Kyler Murray entering Draft

[PACardsFan]

I would never criticize the Cardinals for the Rosen trade, but I also wouldn’t criticize them for drafting QB again.

 

[Mainstreet]

Can you imagine what our fans would have been screaming if the Cards didn’t take Rosen claiming they are looking to draft a qb in 2019. We would have moved up for any 4 of the qbs that would have been there.

Absolutely agree. It was the right move for the Cardinals to move up in the 2018 draft. I was happy the Cardinals selected Rosen. However, I'd be lying if I didn't say I have questions about him.

If this was a strong quarterback class I would draft another quarterback for sure. It's such an important position to get right.

With such differing opinions about quarterback maybe the safest thing is to trade down and build the rest of the team unless the Cardinals are sold on Murray.

 

[Dante]

Albert Breer on MMQB:

"If Murray goes first overall, it won’t have cost him in the draft process. But there are certainly questions out there from the people who have met with him about how much football he knows. His athleticism is unquestioned. He can pick stuff up. Yet he’s struggled some with teams on the board. That issue dovetailed with the fact that he didn’t have the rep for being a grinder in college that, by comparison, former teammate Baker Mayfield did. And there was his benching for the first few plays of the Baylor game last fall, a result of Murray being late for a couple 6 a.m. Friday walkthroughs. At other positions, of course, these sorts of things aren’t as big a deal. At quarterback, they usually merit some deeper digging. Maybe with school, and presumably baseball, out of the picture, you’ll get a different Murray. I haven’t heard his aptitude for learning the position questioned. But how much he knows has come up a bunch in my discussions with teams on the quarterbacks in this year’s class."

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/04/22/mock-draft-kyler-murray-arizona-cardinals-nick-bosa-dwayne-haskins

 

[Totally_Red]

Albert Breer on MMQB:

"If Murray goes first overall, it won’t have cost him in the draft process. But there are certainly questions out there from the people who have met with him about how much football he knows. His athleticism is unquestioned. He can pick stuff up. Yet he’s struggled some with teams on the board. That issue dovetailed with the fact that he didn’t have the rep for being a grinder in college that, by comparison, former teammate Baker Mayfield did. And there was his benching for the first few plays of the Baylor game last fall, a result of Murray being late for a couple 6 a.m. Friday walkthroughs. At other positions, of course, these sorts of things aren’t as big a deal. At quarterback, they usually merit some deeper digging. Maybe with school, and presumably baseball, out of the picture, you’ll get a different Murray. I haven’t heard his aptitude for learning the position questioned. But how much he knows has come up a bunch in my discussions with teams on the quarterbacks in this year’s class."

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/04/22/mock-draft-kyler-murray-arizona-cardinals-nick-bosa-dwayne-haskins

Baker Mayfield visited the Cardinals last year even though they had the 15th overall pick. Kyler Murray blew off the Redskins who have the 15th overall pick this draft.

 

[Chopper0080]

Albert Breer on MMQB:

"If Murray goes first overall, it won’t have cost him in the draft process. But there are certainly questions out there from the people who have met with him about how much football he knows. His athleticism is unquestioned. He can pick stuff up. Yet he’s struggled some with teams on the board. That issue dovetailed with the fact that he didn’t have the rep for being a grinder in college that, by comparison, former teammate Baker Mayfield did. And there was his benching for the first few plays of the Baylor game last fall, a result of Murray being late for a couple 6 a.m. Friday walkthroughs. At other positions, of course, these sorts of things aren’t as big a deal. At quarterback, they usually merit some deeper digging. Maybe with school, and presumably baseball, out of the picture, you’ll get a different Murray. I haven’t heard his aptitude for learning the position questioned. But how much he knows has come up a bunch in my discussions with teams on the quarterbacks in this year’s class."

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/04/22/mock-draft-kyler-murray-arizona-cardinals-nick-bosa-dwayne-haskins

The face of our franchise folks...when is the last time you heard a pro bowl QB who was "not a grinder"? Roethlisberger? Favre? Vick?

 

[Broseph]

Scott Mcglaughlin said on Doug and Wolf that Murray was the best player entering the draft that he saw .

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Why the Kyler Murray stanclub acts like there won't ever be a better QB prospect in the future?

That's not me at all. I absolutely believe that Trevor Lawrence will be the best QB prospect this decade.

I just don't believe we will be in position to draft him. We have had the #1 pick one time in 61 years. No one is trading Lawrence.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Scott Mcglaughlin said on Doug and Wolf that Murray was the best player entering the draft that he saw .

He was really definitive on it as well. Like it wasn't close

 

[PACardsFan]

That's not me at all. I absolutely believe that Trevor Lawrence will be the best QB prospect this decade.

I just don't believe we will be in position to draft him. We have had the #1 pick one time in 61 years. No one is trading Lawrence.

Exactly the point I've been trying to make for 2 months. When you have the overall #1 pick in the draft, you take the best QB available. Unless you already have an ironclad HOF QB in his prime already on your roster. We do not have that. We will not be in a position to get anywhere near Lawrence.

 

[dscher]

Albert Breer on MMQB:

"If Murray goes first overall, it won’t have cost him in the draft process. But there are certainly questions out there from the people who have met with him about how much football he knows. His athleticism is unquestioned. He can pick stuff up. Yet he’s struggled some with teams on the board. That issue dovetailed with the fact that he didn’t have the rep for being a grinder in college that, by comparison, former teammate Baker Mayfield did. And there was his benching for the first few plays of the Baylor game last fall, a result of Murray being late for a couple 6 a.m. Friday walkthroughs. At other positions, of course, these sorts of things aren’t as big a deal. At quarterback, they usually merit some deeper digging. Maybe with school, and presumably baseball, out of the picture, you’ll get a different Murray. I haven’t heard his aptitude for learning the position questioned. But how much he knows has come up a bunch in my discussions with teams on the quarterbacks in this year’s class."

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/04/22/mock-draft-kyler-murray-arizona-cardinals-nick-bosa-dwayne-haskins

Now these are legitimate question marks.. like all prospects have, of course. So it's just one piece to the huge crapshoot puzzle that is the NFL draft.

 

[dscher]

The face of our franchise folks...when is the last time you heard a pro bowl QB who was "not a grinder"? Roethlisberger? Favre? Vick?

This goes again to him needing the right fit. No one has questioned this. Imo. He is really that pick of this draft... It's all about fit. So the board stuff goes out the window if they are concepts he has never seen in his life. You think he will have issues with concepts on the whiteboard with KK? I do not.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Good ole JR was great on Bickley. He loves him some Kyler Murray

 

[cardncubfan]

Wonderlic test scores released for the QB's. Murray had a 20.

A well-researched article on Medium looked at quarterbacks only and determined there was a minor benefit at this position: "There seems to be a sort of smartness threshold, where the best NFL quarterbacks need to be at least this smart to see success. But once a QB passes that threshold (around a score of 25), their additional smartness has little to no effect on success on the field."

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nf...2019-nfl-draft-quarterbacks-leaked/ar-BBWbnHl

 

[Brian in Mesa]

Wonderlic test scores released for the QB's. Murray had a 20.

A well-researched article on Medium looked at quarterbacks only and determined there was a minor benefit at this position: "There seems to be a sort of smartness threshold, where the best NFL quarterbacks need to be at least this smart to see success. But once a QB passes that threshold (around a score of 25), their additional smartness has little to no effect on success on the field."

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nf...2019-nfl-draft-quarterbacks-leaked/ar-BBWbnHl

Just FYI:

Russell Wilson got a 28.

Josh Rosen got a 29.

 

[TJ]

Wonderlic test scores released for the QB's. Murray had a 20.

A well-researched article on Medium looked at quarterbacks only and determined there was a minor benefit at this position: "There seems to be a sort of smartness threshold, where the best NFL quarterbacks need to be at least this smart to see success. But once a QB passes that threshold (around a score of 25), their additional smartness has little to no effect on success on the field."

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nf...2019-nfl-draft-quarterbacks-leaked/ar-BBWbnHl

As if we needed more red flags and more obvious signals to stay away from Murray. 20 on the Wonderlic is pretty bad. For those who still discount Wonderlic results, there are very few successful QBs with a score of less than 25

 

[cardncubfan]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nf...higher-than-top-qb-draft-prospects/ar-BBWbr2H

 

[Chopper0080]

This goes again to him needing the right fit. No one has questioned this. Imo. He is really that pick of this draft... It's all about fit. So the board stuff goes out the window if they are concepts he has never seen in his life. You think he will have issues with concepts on the whiteboard with KK? I do not.

Fit has nothing to do with being a "grinder". You can be a perfect fit and still not put enough work in to adjust to being an NFL QB.

 

[Dr. Jones]

As if we needed more red flags and more obvious signals to stay away from Murray. 20 on the Wonderlic is pretty bad. For those who still discount Wonderlic results, there are very few successful QBs with a score of less than 25

What is the average score for the Wonderlic test?
According to Wonderlic Inc. the average score for the test is 20 out of a possible 50.

https://wonderlictestsample.com/wonderlic-test-scoring/

 

[TJ]

https://wonderlictestsample.com/wonderlic-test-scoring/

That accounts for all positions, not just QBs, and QBs account for a small fraction of NFL prospects. I don't care what my left guard or my DT scores. I need my QB to have good study habits and to be able to comprehend a complex playbook. That's why few QBs who are successful in the NFL score under a 25. It's especially concerning when you know the Wonderlic is coming and have the ability to study and take practice tests with your agents prior to the combine.

I've taken the Wonderlic before (scored a 33, if anyone cares). I can say while still an inexact science, it does test processing and fluency.

 

[AZCrazy]

Dan Marino is the only QB I can remember who was an extraordinary QB while having a crappy Wonderlic.
20 isn't terrible, not great. It does however happen to be the lowest score of all quarterbacks tested this year. FWIW.

 

[dscher]

Fit has nothing to do with being a "grinder". You can be a perfect fit and still not put enough work in to adjust to being an NFL QB.

You can equally be a "grinder" and not be able to adjust to the NFL. I'm just saying.. it's only one piece to the puzzle. Imo

 

[Dr. Jones]

That accounts for all positions, not just QBs, and QBs account for a small fraction of NFL prospects. I don't care what my left guard or my DT scores. I need my QB to have good study habits and to be able to comprehend a complex playbook. That's why few QBs who are successful in the NFL score under a 25. It's especially concerning when you know the Wonderlic is coming and have the ability to study and take practice tests with your agents prior to the combine.

I've taken the Wonderlic before (scored a 33, if anyone cares). I can say while still an inexact science, does test processing and fluency.

Jim Kelly
Dan Marino
Steve McNair
Donovan McNabb
Terry Bradshaw
Randall Cunningham

All with scores below 17.

Vick has a higher score than Jim Kelly. C'mon with this stuff man.

https://wonderlictestsample.com/nfl-wonderlic-scores/

 

[Dr. Jones]

https://thebiglead.com/2018/03/31/t...-all-in-predicting-qb-performance-in-the-nfl/

The Wonderlic Does Not Matter In Predicting QB Performance in the NFL

This week was “let’s leak the QB Wonderlic scores” time in the NFL. So it’s now that I must remind you that it doesn’t matter in predicting who will be a bust and who will not. In fact, you can make a pretty good argument that knowing the Wonderlic and reacting to it could lead to worse decisions at the position.

 

[TJ]

the n

Jim Kelly
Dan Marino
Steve McNair
Donovan McNabb
Terry Bradshaw
Randall Cunningham

All with scores below 17.

Vick has a higher score than Jim Kelly. C'mon with this stuff man.

https://wonderlictestsample.com/nfl-wonderlic-scores/

How many of those guys were drafted in this Millennium?

Like with everything, Murray-stans are banking on outliers, not the norm, to forecast Murray's success. If Murray were to succeed in the NFL with all of these glaring red flags, kudos to him. But the great risk is not worth the #1 pick. Let someone else assume the risk.

 

[dscher]

the n
How many of those guys were drafted in this Millennium?

Like with everything, Murray-stans are banking on outliers, not the norm, to forecast Murray's success. If Murray were to succeed in the NFL with all of these glaring red flags, kudos to him. But the great risk is not worth the #1 pick. Let someone else assume the risk.

The norm is always changing... Its like guys I get into debates with at work about the championship teams of the 70s and 80s matching up against the Patriots/Chiefs/Rams/Saints of today. It would be a bloodbath..imo. That's due to change. The norm is never the norm. It's an illusion.. the game is always changing to some degree. Imo . I guess it just depends on what side of the fence you're on, is all...