Jets Get Third Overall Pick

[Chopper0080]

Good stuff schutd. I totally agree with you. At one time I thought the Cards should do whatever to move up and get one of the top 4. Not anymore. We have 4 picks in the top 100, one can be a qb to develop while the other 3 can be solid players to fill positions of need.

Because we have such a great history in developing QBs. It is a nice idea, but we are betting the Cardinals doing something they have never had success doing

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[Southpaw]

Totally agree, but who's trading out?

Do Browns give up #1 and keep #4 or vice versa? Are the Giants serious about not wanting a QBOTF at #2? The Jets at #3 and Broncos at #5 are in the QB market. Are teams fine with Jackson or Rudolph if they get value to move back?

The draft setup is really intriguing at the moment and I'm not counting Buffalo out.

Colts could trade down again.

 

[Chopper0080]

This is the result of being reactive vs proactive. We can gripe about the cost of moving up for or acquiring a QB, and then never getting one. It's like complaining about the cost of gas.

And regarding the QB class. Rosen is the same level prospect as Goff. Darnold same as Wentz. Allen and Mayfield have solid first round grades. This board sounds like the dude who gets dumped and she wasn't that hot in the first place.

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[Chopper0080]

Colts could trade down again.

I think the idea of Quenton Nelson will be tough to pass up.

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[GimmedaBall]

I know the Pats struck gold with Brady.... But they have been competitive every year drafting at the tail end.....

No team has ever changed it's fortune, giving up everything to draft a few spots ahead... Hopefully Sk knows his history.

Stand still and take the BPA... These are not the QB's we're looking for.

Of course teams have changed their fortune by trading a boatload of picks to move up. Changed it in the exact opposite direction of what they hoped to achieve. LOL.

The QBs in this draft are average to slightly above---their clones will be available next year or will be camp cuts later this year.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

If the Cardinals like a QB and and he is available at #15, draft him there and not chance moving around and lose him.

+1

 

[Solar7]

This is the result of being reactive vs proactive. We can gripe about the cost of moving up for or acquiring a QB, and then never getting one. It's like complaining about the cost of gas.

And regarding the QB class. Rosen is the same level prospect as Goff. Darnold same as Wentz. Allen and Mayfield have solid first round grades. This board sounds like the dude who gets dumped and she wasn't that hot in the first place.

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And I see the people who want to trade up at this point as the guy who is going to pay $3,000 for his limo and prom date with the head cheerleader when she's just going to make the night terrible for you anyways. At least you can say you went with the head cheerleader, but you could have gone with the lesser girl, saved some money, and probably gotten laid.

 

[BW52]

Well-researched article from 2017 critical of making the big trade moves up for a Quarterback:

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/...und-quarterback-is-generally-a-terrible-idea/

Written after the first season of Goff and Wentz---perhaps too early to draw a conclusion on those two this early in their career. Defenses have a way of catching up to the new guy and dissecting his game after they get some game film on the guy.

Short article with quick summary chart of ten years (2016):
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...ng-up-to-draft-qb-hasnt-worked-well-for-teams

Let's not forget the trade where the 1988 Cards gave up the their draft slot to the Chargers who took no. 2 overall pick (Ryan Leaf) Cardinals took no. 3 pick (Andre Wadsworth), 1998 no. 33 pick (Corey Chavous), 1999 no. 8 pick (David Boston), Eric Metcalf, and Patrick Sapp

https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2017/10/26/16550408/carson-wentz-jared-goff-quarterback-draft-trades

Portal page to "Draft Pick Transactions" going back to 1936 (gee, I don't feel so old now) Bookmark this page to bolster your arguments or to keep from losing one:

https://www.prosportstransactions.com/football/DraftTrades/Years/

Thanks for the link.

 

[BW52]

IMHO the Cards will go BPA (hoping its a area of need) because Cards need whoever is the Cards top pick will be likely needed to come in a be a starter or at least big contributor this season.Same with several draft picks this season.I doubt Cards will get a 1st round QBOF just to have a guy mostly 3rd QB and hold clipboard.Several picks need to help the team this season instead of down the road.I can see a mid roundQB to develop but the other picks must contribute this season.

 

[Chopper0080]

And I see the people who want to trade up at this point as the guy who is going to pay $3,000 for his limo and prom date with the head cheerleader when she's just going to make the night terrible for you anyways. At least you can say you went with the head cheerleader, but you could have gone with the lesser girl, saved some money, and probably gotten laid.

I have always had success when I have overpaid to get the top end of something that was a necessity. At this point the Cards are stuck. But, if you make a king's offer 30 days ago, Cleveland might have given up the #1 pick.

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[Chopper0080]

IMHO the Cards will go BPA (hoping its a area of need) because Cards need whoever is the Cards top pick will be likely needed to come in a be a starter or at least big contributor this season.Same with several draft picks this season.I doubt Cards will get a 1st round QBOF just to have a guy mostly 3rd QB and hold clipboard.Several picks need to help the team this season instead of down the road.I can see a mid roundQB to develop but the other picks must contribute this season.

At this rate, you might as well give up on drafting a QB at all. Maybe in round 3. We probably should consider taking a CB so we can trade Patrick Peterson for the top pick next year.

Vita Vea in rnd 1 and James Daniels in rnd 2 looking likely.

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[HGC]

I have always had success when I have overpaid to get the top end of something that was a necessity. At this point the Cards are stuck. But, if you make a king's offer 30 days ago, Cleveland might have given up the #1 pick.

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Just out of curiosity what's the kings ransom that gets John Dorsey to settle for the 4th best qb?

 

[GimmedaBall]

The more teams that want to leapfrog ahead in the draft for an average QB, the more top players get pushed down the draft order.

We should be excited about the value we are going to get at #15 with 4-5-or 6 QBs going before we pick. We might get the #1 guy at his position while other teams are giving up picks for the clipboard holder QBOTF.

 

[Minski]

I’m worried we are just kicking the can down the road until we have a top 5 pick, which might not be for a while.

This year has a unusually high number of potential QBOTFs would be silly not to address it this year.

 

[Jetstream Green]

No, Warner and Palmer were top-notch QBs that the Cards helped back to the top; with Bradford, he'd have to get to the top in the first place. Not comparable at all.

Tis' ye cavalier message I take jest good sir... because I used the word 'unthinkable'

 

[JeffGollin]

Price to move up doesn't mesh with Cards' needs to add talent.

What I think we're seeing is S Keim manoevering to fill enough holes so as not to let need determine our draft strategy.

Only obstacle to this, right now, is WR, but I think even this was a calculated risk by Steve that WR spots were easier ti fill than was the OL

 

[oaken1]

And I see the people who want to trade up at this point as the guy who is going to pay $3,000 for his limo and prom date with the head cheerleader when she's just going to make the night terrible for you anyways. At least you can say you went with the head cheerleader, but you could have gone with the lesser girl, saved some money, and probably gotten laid.

lol.... its obvious you never dated the head cheerleader....

 

[TheCardFan]

I’m worried we are just kicking the can down the road until we have a top 5 pick, which might not be for a while.

This year has a unusually high number of potential QBOTFs would be silly not to address it this year.

No matter what, it's still a huge gamble. Of those 5 QB's in 2018, odds are that only 1 will become a franchise QB (at best). If you don't use the #1 pick on a QB, history is not kind to 1st Rd QB's. 2004 (3/4) was the exception and so might be 2016 (2/3) and 2017 (3/3). 4 franchise QB's in round 1 has never happened.

 

[oaken1]

No matter what, it's still a huge gamble. Of those 5 QB's in 2018, odds are that only 1 will become a franchise QB (at best). If you don't use the #1 pick on a QB, history is not kind to 1st Rd QB's. 2004 (3/4) was the exception and so might be 2016 (2/3) and 2017 (3/3). 4 franchise QB's in round 1 has never happened.

thats why everyone has been anticipating this draft class. could possibly be six franchise type guys in this class... and though there is no way to prove it, there may be a couple of hall of fame guys come out of this class if things go right for them. It isnt one of those draft classes in which there is "That guy" then "everyone else"

its very possible that 20 years from now folks look back on Lamar Jackson as the "Randall Cunningham" of his generation...and Lamar is the 5th/6th rated QB in this draft. Right now he is considered Mike Vick 2.0... but with some pro coaching he can go from a running QB with a hell of a cannon,... to a pocket passer who will hurt you badly if you dont keep a spy on him.

then a guy like Mayfield...polarizing. But he walked on,...and started, for two major colleges... the dude is smaller but he has a chip on his shoulder the size of mt rushmore...
go ahead, compare him to drew brees... they bring the same skillsets to the table...accuracy and cerebral play... when you combine those skills with the aforementioned chip...the possibilities are endless.
but...maturity!!!...yeah,... he is a football player, most of them are immature. Manning teabagged a doctor...and Brett Favre got busted sending dick picks to team secretaries..at 40... not 25,...40... then Big Ben and his run ins with the word "no"... none of that stopped any of them from winning super bowls and Mayfield has never had any issues as bad as any of those.


Both of those guys have legit chances to be full on studs in the NFL.....and they aint even in the top 3 of the QB's in this draft.

 

[Stout]

I’m worried we are just kicking the can down the road until we have a top 5 pick, which might not be for a while.

This year has a unusually high number of potential QBOTFs would be silly not to address it this year.

The way we're heading at the QB position, it will be sooner rather than later.

 

[Buckybird]

The way we're heading at the QB position, it will be sooner rather than later.

I’ve been hearing that for decades

You’re never going to find a long term franchise QB when you’re scared to draft him, especially in Rd 1

 

[Cheesebeef]

No, Warner and Palmer were top-notch QBs that the Cards helped back to the top; with Bradford, he'd have to get to the top in the first place. Not comparable at all.

Yup.

 

[TheCardFan]

I’ve been hearing that for decades

You’re never going to find a long term franchise QB when you’re scared to draft him, especially in Rd 1

Name a 1st rd QB the Cardinals passed on in the last 20+ years that turned into a franchise player.

Answer: There were only 2 times in 20 years this happened.

2005 - Aaron Rodgers
2004 - We drafted Fitz instead of Rivers or Big Ben.

Other than that, we haven't missed (except when we drafted a QB in the top 10 - Matt Leinart). We also dodged a bullet by trading down with San Diego and not drafting Ryan Leaf.

I wouldn't call that scared...I would call that smart.

Trading up is a different conversation and much more risky.

 

[b8rtm8nn]

As long as we have a starting caliber QB - I could care less if we trade, draft or bring in a free agent.

 

[gbrim21]

Name a 1st rd QB the Cardinals passed on in the last 20+ years that turned into a franchise player.

Answer: There were only 2 times in 20 years this happened.

2005 - Aaron Rodgers
2004 - We drafted Fitz instead of Rivers or Big Ben.

Other than that, we haven't missed (except when we drafted a QB in the top 10 - Matt Leinart). We also dodged a bullet by trading down with San Diego and not drafting Ryan Leaf.

I wouldn't call that scared...I would call that smart.

Trading up is a different conversation and much more risky.

Derek Carr, although admittedly at the time I didn't think Carr would be any good either.

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