?

"It's not fun sitting in the stands," Navarre said. "I never thought I would think this way on the debate of college kids being paid. But last year, I thought, if my son can take that type of abuse from fans and media, then he should be paid. People forget, this is college football.
 

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Ouchie-Z-Clown said:
but that's just it, is it really "reckless" to replace one dude who throws for 90 yards...

Yesterday, Kelly Holcomb threw for over 400 yards and LOST, while Carson Palmer threw for 251 yards and WON.

My point?

Passing yards mean squadoosh when it comes to winning and losing, and regardless of what you think of Josh as a QB, the team was 4-5 (4-2 in his last 6 games) with him at the helm.
 

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I have to say that I was pleased that Josh was put back in yesterday (although a little too late) and floored this morning when I found out Navarre was starting Sunday!! Now I may not be as knowledgeable on QBs as some of you but I thought Josh did a great job of protecting the ball which in some cases meant taking a sack. We all know he too can throw a long ball IF a receiver is open. Now, I agree, he needed to work on not giving away his target with his eyes but that all comes with time. I really think that the play calling sucked and kind of kept Josh from doing too many things. He was trying to do what was asked of him and this is what he gets!! I say let Josh play like he did in the last game of last season and I see some more wins!!!
 

Russ Smith

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Bobcat said:
Russ go to...!!! So far this year every young QB drafted this year has played an won. Well with the exception of Rivers. Why not start this young rookie. He has the best arm of any of our QB's, and Has played in more big games than either Josh or "Leon."

You live in San Fran Area, how do you know that this kid doesn't have what it takes. You have never seen him up close have you. Well I have. He is in the mold of Brady. Most of those QB's that have come out of Mich. Play that way. So please hold off on your comments until you see this kid play.

Heck if you were the Steelers coach Ben might be still sitting on the bench.

This forum looks up to you so please act as if you might know something.

Allan.

You hit a very sour note with me today, as have most of the members of this forum have. DG wants to see what he has in the offense, so let him coach.


Confused.

1) You told me not to judge Navarre until I see him play, one sentence after you judged him.

2) Seen him a lot in college, saw him against the Raiders in the preseason. Looked good throwing the ball underneath against a deep zone at the end of the game.

3) Eli Manning is 0-2 Rivers hasn't played, Ben is unbeaten, what other Qb's are you talking about? If you mean Krenzel, he had ZERO to do with them winning and got benched for Hutchinson today. He went 3-2 overall and had a 52.5 pass rating when he got benched.

4) I've been saying for months we should have picked Ben, you've been ripping me for months for saying it, now you're saying if I were in Pittsburgh I wouldn't be playing Ben? You do know he got his job by injury?

Why does this forum look up to me, we're all a bunch of guys writing about our favorite team with no actual input to the team, that makes no sense at all.

Guys who actually get paid to talk and write about football are laughing about this decision on national tv right now.
 

JeffGollin

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As to what Denny sees in Navarre, he said he's big, strong, tough, and smart.
...That's it....Culpepper?
Gotta go with Russ on this one. Culpepper can motor. Navarre is not known for his blazing foot-speed.

From purely a fan standpoint, you have to like the move because it gives you something new and exciting to look forward to.

Will it work?

Hmmm. Maybe. Maybe not.
 

BuckeyeCardinal

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This Buckeye fan of course is rooting for Navarre.

He tore us up last year at Ann Arbor and it was no fluke.

If nothing else it will tell us if we have a QB worth keeping. McCown may not wish to be a backup. King is Jeff Blake re-visited. Navarre is either starting material or cut bait.

Something else it might tell us is how much if any the o-line has improved since day one. The word "escapability" and Navarre are never in the same sentence unless the phrase "lack of" is as well.
 
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Russ Smith

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Pariah said:
I dunno. How tall are you?

;)

11 foot 3, I eat punks like you for breakfast. :)

I forget the exact line, from a classic Monty Python skit.
 
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Lex

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Culpepper can motor?

The guy is 270. How fast can he possibly be now?

But try TACKLE a 6'6 240 lb. quarterback, standing in the pocket, with DE's flying by trying to take him down with arm tackles.

I don't think so.
 
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