Cardinals Head Coaching Candidates 2023

oaken1

Stone Cold
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2004
Posts
13,527
Reaction score
7,601
Location
Modesto, California
I understand what your saying about next year being kinda a wasted season. But if it’s Payton, it’s for the long haul not just next season. It’s also going to take a season to get this mess cleaned up and pointing forward.

But I don’t give up a first round pick for a coach unless we’re on the doorstep of a superbowl. Send them a few future mid round picks tops.
see, thats the thing. Payton is right now, not long haul... the dude is 60 years old.

a guy like Demeco Ryans is long haul, he is young...and if he works out he could be our HC for twenty years. I really think thats what Mike was trying to do with kliff. These perpetually winning franchises almost always have a long term coach... I mean, true...long term coaches usually get that way because they have franchise QB;s and they win... but they establish your identity, provide consistency... it is unrealistic however to expect payton to be on the sidelines as long as Pete Carroll... we need a guy to create and personify the Cardinal way....and an old guy cant do that....
 
OP
OP
Solar7

Solar7

Go Suns
Joined
May 18, 2002
Posts
10,436
Reaction score
10,235
Location
Las Vegas, NV
So we should give up a high pick so fans are happier but still have a losing season? How does that make long term sense? Is going 7-10 with Payton worth losing a pick over going 5-12 with someone else?

I doubt we see Kyler before game 6 and nothing like himself until game 10. Fans should already be resetting their expectations for next year.
I'm apprehensive about giving up too much for Payton, but this is really misguided thinking. Right now, our franchise is demoralized, but we have a new OC, and plenty of opportunity to begin moving things forward. Payton's likely to have more appealing options next year, like potentially the Chargers. When his compensation "goes down," there are more teams who can make an entry into getting him here.

Not to mention, it'd be a really terrible look to end up in another Wilks-esque situation with a one-and-done. Not only would it help to push Payton away, it would push away most of our backup options next year around. Especially if Kyler comes back and looks like a complete mess.

Let's revamp everything right now with a vision forward. At least something cohesive, even if imperfect.
 
OP
OP
Solar7

Solar7

Go Suns
Joined
May 18, 2002
Posts
10,436
Reaction score
10,235
Location
Las Vegas, NV
xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

Some Broncos writers are disputing this report, so take it for what it is.
I've pretty much given up on Demeco, so unless it's Payton, I'd love for that domino to fall and leave us with the remainder.

I don't want to be first (unless it were Payton), but I don't want to be last.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
15,570
Reaction score
24,417
Location
UK
Maybe that goes for you too. If the Cards does end up giving high draft capital for Sean Payton, obviously they think he will deliver a winning season - and probably playoff season - right away. I don't know what you base the pessimism on, but mr. Bidwill, Ossenfort, and everyone else can just as easily be correct.

Sure, they COULD, but the odds are low. It's could bump into Meghan Payton and she dumps her fiance and we have a wild, dirty weekend together but it's not likely.

We're likely to lose Kyler for at least 6 games and for him to be diminished for a further 4+. Combine that with the whole team having to learn a new defense and offense and adjust to new coaches. Plus a tough division. Niners are great, Rams will get healthy and be much better and the Seahawks made the playoffs and have good draft capital and cap space to improve more.

All in all I'd say a 5% chance we make the playoffs. 20% chance we go .500 or better.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
15,570
Reaction score
24,417
Location
UK
I'm apprehensive about giving up too much for Payton, but this is really misguided thinking. Right now, our franchise is demoralized, but we have a new OC, and plenty of opportunity to begin moving things forward. Payton's likely to have more appealing options next year, like potentially the Chargers. When his compensation "goes down," there are more teams who can make an entry into getting him here.

Not to mention, it'd be a really terrible look to end up in another Wilks-esque situation with a one-and-done. Not only would it help to push Payton away, it would push away most of our backup options next year around. Especially if Kyler comes back and looks like a complete mess.

Let's revamp everything right now with a vision forward. At least something cohesive, even if imperfect.

I don't think this is true. Jag's sucked for years. Picked 1st two years on the bounce and 9th and 7th the 2 years before. Fired Urban Meyer before he completed a season and still attracted a super bowl winning head coach.

I think HC's pick teams like men pick girlfriends. If they look attractive right now, they aren't really thinking about anything that went on with them before.
 

Minski

Hall of Famer
Joined
Aug 25, 2017
Posts
1,687
Reaction score
2,831
Location
Gloucester, UK
Sure, they COULD, but the odds are low. It's could bump into Meghan Payton and she dumps her fiance and we have a wild, dirty weekend together but it's not likely.

We're likely to lose Kyler for at least 6 games and for him to be diminished for a further 4+. Combine that with the whole team having to learn a new defense and offense and adjust to new coaches. Plus a tough division. Niners are great, Rams will get healthy and be much better and the Seahawks made the playoffs and have good draft capital and cap space to improve more.

All in all I'd say a 5% chance we make the playoffs. 20% chance we go .500 or better.

No reason to punt on 2023 at all. This is the start of a culture change, you play hard and play to win at all times. We need to also develop players and you do that by playing to the best of your ability. All this we wont have Kyler for 6 games is hogwash. No-one knows how long we will be without Kyler, or even without him at all.
 

Gandhi

Hall of Famer
Joined
Feb 17, 2007
Posts
1,624
Reaction score
1,832
Location
Denmark
Sure, they COULD, but the odds are low. It's could bump into Meghan Payton and she dumps her fiance and we have a wild, dirty weekend together but it's not likely.
Every year there are team that have the odds against them that end up being succesful. History is filled with examples. Your view is perfectly fair, but I must say that I find it very surprising to sell the season already.
All in all I'd say a 5% chance we make the playoffs. 20% chance we go .500 or better.
It's right there in the text. :) You say. History shows that the odds are better than that.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
15,570
Reaction score
24,417
Location
UK
No reason to punt on 2023 at all. This is the start of a culture change, you play hard and play to win at all times. We need to also develop players and you do that by playing to the best of your ability. All this we wont have Kyler for 6 games is hogwash. No-one knows how long we will be without Kyler, or even without him at all.

Nobody said we should punt on next season. I said it's likely to be a wash, the odds are most definately against it, in which case it makes no business sense to give a 1st for Payton now vs, say, a 4th the year after.

Sure, Kyler might not be out 6 games, but he's likely to be. OBJ had ACL surgery last year 6 weeks later than Kyler this year and missed the whole season.

I think it's likely that Kyler is training and throwing before the season starts but I think with such a big contract on the line they won't want to RG3 him and they will be cautious with his return considering his need for mobility.

Dennis Gardeck had his ACL surgery a year ago a week later than Kyler and played a little in week 4 of 2021 but didn't return to meaningful playing time until week 6 and even then said he didn't feel all the way back until the 2022 season. And he's a Pinto compared to Murray's Ferrari.

I just don't see the Cards rushing him back until he's mentally and physically 100%.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
15,570
Reaction score
24,417
Location
UK
Every year there are team that have the odds against them that end up being succesful. History is filled with examples. Your view is perfectly fair, but I must say that I find it very surprising to sell the season already.

It's right there in the text. :) You say. History shows that the odds are better than that.

Well yeah, everything I say are things I say.

If you don't think the odds are against us being good next year I'm not sure what to say. There is a reason the bookies have us with the worst SB odds and it's because injured QB, coaching upheaval and all the roster turnover that comes with it says the odds are against us.

If I said to you let's be €100 on if we have a winning or losing season and I'll take losing would you fancy seeing your €100 again?
 

Proximo

ASFN Addict
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Posts
8,545
Reaction score
5,752
Nobody said we should punt on next season. I said it's likely to be a wash, the odds are most definately against it, in which case it makes no business sense to give a 1st for Payton now vs, say, a 4th the year after.

Sure, Kyler might not be out 6 games, but he's likely to be. OBJ had ACL surgery last year 6 weeks later than Kyler this year and missed the whole season.

I think it's likely that Kyler is training and throwing before the season starts but I think with such a big contract on the line they won't want to RG3 him and they will be cautious with his return considering his need for mobility.

Dennis Gardeck had his ACL surgery a year ago a week later than Kyler and played a little in week 4 of 2021 but didn't return to meaningful playing time until week 6 and even then said he didn't feel all the way back until the 2022 season. And he's a Pinto compared to Murray's Ferrari.

I just don't see the Cards rushing him back until he's mentally and physically 100%.
I will just point out Kyler does not have to move very much to play QB, so comparing him to Gardeck is not a great comparison IMO.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
15,570
Reaction score
24,417
Location
UK
I will just point out Kyler does not have to move very much to play QB, so comparing him to Gardeck is not a great comparison IMO.

The QB that never steps up into the pocket and runs around at the first whiff of even potential pressure? The one who's whole career has been built on using his legs?

You don't put him out unless he can run. Because that instinct will still be there and he will set off without thinking twice.
 

phillycard

ASFN Addict
Joined
Aug 22, 2003
Posts
6,306
Reaction score
2,108
Location
The 215
I don't trust them Harry. It's hard to quantify but I feel like the offense AND defense of the eagles succeeds despite them. I don't know if they are capable of building a team, coaching them up and handling all that comes with being a head coach. Maybe because I'm here and have seen them operate up close and personal. I'd be remiss if I didn't say that 99% of my eagles crew here feel the same to varying degrees.
 

Gandhi

Hall of Famer
Joined
Feb 17, 2007
Posts
1,624
Reaction score
1,832
Location
Denmark
Well yeah, everything I say are things I say.

Yes, so when you state different aspect as facts, you are actually wrong. :) No, sorry, it is just a pet peeves of mine.

If you don't think the odds are against us being good next year I'm not sure what to say. There is a reason the bookies have us with the worst SB odds and it's because injured QB, coaching upheaval and all the roster turnover that comes with it says the odds are against us.

I have not said that the odds are not against the Cards. I have said that your view are too pessimistic, in my eyes, and history tells us that it is absolutely possible to make a quick turnaround.

If I said to you let's be €100 on if we have a winning or losing season and I'll take losing would you fancy seeing your €100 again?

I don't know, but I would certainly not rule it out.
 

bankybruce

All In!
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2003
Posts
19,969
Reaction score
8,134
Location
Portland, OR
I will just point out Kyler does not have to move very much to play QB, so comparing him to Gardeck is not a great comparison IMO.
I'll also point out that comparing any player to player for ACL recovery is hard. There are too many factors involved. Look at AP and how fast he came back while being better than ever. It's different for everyone since it depends on like 40 things.
 

Latest posts

Staff online

Forum statistics

Threads
498,378
Posts
4,935,351
Members
6,182
Latest member
Rallemuld
Top