Congrats to Barry Bonds...

[DevilsFan]

Are you kidding? Really - are you joking??

Steroids is banned, and for good reason... Performance enhancers like 'roids or HGH have no place in sports...
However, marijuana and coke - while clearly NOT performance enhancing drugs, are illegal in all 50 states... Professional athletes are not exempt from U.S. law (contrary to what many believe...).

Care to enlighten us why performance enhancing drugs have no place in sports? I'd really like to hear this.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Care to enlighten us why performance enhancing drugs have no place in sports? I'd really like to hear this.

Care to explain why they do?

I'm all for athletes taking vitamins, protien shakes, etc... However, taking chemically engineered/altered drugs, designed to slip past testing is called CHEATING.

 

[Rivercard]

The only people who care about asterisks are nitwit stat geeks like Bill James or armchair athletes who live and die by latest performance of their favorite ballplayer. The rest of us simply don't care.

You care enough to post here.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

People who aren't bogged down by minutia talk about an asterisk for Barry because of performance enhancers.

Funny how those same people don't endorse an asterisk for Willie Mays due to his use of performance enhancers.

 

[DevilsFan]

Care to explain why they do?

I'm all for athletes taking vitamins, protien shakes, etc... However, taking chemically engineered/altered drugs, designed to slip past testing is called CHEATING.

How is it cheating? It was never against the rules of baseball. It was never a banned substance. It's not cheating because every other ballplayer had the same opportunity to take those same substances. That some chose to attain peak performance by taking steroids, HGH, or whatever simply shows they were willing to abide by the risks in order to attain the benefit.

Cortisone injections will f*** you up as well, yet countless athletes take them because it will benefit their performance. Are you opposed to them as well?

 

[Rivercard]

Care to enlighten us why performance enhancing drugs have no place in sports? I'd really like to hear this.

So you have no problem with rampant steroid use in sports. Thank goodness you are in the minority. Do you feel good that young ballplayers feel it necessary to fill up with this junk in order to "compete"?

 

[Rivercard]

Funny how those same people don't endorse an asterisk for Willie Mays due to his use of performance enhancers.

Yeah, It's interesting more isn't made of that. I guess it's too old news now. But if Barry hadn't broken maybe the most cherished record in baseball noone would care about asterisk-izing him either I suppose.

 

[Rivercard]

How is it cheating? It was never against the rules of baseball. It was never a banned substance. It's not cheating because every other ballplayer had the same opportunity to take those same substances. That some chose to attain peak performance by taking steroids, HGH, or whatever simply shows they were willing to abide by the risks in order to attain the benefit.

Cortisone injections will f*** you up as well, yet countless athletes take them because it will benefit their performance. Are you opposed to them as well?

You epitomize everything that is bad about sports.

 

[DevilsFan]

So you have no problem with rampant steroid use in sports. Thank goodness you are in the minority. Do you feel good that young ballplayers feel it necessary to fill up with this junk in order to "compete"?

Nope. No problem at all. What each person chooses to do with their own body is their business. Why is it your business? Everyone makes choices about their lives and many make choices that toe the moral line in order to attain peak performance in their careers. Young criminal attorneys accept that they may allow the guilty to go free or the innocent to be imprisoned. Young salespeople understand their job is to separate people from as much of their money as possible. Do I like it? No. I'd prefer people lived according to a strict moral code. But I cannot force that upon them. Nor can you.

Minors are a different story, of course.

Anyone who plays professional sports is already sacrificing many years of their life by engaging in often-violent behavior anyway. Athletes are willing to accept a shorter life if they can live it to the fullest. Steroids are just another part of that.

 

[DevilsFan]

You epitomize everything that is bad about sports.

I see you didn't make the high-school debate team.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Nope. No problem at all. What each person chooses to do with their own body is their business. Why is it your business? Everyone makes choices about their lives and many make choices that toe the moral line in order to attain peak performance in their careers. Young criminal attorneys accept that they may allow the guilty to go free or the innocent to be imprisoned. Young salespeople understand their job is to separate people from as much of their money as possible. Do I like it? No. I'd prefer people lived according to a strict moral code. But I cannot force that upon them. Nor can you.

Minors are a different story, of course.

Anyone who plays professional sports is already sacrificing many years of their life by engaging in often-violent behavior anyway. Athletes are willing to accept a shorter life if they can live it to the fullest. Steroids are just another part of that.

Are you really proud of the way you "debate"?? While spewing pure crap....
If Bonds wasn't cheating, why then the elaborate steps to conceal that which wasn't cheating??
Sorry dude - you are so wrong here....
Further, I couldn't care any less if it was illegal or not. Logic, morality and ethics are as big a part of sports as any other element. This is why guys like Aaron are so revered. What they did and how they did is completely lost on simpletons like you...

 

[Rivercard]

I see you didn't make the high-school debate team.

Sorry, I don't debate with the intellectually handicapped.

 

[DevilsFan]

Are you really proud of the way you "debate"?? While spewing pure crap....
If Bonds wasn't cheating, why then the elaborate steps to conceal that which wasn't cheating??
Sorry dude - you are so wrong here....
Further, I couldn't care any less if it was illegal or not. Logic, morality and ethics are as big a part of sports as any other element. This is why guys like Aaron are so revered. What they did and how they did is completely lost on simpletons like you...

It's not cheating if it isn't against the rules. If steroids were banned in baseball, I'd agree with you. Taking them in that scenario would be the same as using a corked bat or doctoring the baseball. But it's not the same. Steroids were not banned when Bonds supposedly used them. How can it be cheating to try to gain an advantage that is not outside the boundaries of the rules?

You say I'm spewing crap, but you're the one simply espousing the groupthink view. I asked you a simple question: why is there no place in sports for performance-enhancing drugs? Instead of answering the question, you simply turned around and asked me why there was. I answered you. Players who want to attain peak performance with substances that are not banned are not cheating. They are simply trying to gain an advantage (real or perceived) over their competition.

Now, care to answer my question?

 

[DevilsFan]

Sorry, I don't debate with the intellectually handicapped.

No problem. You had nothing to offer but platitudes anyway.

 

[jjdowney]

It's not cheating if it isn't against the rules. If steroids were banned in baseball, I'd agree with you. Taking them in that scenario would be the same as using a corked bat or doctoring the baseball. But it's not the same. Steroids were not banned when Bonds supposedly used them. How can it be cheating to try to gain an advantage that is not outside the boundaries of the rules?

You say I'm spewing crap, but you're the one simply espousing the groupthink view. I asked you a simple question: why is there no place in sports for performance-enhancing drugs? Instead of answering the question, you simply turned around and asked me why there was. I answered you. Players who want to attain peak performance with substances that are not banned are not cheating. They are simply trying to gain an advantage (real or perceived) over their competition.

Now, care to answer my question?

You say that just because Major League Baseball didn't have a Steroid Policy that it's ok? I am not positive but I am pretty sure that MLB does have a Policy that says something about obeying the laws of the government. If someone breaks a law they are subject to approriate punishment by MLB. For instance, in the NFL Pacman has been suspended for breaking gov't laws even though the NFL rules might not say that you can't drink and drive or whatever.

 

[Brian]

Ever pause to think that the reason steroids weren't "banned" is because they are illegal in the first place?

How far does the banned substance list have to go? Performance enhancers (like Andro) are on the banned list because they are legal but baseball doesn't want any players to have an unfair advantage.

Steroids are illegal to begin with, it goes without saying that they didn't need to be on the list. Apparently some athletes didn't quite get that memo.

 

[Brian]

You say that just because Major League Baseball didm't have a Steroid Policy that it's ok? I am not positive but I am pretty sure that MLB does have a Policy that says something about obeying the laws of the government. If someone breaks a law they are subject to approriate punishment by MLB. For instance, in the NFL Pacman has been suspended for breaking gov't laws even though the NFL rules might not say that you can drink and drive or whatever.

In essence, you beat me to it.

 

[DevilsFan]

Ever pause to think that the reason steroids weren't "banned" is because they are illegal in the first place?

How far does the banned substance list have to go? Performance enhancers (like Andro) are on the banned list because they are legal but baseball doesn't want any players to have an unfair advantage.

Steroids are illegal to begin with, it goes without saying that they didn't need to be on the list. Apparently some athletes didn't quite get that memo.

Aside from the argument that they shouldn't be banned in the first place, why then did MLB feel the need to change the rules to explicitly ban performance-enhancers? If the fact that they were illegal was sufficient to exclude them before, it shouldn't be necessary to spell it out now.

 

[TucsonDevil]

Not looking to argue with anyone, just share my opinion. I am very disappointed with the reaction to this cheater. I don't think Barry Bonds is legit. The record still belongs to Hank Aaron (in my book), and Roger Maris is still the single season leader.

*

 

[Russ Smith]

The only people who care about asterisks are nitwit stat geeks like Bill James or armchair athletes who live and die by latest performance of their favorite ballplayer. The rest of us simply don't care.

if that were true there'd be zero debate about Bonds and ESPN would be
talking about something else.

There are a lot of serious sports fans who care when they find out something was accomplished with help from steroids or the like.

If Lance Armstrong came out tomorrow and said ok I admit it I doped, you don't think people would start talking about wiping away 7 TDF titles or asterisks?

If Pam Anderson revealed her boobs were fake you don't think men would
be up in arms?

 

[jjdowney]

Aside from the argument that they shouldn't be banned in the first place, why then did MLB feel the need to change the rules to explicitly ban performance-enhancers? If the fact that they were illegal was sufficient to exclude them before, it shouldn't be necessary to spell it out now.

Appearantly, some of the players think they are above the law. Secondly, Bud Selig is happy to have all of these records happen while he is the Comish, the only reason he ever banned them, finally, was because he would be run out of the office if he didn't.

 

[Russ Smith]

Yeah, It's interesting more isn't made of that. I guess it's too old news now. But if Barry hadn't broken maybe the most cherished record in baseball noone would care about asterisk-izing him either I suppose.

I'm out of the loop what has Mays admitted to taking, amphetamines?

 

[Rivercard]

why then did MLB feel the need to change the rules to explicitly ban performance-enhancers? If the fact that they were illegal was sufficient to exclude them before, it shouldn't be necessary to spell it out now.

Mostly because of public outcry and the problem becoming so rampant as to be destroying the very fabric of the game. The integrity of baseball reached a crisis point and something had to be done. Baseball tried to sweep this under the rug for years but eventually had address the issue.

 

[Rivercard]

I'm out of the loop what has Mays admitted to taking, amphetamines?

Yep.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Are you kidding? Really - are you joking??

Steroids is banned, and for good reason... Performance enhancers like 'roids or HGH have no place in sports...
However, marijuana and coke - while clearly NOT performance enhancing drugs, are illegal in all 50 states... Professional athletes are not exempt from U.S. law (contrary to what many believe...).

In short, there is no logical comparison to be made between roids and coke/marijuana... none...
Bonds took roids for the sole purpose of trying to cheat, trying to gain an unfair advantage...
People/athletes take coke/marijuana for a myriad of reasons, however one of which is NOT to gain an unfair advantage or to cheat...

So what you are saying is that you want to change what you initially said, right?