Hornets @ Suns Sunday game thread 1-12-20

[1Sun]

Incidentally, especially if you observe what's going on in Tucson right now, as well as our season last year, you need to understand that Ayton has never, ever had real coaching...until Monty. This is a long term project and a lot to overcome.

 

[elindholm]

He measured a 43.5 inch vertical at McHale in college. Dont think that is the problem.

Well then I don't know. I forgot to mention in the earlier post, but almost every jump shot is short, like he isn't engaging his legs. Obviously he's plenty strong to get the ball to the basket, but the fluidity I remember seeing in his college highlight videos no longer seems to be in evidence.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Excellent point coming from a guy who can't go five seconds without saying 'Ayton sucks' when he clearly doesn't.

Dude there are likely equal amounts of fans frustrated with Ayton. You clearly can’t see beyond your uarizona lenses.

 

[Phrazbit]

Well then I don't know. I forgot to mention in the earlier post, but almost every jump shot is short, like he isn't engaging his legs. Obviously he's plenty strong to get the ball to the basket, but the fluidity I remember seeing in his college highlight videos no longer seems to be in evidence.

I think he is rushing everything on offense. The ".5 second" thing isn't clicking for him and it's like he is playing hot potato.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Ayton is closing games and that is a much bigger sign of trust than starting. If they had lost trust in him (which it sounds like you are suggesting) than why are they trusting him to help bring home wins at the end of the game?

So why the benching? That’s a universal message of coaches.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I think he is rushing everything on offense. The ".5 second" thing isn't clicking for him and it's like he is playing hot potato.

Hmm. Interesting idea.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Shaq would be closer to a Drummond, Gobert, or prime DAJ than what he was in today's game. Zone defenses, refs swallowing their whistles on post-ups, and most notably the metrics pointing out the inefficiency of such a strategy have neutralized traditional post players.

Not buying it. We have watched team after team destroy us in the paint. If Ayton could play the way we wanted him to (a) he would create points and gravity of opportunity for others. And he’d get other centers sitting with fouls.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Go ask any NBA general manager about the efficiency of a back to the basket post up play when the offensive player is a limited ball handler/passer.

Based on his skill set, it's an easier road for Ayton to become more of a shooter than a post player.

Then he was a stupid draft pick.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Ayton was a huge presence in the fourth both on offense and defense. We are starting to get a glimpse.

Missed this game happy to hear it.

 

[GatorAZ]

He measured a 43.5 inch vertical at McHale in college. Dont think that is the problem.

No he didn’t. It was a running start.

 

[1Sun]

Then he was a stupid draft pick.

No, the stupid draft pick was Cam Johnson.

Ayton might not end up being worthy of the #1 pick, but the worst case scenario I see for Ayton is solid starter.

Cam will be out of the league in 3 years, if not sooner.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

No he didn’t. It was a running start.

Max vert is measured with a running start.

 

[GatorAZ]

Max vert is measured with a running start.

And two feet. Ayton went off one after a running start. There was nothing official about it.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

And two feet. Ayton went off one after a running start. There was nothing official about it.

You can jump off one foot at the combine, but you do only get so much space for a running start.

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[GatorAZ]

You can jump off one foot at the combine, but you do only get so much space for a running start.

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That’s a different type of combine not associated with the NBA. The NBA Combine max vert is off two feet.

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[CardsSunsDbacks]

That’s a different type of combine not associated with the NBA. The NBA Combine max vert is off two feet.

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All that video proves is how Connaughton prefers to jump. Some guys leap better off one foot and some better off two feet. I would guess Connaughton simply jumps better off of two.

Actually here is a breakdown of the vertical jump test that is used at the combine.

https://www.topendsports.com/testing/tests/jump-max-touch.htm

 

[Covert Rain]

In that particular game (the one that was followed by the "buying in" line), it was Baynes that got glued to the bench in the 2nd half. And even with Ayton not starting, he is still getting the starter's share of the minutes.

IMO the "starting" situation is being over analyzed. I think Monty is trying to get back the chemistry the team had the first 10 games, before people got banged up, and this is the starting line that we featured.

I don't think it's a chemistry thing as much as a message thing. Notice how Ayton got more playing time than Baynes and also was depended on down the stretch. If it was about chemistry or really who is starting that wouldn't happen. This was simply a message type thing to a young player who is struggling with the light bulb coming on. It's a you have to earn your starting position back type message IMO. Monty is trying to light that fire.

Having said that Ayton did show some grit last night. Some of his dunks were with authority. Something he needs to do more often. He still took some really bad, flat footed jumpers but he also fought to post up multiple times last night. I don't remember him doing as much as he did last night. Someone is in his ear or the move to the bench is having an impact.

 

[mjb21aztd]

Atleast suns beat a few bad teams on homestand

Thought ayton had a good gm was a presence on def and got some clutch boards

Very good team win considering booker didn't do much

Go suns vs hawks!!!

I like ayton coming off bench give him more motivation to perform

 

[Bufalay]

Go ask any NBA general manager about the efficiency of a back to the basket post up play when the offensive player is a limited ball handler/passer.

Based on his skill set, it's an easier road for Ayton to become more of a shooter than a post player.

I just got off the phone with Daryl Morey. He said he would trade James harden and five future first round picks for prime Shaq.

 

[Covert Rain]

I just got off the phone with Daryl Morey. He said he would trade James harden and five future first round picks for prime Shaq.

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[Mainstreet]

Gina Mizell‏Verified account @ginamizell


Per the #Suns’ postgame notes, this is the first time Phoenix has held consecutive opponents to 94 points or less since the 2016-17 season (Charlotte scored 92 and Orlando scored 94).

9:31 PM - 12 Jan 2020

 

[Mainstreet]

Gina Mizell‏Verified account @ginamizell

When asked about the Rubio-Booker-Oubre-Bridges-Ayton closing lineup, Ayton whispered, "That's deadly." #Suns

9:05 PM - 12 Jan 2020

 

[1Sun]

Gina Mizell‏Verified account @ginamizell


Per the #Suns’ postgame notes, this is the first time Phoenix has held consecutive opponents to 94 points or less since the 2016-17 season (Charlotte scored 92 and Orlando scored 94).

9:31 PM - 12 Jan 2020

Of course, these are two of the worst offensive teams they have played since the 2016-17 season, and one was missing three of its five best players.

 

[Mainstreet]

Dwayne Bacon went for 24 points against the Suns but he averages 6.6 points and has a PER of 7.65.

https://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/3907821/dwayne-bacon

 

[1Sun]

Gina Mizell‏Verified account @ginamizell

When asked about the Rubio-Booker-Oubre-Bridges-Ayton closing lineup, Ayton whispered, "That's deadly." #Suns

9:05 PM - 12 Jan 2020

Any particular reason it isn't the STARTING line-up???