Murray and Leadership

TruColor

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Narratives change.
Couple years back Kyler was being hated on because he and his backup were reviewing film on a tablet with their coach instead of running out on the field when a defender got injured.

Apparently now, that never happened...because kyler and his coach never looked at a tablet on the sidelines...


This damned Mandela effect really been screwing with me lately
It's the gray seats in the stadium.
 

kerouac9

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Talent deficient team
Coming off major injury
New coaching staff
New offense
Pathetic left guard play
Inexperienced center
Rookie at right tackle
Rookie at receiver
Basically rookie at TE
Lack of #1 receiver

Yes, gutty performance.
What would’ve been the alternative for you? Just quit?

“Basically a rookie at TE” is especially rich.
 

cardpa

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I have never been much of a Murray fan. That said, I believe this is his make or break year. He now has pieces around him and no longer has an excuse of lack of weapons and a competent coaching staff. He needs to make substantial steps forward both in his game and his leadership. If all we get is marginal progress, then Murray will never be the answer.
 

CardNots

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What would’ve been the alternative for you? Just quit?

“Basically a rookie at TE” is especially rich.
29 receptions for 265 yards on 13 starts under KK, yes basically a rookie going into his season two.

The alternative was no play. The injury suffered needs 18+ months to return to pre injury status. I understand the coaching needed to know if they could move forward with Kyler but sitting out last year’s season might have been the smarter play.

I really haven’t used the word gutty in some time, but another look at the definition it works for me.

gutty (adjective as in valiant) Strongest matches. courageous fearless gallant gutsy heroic indomitable intrepid noble plucky stout strong-willed vigorous.

Maybe I should look up the word nitpicking instead?
 

kerouac9

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29 receptions for 265 yards on 13 starts under KK, yes basically a rookie going into his season two.
McBride played 53% of the offensive snaps in his actual rookie season. It’s weird that you can measure TE contributions and experiences in ways other than receptions.

Beej played just 37% of defensive snaps last season. Do you consider him also basically a rookie?

No pro athlete stays out 18 months for a knee injury anymore. If just getting back on the field within the average timeline is your definition of grit, more power to you.
 

CardNots

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Beej played just 37% of defensive snaps last season. Do you consider him also basically a rookie?
Yes, I consider Beej a rookie going into his first full season.
No pro athlete stays out 18 months for a knee injury anymore. If just getting back on the field within the average timeline is your definition of grit, more power to you.
Ok, your opinion is duly noted…
 

Stout

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Yes, I consider Beej a rookie going into his first full season.

Ok, your opinion is duly noted…
Beej isn't a rookie this year. Not by any metric. That just offers more excuse ahead of time for him not contributing more heading into the season. It's not a matter of semantics; it's not like he missed a chunk of the season here or anything. When do you consider players not to be rookies any longer?
 

CardNots

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Beej isn't a rookie this year. Not by any metric. That just offers more excuse ahead of time for him not contributing more heading into the season. It's not a matter of semantics; it's not like he missed a chunk of the season here or anything.
Okay I’ll play along.

Wasn’t Beej injured early on with little to no training camp?

What game did he finally get on the field consistently?
When do you consider players not to be rookies any longer?
At the half way point of their first contract if they were drafted or substantial playing time in their first year.

My comment was relate to McBride as he looked green at the beginning of his second year.

Kerouac9 is correct in his initial assessment of my comment on McBride as now that I think about it Kyler wasn’t exposed to a rookie TE as McBride had shook the green when Kyler took over last season.
 

Stout

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Okay I’ll play along.

Wasn’t Beej injured early on with little to no training camp?

What game did he finally get on the field consistently?

At the half way point of their first contract if they were drafted or substantial playing time in their first year.

My comment was relate to McBride as he looked green at the beginning of his second year.

Kerouac9 is correct in his initial assessment of my comment on McBride as now that I think about it Kyler wasn’t exposed to a rookie TE as McBride had shook the green when Kyler took over last season.
Sorry, we will disagree on the definition of rookies. The only time I consider a 2nd-year player not a rook is when they have to take a redshirt year, or close enough to it. Beej had a whole year, as did McBride before last year. Those count as rookie seasons, 100 percent.
 

slanidrac16

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Talent deficient team
Coming off major injury
New coaching staff
New offense
Pathetic left guard play
Inexperienced center
Rookie at right tackle
Rookie at receiver
Basically rookie at TE
Lack of #1 receiver

Yes, gutty performance.
Nice post. Kyler has taken my concerns about him and put them to bed.
I was all over his s*** a couple of years ago. When Bidwill resigned the two other K boys I think it infuriated Murray.
 

dreamcastrocks

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I have never been much of a Murray fan. That said, I believe this is his make or break year. He now has pieces around him and no longer has an excuse of lack of weapons and a competent coaching staff. He needs to make substantial steps forward both in his game and his leadership. If all we get is marginal progress, then Murray will never be the answer.
I don't think he needs to make substantial steps forward. If he plays like how he ended the year, we will be just fine.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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I can’t believe people are still arguing all KK or all K1 fault. I think it’s clear neither was a great leader. Kk is gone so who cares? And let’s see if kyler leads with him gone moving forward. That’s all that matters now.
 

Cheesebeef

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Yep. I just recently watched a replay of the Seattle game. Kyler drove them twice in the last 5 minutes into FG range & Prater missed both of them. Thank God he did, or MHJ wouldn’t have been available to us.
We also beat the Eagles when they blew a 21 point lead. And barely beat the Falcons when Trey made an incredible fingertip catch an inch off the ground off a ball that was horrifically under thrown, leading to a game-winning FG with no time left.

Giving Kyler credit for games he shoulda won without acknowledging games he coulda lost is silly. His record was what it was… 3-5. Which I was okay with considering the lack of talent and that the O looked decent.

But this year makes or breaks him, IMO.
 

bankybruce

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Sorry, we will disagree on the definition of rookies. The only time I consider a 2nd-year player not a rook is when they have to take a redshirt year, or close enough to it. Beej had a whole year, as did McBride before last year. Those count as rookie seasons, 100 percent.
Gaines is our only 2nd year rookie this year.
 

MadCardDisease

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Giving Kyler credit for games he shoulda won without acknowledging games he coulda lost is silly. His record was what it was… 3-5. Which I was okay with considering the lack of talent and that the O looked decent.

But this year makes or breaks him, IMO.

I agree that the Cardinals Record was what it was. I also agree that giving Kyler credit for games he should have won is probably a fool's errand. Football is a team sport and the Defense was pretty much being held together with rubber bands and bubble gum in the last third of the season. So putting everything (wins or losses) on Kyler, or even the offense as a whole, isn't really a good measuring stick. I think the Early part of 2024 will be a much better measuring stick with Kyler having a full offseason in this new offense and him being fully healthy.

It's definitely a big season moving forward with Kyler. 2025 has always been the first realistic season where the Cardinals could move off of Kylers contract if they chose to.
 

PACardsFan

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We also beat the Eagles when they blew a 21 point lead. And barely beat the Falcons when Trey made an incredible fingertip catch an inch off the ground off a ball that was horrifically under thrown, leading to a game-winning FG with no time left.

Giving Kyler credit for games he shoulda won without acknowledging games he coulda lost is silly. His record was what it was… 3-5. Which I was okay with considering the lack of talent and that the O looked decent.

But this year makes or breaks him, IMO.
For the record, the Eagles never had a 21 point lead. And the pass to Trey was designed to be under thrown, with Trey telling Kyler that he would make the play. Which he did. For me, all I wanted was to see Murray play well, which he did. But to be honest, I would have been happier had they lost the Eagles game. Losing MHJ would have killed me.
 

MadCardDisease

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