Cardinal decisions

[Veer]

Speculation on your part..IF The FO didn`t think much of Rosen then they sure as hell wouldn`t have traded for him.The FO could have decided on a another Qb in RD 2-3 to develop instead of trading for Rosen.Really reaching on your part.I don`t think Sk would trade for Rosen without having a good opinion as one of the top QBs.A consolation prize 1st round Qb that the FO didn`t have a high opinion of? It don`t wash.

We botched it big-time to find a future QB during the Palmer era. Understandable since we were contenders, but the smart move all along would've been to find a Palmer successor in the 2017 draft, not even knowing that Mahomes and Watson will look great. We were too passive to get either of the two. The 2018 draft was more about the dire need of drafting a QB. With damaged goods Bradford on a 1 year deal it was clear we absolutely needed a QB, much more than during the 2017 draft when we still had Palmer and in theory a contending roster. Rosen, the last legit 1st round QB prospect, would've been picked away right in front of us just like Mahomes/Watson, if not for us trading up. Since there wasn't any competition for Rosen and the Raiders felt they would get their guy at #15 as well, the price was ultimately really cheap. Good luck selling tickets going into the season with Bradford and without a promising rookie behind him, as I think Mason Rudolph and Lauletta were the next QBs selected at the turn of round 3/4. The very Sam Bradford who was the punching bag to our defense for many years and couldn't even walk straight the last time he entered a football field for the Vikings. This 3rd round pick sacrified for Rosen was imo more about pleasing the fan base and selling seats than it was about believing in Rosen as a true franchise QB. The Chiefs believed in Mahomes. They were contenders already at the time they sacrified a future 1st round pick to draft him. The Browns believed in Mayfield and picked him 1st overall, despite holding the 4th overall pick as well as having other QB options in the draft, including that they probably could have gotten either Mayfield or Darnold at #4.

 

[BW52]

We botched it big-time to find a future QB during the Palmer era. Understandable since we were contenders, but the smart move all along would've been to find a Palmer successor in the 2017 draft, not even knowing that Mahomes and Watson will look great. We were too passive to get either of the two. The 2018 draft was more about the dire need of drafting a QB. With damaged goods Bradford on a 1 year deal it was clear we absolutely needed a QB, much more than during the 2017 draft when we still had Palmer and in theory a contending roster. Rosen, the last legit 1st round QB prospect, would've been picked away right in front of us just like Mahomes/Watson, if not for us trading up. Since there wasn't any competition for Rosen and the Raiders felt they would get their guy at #15 as well, the price was ultimately really cheap. Good luck selling tickets going into the season with Bradford and without a promising rookie behind him, as I think Mason Rudolph and Lauletta were the next QBs selected at the turn of round 3/4. The very Sam Bradford who was the punching bag to our defense for many years and couldn't even walk straight the last time he entered a football field for the Vikings. This 3rd round pick sacrified for Rosen was imo more about pleasing the fan base and selling seats than it was about believing in Rosen as a true franchise QB. The Chiefs believed in Mahomes. They were contenders already at the time they sacrified a future 1st round pick to draft him. The Browns believed in Mayfield and picked him 1st overall, despite holding the 4th overall pick as well as having other QB options in the draft, including that they probably could have gotten either Mayfield or Darnold at #4.

Agree about failing to find a legit QBOF during Palmers era.Its like the FO thought Palmer would last forever and didn`t look ahead past the end of their nose.Shortsighted planning.

 

[TJ]

Can we just all agree that this is Matt Leinart's fault for not panning out as the QBoF? He'd be entering Year 14 with us this season.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

really?

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/josh-rosen?id=32462018-0002-5600-59bd-f150d938ca3e



https://www.nfl.com/prospects/kyler-murray?id=32194d55-5267-0413-8d36-a5c3fd781aa0

Keim said prior to combine that they had a higher grade on Rosen than Murray.

 

[Veer]

Keim said prior to combine that they had a higher grade on Rosen than Murray.

Keim is also on record saying that anything that's said in the months leading up to the draft is ********

 

[football karma]

If the organization feels that Rosen is Andy Dalton 2.0 then what the hell is wrong with that?

in his 8 year career, Dalton has been top 12 in the NFL (why 12? 12 teams make the playoffs) in passer rating exactly 1 time (2015) -- a great 2015 year when he was 2nd overall

He has also been in the bottom 5 twice, and floating around NFL midpoint the remainder. Dalton has had above average offensive talent around him during that span.

For the most important position on the field, you are giving up on winning a Superbowl if you accept that as good enough.

 

[Cardiac]

I agree. 2018 will go down as a lost year. One of the darkest in cardinals history. And that, my friend, is saying something.

That is so true it's down right depressing so I give all of us who are still posting and rooting for the Cards a big atta boy high five.

The positive for me is that Michael said okay guys we stepped in a big pile of horse crap in 2018 but immediately started scraping it off his boots and he and SK have done a lot to get the boots clean and odor free.

The biggest discussion for us and decision for the front office is Rosen the last piece to get the boots completely clean.

What I want to see happen is the Cards trade down and acquire a slew of draft picks and fix several holes on the team. QB is one of those holes IMO but if KK & SK think KM is that special then they have to take him.

 

[BW52]

in his 8 year career, Dalton has been top 12 in the NFL (why 12? 12 teams make the playoffs) in passer rating exactly 1 time (2015) -- a great 2015 year when he was 2nd overall

He has also been in the bottom 5 twice, and floating around NFL midpoint the remainder. Dalton has had above average offensive talent around him during that span.

For the most important position on the field, you are giving up on winning a Superbowl if you accept that as good enough.

he also has a 67-50 career record as a starting QB.Not great by any means but a solid workmanlike QB.Beats the hell out of having Sam Bradford,Stanton,Barkley,Gabbert etc;

 

[slanidrac16]

It’s funny nobody has brought up the 49ers taking Murray and trading garrapolo. If Murray is this generational talent wouldn’t they be stupid not to take him?

 

[TheCardFan]

If the Cards trade Rosen after one season it shows complete failure by the Front office.

Depends on how it works out. Every team wants to get better at every position every year. QB is the most important position period. The Cardinals did what was best for them last year...drafting Rosen. This year they may have the opportunity to significantly improve the position. That is debatable of course and my hope is that KK 100% believes in Rosen and we keep him. However, if he truly believes that Murray take this team to a much higher level, then I am ok with making that change. Time will tell if it was a good decision or a failure.

I disagree. If Murray grades out just 10% higher than Rosen, it's no question that we have to go with Murray.

I would say the difference is going to have to be much higher than that. 10% is not enough IMO to make the switch. WAR might be a better measurement than %. If Rosen has a WAR of 2 games, Murray would have to be about 4 games (WAR of 6 or more) or better to justify the move. 1 or 2 games is meh.

 

[football karma]

he also has a 67-50 career record as a starting QB.Not great by any means but a solid workmanlike QB.Beats the hell out of having Sam Bradford,Stanton,Barkley,Gabbert etc;

yes. Average is better than terrible. going 9-7 ( Dalton's winning %) makes for getting into the playoffs probably less than half the time, and likely not going very far when you do. There is worse football to be a fan of --

I want more upside than that

 

[Veer]

It’s funny nobody has brought up the 49ers taking Murray and trading garrapolo. If Murray is this generational talent wouldn’t they be stupid not to take him?

Absolutely. I've made this point twice and I think it did came through as sarcastic, while I meant it for real!

Remember Jimmy Garopolo suffered a torn ACL and isn't young anymore. He cost them a 2nd round pick, most guarantees are already paid. On the flip side, Murray's mobility would make him a perfect fit in Shanny's play action rollout offense.

 

[overseascardfan]

It’s funny nobody has brought up the 49ers taking Murray and trading garrapolo. If Murray is this generational talent wouldn’t they be stupid not to take him?

I agree. If the Raiders end up at #1 they most likely are taking Bosa, if rumors are correct that Gruden isn’t long for Carr then why aren’t there rumors tying them to Murray either?

 

[kerouac9]

On the trade value of Rosen: as a (more) known quantity with one less cost-controlled year on his deal, he's less valuable in 2019 than he was in 2018. No one is giving up a pick in the top half of the first round for him, because Dwayne Haskins has more value because he didn't have an execrable rookie season and he'll have a full 5 cost-controlled years.

Now, if there's a perception that there's a fire sale on Rosen, I don't think you can get him for more than a mid-second round pick. I don't know if you can wait until draft day, because no one thinks you're going to go into the season with both.

Rosen probably has more value, even slightly depreciated, than a team is going to get in a QB in picks 20-32. San Diego and New England are the best candidates to trade for Rosen at that value.