Doctor Who

[D-Dogg]

Ok, so we are catching up on Season 7, just a few episodes in.

I absolutely, positively, completely adore Amy Pond. I really have nothing much more to say than she is awesome.

Some very good episodes in the Matt Smith era. Looking forward to seeing how he goes out and wondering how the new incarnation will carry forth from Tennant/Smith.

 

[Covert Rain]

Not to thrilled about the casting choice for the new Doctor but we shall see. It took a long time for Matt Smith to grow on me. Still not my favorite but I enjoyed his run.

 

[D-Dogg]

Goodbye, Ponds.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Well, I like the new Doctor. And I liked the first episode of series 8. Nice start.

Steve

 

[Stout]

Well, I like the new Doctor. And I liked the first episode of series 8. Nice start.

Steve

Me too. Only one bit I didn't like.

Spoiler

The phone call sucked. Such a terrible, cop out bit of writing. She didn't think he was her doctor. Either let her figure it out or give the character credit and let her carry on. No, instead, she's given the free pass with a time-warp phone call. Lame.

 

[D-Dogg]

Good episode. Enjoyed it a lot.

Hey, curious...are Jenny and Vastra married?

 

[AzStevenCal]

Good episode. Enjoyed it a lot.

Hey, curious...are Jenny and Vastra married?

The lengths some people will go to in order to get a good maid.

Steve

 

[Covert Rain]

I was disappointed in the opener. The episode was very inconsistent and all over the place. One of the chief complaints last season as well by many fans. This episode also did nothing in terms of changing my mind about Peter Capaldi but I felt the same way about Matt Smith. He might just take some time to grow on me.

 

[HerefortheCards]

So Netflix has made me a Whovian and I'm almost caught up. Today I watched "Angels take Manhattan," and I have to say I was actually pissed for the first time in 7 seasons.

 

[Covert Rain]

Dear Lord. This season is shaping up to be a bummer. Seriously? The Daleks are usually considered a highlight of the season when they bring them out. This was incredibly ho hum. Also, Peter Capaldi's version of the Doctor is supposed to be darker but WTH? This version of the Doctor is coming of as a cranky, heartless and empty shell of the previous Doctors.

It took me a while to get used to Matt Smith after the brilliant David Tennant run but at least I had seen some potential in Matt Smith. The only highlight after this horrible start to the new season has been Jenna Coleman. I don't know if it's Peter Capaldi and his portrayal that is bothering me more or the continued uneven of a mess in writing (continuing from last season) that is bother me. Maybe it's both.

 

[Stout]

And I thought it was another fun episode and a strong opening to the season. I like Capaldi, and love how it ended up with the Dalek.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Dear Lord. This season is shaping up to be a bummer. Seriously? The Daleks are usually considered a highlight of the season when they bring them out. This was incredibly ho hum. Also, Peter Capaldi's version of the Doctor is supposed to be darker but WTH? This version of the Doctor is coming of as a cranky, heartless and empty shell of the previous Doctors.

It took me a while to get used to Matt Smith after the brilliant David Tennant run but at least I had seen some potential in Matt Smith. The only highlight after this horrible start to the new season has been Jenna Coleman. I don't know if it's Peter Capaldi and his portrayal that is bothering me more or the continued uneven of a mess in writing (continuing from last season) that is bother me. Maybe it's both.

And I thought it was another fun episode and a strong opening to the season. I like Capaldi, and love how it ended up with the Dalek.

I did too. I'll admit to feeling a bit disappointed at one point of the episode but that was mostly because the opening had raised my expectations for a different kind of show. But once we settled into the meat of the story I thought it was typically strong.

And I didn't find Capaldi to be a "cranky, heartless and empty shell" of previous Doctors either. He's still finding himself but it's clear he has a moral center even if he's having trouble discovering its boundaries. But then, I don't find the previous season(s) to be an uneven mess in writing. At least no more so than most TV Series, even the great ones. There are ups and downs to Doctor Who but, for me, they are consistent with its past.

Steve

 

[Covert Rain]

I did too. I'll admit to feeling a bit disappointed at one point of the episode but that was mostly because the opening had raised my expectations for a different kind of show. But once we settled into the meat of the story I thought it was typically strong.

And I didn't find Capaldi to be a "cranky, heartless and empty shell" of previous Doctors either. He's still finding himself but it's clear he has a moral center even if he's having trouble discovering its boundaries. But then, I don't find the previous season(s) to be an uneven mess in writing. At least no more so than most TV Series, even the great ones. There are ups and downs to Doctor Who but, for me, they are consistent with its past.

Steve

To be clear the uneven writing mess was the last season. If you go to many of the Doctor Who forums I am not alone in feeling like Steven Moffat made a mess of the last season with Matt Smith with some episodes being downright schizophrenic. That's the mess I was referring too. Many fans were not happy with Moffat last season and I was one of them. That's a hard pill to swallow and frankly I don't get it because Moffat's episodes were some of my favorites when the show was under Russell T Davies.

There was much speculation in the British Press that is one of the reasons for Matt Smith's abrupt departure from a show in which he previously stated he could play the part forever.

There have been good episodes and literally some of the worst written in the new iteration of Doctor who last season. Many of the episodes would start out with a strong premise and take a dive by episodes end. This season so far feels EXACTLY the same. That has been the biggest knock about Moffat running the show. Again, It surprises me because I was a huge fan of Moffat's penned episodes of the previous seasons.

The opener was horrible. No character development, incoherent flow of the story...abrupt wrap up at the end. Again, the episode had huge potential with the Robotic character and the premise and it ended with a thud. The second episode was slightly better but he turned a Dalek episode into a regular ho hum episode versus the event that it's been in past seasons. Also...again...massively quick wrap up at the end.

The Doctor's reaction to the soldiers death was not "Doctor" like. You would have never seen that under DT or MS run at the Doctor. There is Dark and there is downright dickishness. It was the latter. It's still early but he does seem a "shell" when comparing to the last 2 iterations. I know it's still early but it's off to a below average start for me.

I am a huge fan of the show and have seen every season available (some early episodes lost) and I get that every actor brings something different. I just don't like what I am seeing one bit so far out of Peter Capaldi or Moffat again this season. Maybe he just needs to concentrate on writing and not running the show. It's sort of like when good coaches all of the sudden can't coach because they are wearing the GM hat. It's just incredibly uneven right now but I will watch because I love Doctor Who. Capaldi might grown on me as Smith did...he is just my least favorite out of the gate so far.

 

[AzStevenCal]

To be clear the uneven writing mess was the last season. If you go to many of the Doctor Who forums I am not alone in feeling like Steven Moffat made a mess of the last season with Matt Smith with some episodes being downright schizophrenic. That's the mess I was referring too. Many fans were not happy with Moffat last season and I was one of them. That's a hard pill to swallow and frankly I don't get it because Moffat's episodes were some of my favorites when the show was under Russell T Davies.

There was much speculation in the British Press that is one of the reasons for Matt Smith's abrupt departure from a show in which he previously stated he could play the part forever.

There have been good episodes and literally some of the worst written in the new iteration of Doctor who last season. Many of the episodes would start out with a strong premise and take a dive by episodes end. This season so far feels EXACTLY the same. That has been the biggest knock about Moffat running the show. Again, It surprises me because I was a huge fan of Moffat's penned episodes of the previous seasons.

The opener was horrible. No character development, incoherent flow of the story...abrupt wrap up at the end. Again, the episode had huge potential with the Robotic character and the premise and it ended with a thud. The second episode was slightly better but he turned a Dalek episode into a regular ho hum episode versus the event that it's been in past seasons. Also...again...massively quick wrap up at the end.

The Doctor's reaction to the soldiers death was not "Doctor" like. You would have never seen that under DT or MS run at the Doctor. There is Dark and there is downright dickishness. It was the latter. It's still early but he does seem a "shell" when comparing to the last 2 iterations. I know it's still early but it's off to a below average start for me.

I am a huge fan of the show and have seen every season available (some early episodes lost) and I get that every actor brings something different. I just don't like what I am seeing one bit so far out of Peter Capaldi or Moffat again this season. Maybe he just needs to concentrate on writing and not running the show. It's sort of like when good coaches all of the sudden can't coach because they are wearing the GM hat. It's just incredibly uneven right now but I will watch because I love Doctor Who. Capaldi might grown on me as Smith did...he is just my least favorite out of the gate so far.

And on those very same forums you'll find similar complaints to the Davies era. Maybe there have been more, I'm not sure. The only one I read regularly is Gallifrey Base although I'm a member on several of them. Personally, I liked the last season quite a bit. IMO, the series has always been uneven. But I can't lay claim to being a lifelong Who fan. I have watched some episodes of each of the Doctors (unless you count Cushing's Doctor) but I never appreciated them like I have the 2005 reincarnation.

As for me, right now, and how I'd rank the new doctors out of the gate, it's Eccleston, Smith, Capaldi and then Tennant. But longterm, Tennant is by far my favorite and I like them all.

Steve

 

[Covert Rain]

As for me, right now, and how I'd rank the new doctors out of the gate, it's Eccleston, Smith, Capaldi and then Tennant. But longterm, Tennant is by far my favorite and I like them all.

Steve

For me it's:
Tennant
Eccleston
Smith
Capaldi

In that order. Eccleston being done so quickly really irked me though. I thought he had so much more to offer but that led to Tennant so I can't complain.

What about the companions?

 

[AzStevenCal]

For me it's:
Tennant
Eccleston
Smith
Capaldi

In that order. Eccleston being done so quickly really irked me though. I thought he had so much more to offer but that led to Tennant so I can't complain.

What about the companions?

I am in the early stage of a series re-watch and my answer today is probably different than it was a couple of weeks ago when I had just finished re-watching the Matt Smith era. Right now, I'd rate the companions this way:

Clara Oswin Oswald
Rose Tyler
Amelia Pond
Martha Jones
Rory Pond (Williams)
Mickey Ricky Smith
Donna Noble

I might change that order again after I've watched the whole thing one more time. I know I appreciate Rose more while I'm watching the early episodes than I do later on when she makes her sporadic re-appearances. I also think I'm holding Donna's mom against her in this ranking and not holding Martha's family against her which probably isn't fair.

I liked Sarah-Jane Smith a lot but I really know her better as a former companion than I do her original character. I saw a few episodes back in the 70's with her and Tom Baker, the first Doctor Who that I watched while the show was currently airing. She was the best part of the show. I had hoped that Jenna would become her equal as a companion but I get the feeling they are going to make her less capable and effectively more vulnerable.

Steve

 

[Covert Rain]

I am in the early stage of a series re-watch and my answer today is probably different than it was a couple of weeks ago when I had just finished re-watching the Matt Smith era. Right now, I'd rate the companions this way:

Clara Oswin Oswald
Rose Tyler
Amelia Pond
Martha Jones
Rory Pond (Williams)
Mickey Ricky Smith
Donna Noble

I might change that order again after I've watched the whole thing one more time. I know I appreciate Rose more while I'm watching the early episodes than I do later on when she makes her sporadic re-appearances. I also think I'm holding Donna's mom against her in this ranking and not holding Martha's family against her which probably isn't fair.

I liked Sarah-Jane Smith a lot but I really know her better as a former companion than I do her original character. I saw a few episodes back in the 70's with her and Tom Baker, the first Doctor Who that I watched while the show was currently airing. She was the best part of the show. I had hoped that Jenna would become her equal as a companion but I get the feeling they are going to make her less capable and effectively more vulnerable.

Steve

In terms of Tom Baker, if we were including original Doctors he would be up there as #1 or #2 in my list above. When he did a cameo on The Day of the Doctors that was awesome. But keeping with current run I like for the most part your order. Mine is similar but probably Clara and Amelia Pond are 2A and 2B for me but it's hard because Clara is not done with her run just yet.

Rose Tyler
Clara Oswin Oswald
Amelia Pond
Martha Jones
Rory Pond (Williams)
Mickey Ricky Smith
Donna Noble

 

[D-Dogg]

I love Amy. The Ponds together are awesome.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I love Amy. The Ponds together are awesome.

Rory grew on me. I really detested his character early on, just too weak. But from his "hey look at me, I'm a Roman" episode and onward, I started feeling better about him. If it hadn't been for all the times that he lectured the Doctor about the risks he was getting Amy to take, I'd have moved him much higher. If you're not smart enough to recognize there are risks in something like this, that's on you not the Doctor IMO.

Steve

 

[Covert Rain]

I love Amy. The Ponds together are awesome.

Rory grew on me. I really detested his character early on, just too weak. But from his "hey look at me, I'm a Roman" episode and onward, I started feeling better about him. If it hadn't been for all the times that he lectured the Doctor about the risks he was getting Amy to take, I'd have moved him much higher. If you're not smart enough to recognize there are risks in something like this, that's on you not the Doctor IMO.

Steve

I think the only reason I have Rory and Mickey below Martha Jones is because they were really not the "main" companions in both cases. Truth be told I was never a fan of Martha Jones or Donna's characters.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I think the only reason I have Rory and Mickey below Martha Jones is because they were really not the "main" companions in both cases. Truth be told I was never a fan of Martha Jones or Donna's characters.

I liked Martha the character although I was disappointed by several of the episodes during that stretch. Mostly because I disliked her family so much but the episodes themselves were among the weaker in the series IMO.

Steve

 

[Covert Rain]

I liked Martha the character although I was disappointed by several of the episodes during that stretch. Mostly because I disliked her family so much but the episodes themselves were among the weaker in the series IMO.

Steve

My biggest problem was the ridiculously forced love story sub-plot of her character. It never felt natural and by the time she leaves it was more or less I don't like being second fiddle...goodbye. Not to mention she was incredibly whiny on some episodes.

The only thing I really like about her was that at times she could be very in your face and strong willed which I did appreciate versus having someone tagging along always falling down and needing saving.

 

[AzStevenCal]

My biggest problem was the ridiculously forced love story sub-plot of her character. It never felt natural and by the time she leaves it was more or less I don't like being second fiddle...goodbye. Not to mention she was incredibly whiny on some episodes.

The only thing I really like about her was that at times she could be very in your face and strong willed which I did appreciate versus having someone tagging along always falling down and needing saving.

I didn't have a problem with it. Doctor Tennant was always a little flirty and I could see her misreading the signs in that first episode (to the moon, Martha). It was quick but my wife and I fell in love (sort of) even quicker and we've been married 41 years now.

I also didn't find her particularly whiny but I might have paid less attention to it as she came in on the heels of Donna, Whiner of the Year. I thought she brought skills and an attitude to the companion role that are always welcome. I like it when the Doctor and the Companion are nearer to equals than not. My problem with her had more to do with her acting skill. She seemed weak at times although the dialogue was pretty corny in several of those episodes so maybe it was less her than the writing?

Steve

 

[Covert Rain]

I didn't have a problem with it. Doctor Tennant was always a little flirty and I could see her misreading the signs in that first episode (to the moon, Martha). It was quick but my wife and I fell in love (sort of) even quicker and we've been married 41 years now.

I also didn't find her particularly whiny but I might have paid less attention to it as she came in on the heels of Donna, Whiner of the Year. I thought she brought skills and an attitude to the companion role that are always welcome. I like it when the Doctor and the Companion are nearer to equals than not. My problem with her had more to do with her acting skill. She seemed weak at times although the dialogue was pretty corny in several of those episodes so maybe it was less her than the writing?

Steve

That similar scenario played out with Rose. If you go back and watch how the two of them sort of became fond of each other it feels completely organic. If you go back and watch that relationship unfold and compare that to Martha it feels totally forced. It was almost as if...well we lost Rose and we want that component so here you go.

You might be write that it had more to do with the writing versus the actress. To be honest, when she guest appeared later in the show I liked her guest appearance much more versus when she was a regular. So, I think you are correct about it probably being the writing which felt very "forced" to me to push her character in certain directions.

 

[Covert Rain]

OK, update. Half a season down and I don't like Capalidi. He is short tempered, lacks compassion and comes off like a crotchety old man. This might be the first time I have liked a companion more than the lead actor playing the Doctor.

This is also probably the least amount of fun I have had in a single season watching the show since it's return. It's a shame because I love Jenna Coleman.